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“Would you explain it to me like I’m five? What is your contention?
That the refs are biased against us personally?
Are they biased against any team not Carolina and Duke?
Or is your position they are biased for Carolina and Duke?”
The reason for the horrible and biased officiating is unknown to me. Because it is unknown does not make it untrue. That is a David Glenn type of argument: intent can’t be proven and wild-eyed conspiracy theories are injected to discredited the accuser. But there it is, plain as day.
Instead of focusing right now on why, i prefer to see it as it is. You may not like it; but that officiating was as bad and one-sided as it can be. Previous claims of poor officiating do not make it less so.
The reason for the horrible and biased officiating is unknown to me. Because it is unknown does not make it untrue.
I’m trying to establish the basics here. Not even why there is bias yet, but who the bias is for and against.
I readily admit that looking at raw numbers, it looks kinda questionable. But if I know that, Coach Gottfried, Debbie Yow, John Clougherty, John Swofford et. al. have to know that as well.
Are other teams not examining film and stats looking for bias? We’re a 15 team conference. Is it seriously credible to think that 13 teams would allow a clear, provable bias in favor of two or three teams? Is it credible to believe that the other 13 institutions are powerless to affect it?
I readily admit that looking at raw numbers, it looks kinda questionable. But if I know that, Coach Gottfried, Debbie Yow, John Clougherty, John Swofford et. al. have to know that as well.
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So if you “readily admit the numbers look questionable” why do you lose your mind when anyone says the refs suck?
I think it is close enough to the line that a clear and credible argument can’t be made (the standard for bias would be extremely high). However, if we were a top team with a lot more attention and a title on the line, it would get heavy scrutiny. Because we don’t matter, no one besides our school and administration cares. That’s my best guess. It may not be bias and may just be incompetence. The reasons don’t matter. It’s there, plain as day.
However, far too many at crucial times have gone against us. Last night was predictable. When you see that pattern emerge, it’s too hard to deny.
I don’t like whining after losses, and i have only so much energy to keep arguing this point. Indifference is my next move.
^What about the other patterns? As in how we play? What’s to be made of those? Nada? I’ve been called “intellectually dishonest” because I consider what our players and coaches might improve upon–not perfect, mind you–so that they might sharpen their execution, and change an outcome by becoming less dependent on “perfect” refereeing. Or is it fair, or consistent refereeing that we’re after? Or is there a difference?
So if you “readily admit the numbers look questionable” why do you lose your mind when anyone says the refs suck?
Is there some kind of filter between you and me?
At what point did I, “lose my mind” when someone said the refs suck?
My contention all along has been that the refs have made bad calls. My overall point has been, the refs are going to be varying degrees of imperfect, and that we [the team] would be best served by improving as a team. If we were 10% better, none of this would even be an issue.
The implication is the refs are either biased against NC State men’s basketball, or they are biased for…somebody.
My questions are, if it is truly a bias for a subset of teams, why can other teams make significant strides when we cannot? I keep forgetting I can’t use personal pronouns when referencing the basketball team. Sorry. And why do the remaining teams not raise hell?
Alternately, if the bias is against us specifically, sorry, NC State men’s basketball, would it not seem prudent for teams that are not us, crap sorry, NC State men’s basketball, to address that disturbing precedent?
^That would make sense. But then again, this goes all the way to the top. Obama, dude. Royally screwing America’ and Statefans everywhere.
^What about the other patterns? As in how we play? What’s to be made of those? Nada? I’ve been called “intellectually dishonest” because I consider what our players and coaches might improve upon–not perfect, mind you–so that they might sharpen their execution, and change an outcome by becoming less dependent on “perfect” refereeing. Or is it fair, or consistent refereeing that we’re after? Or is there a difference?
I have said several times we blew some opportunitities. That does not mean the refs did not impact the game nor does it mean we are “whining” when we call them out on it.
“What about the other patterns? As in how we play? ”
Completely agree. This is all our team can control. However that can coexist with fans calling out horrible officiating that has gone against us in key games since MG took over.
Whiteshoes, I have it on good authority that it goes even higher than that.
The first meeting of the bilderberg society was in 1954. Right after the founding of the ACC. It goes ALL THE WAY TO THE TOP MAN!
The topic of the first meeting that fateful day in the Netherlands was led by one Frank McGuire and was titled “What to do about the NC State problem”.
I’ve got an idea. Let’s pool our resources and sponsor an NC State senior design group to study trends in refereeing.
The NBA showed that all it takes is one well researched article to practically eliminate bias.
Whiteshoes, I have it on good authority that it goes even higher than that.
It’s the lizard people.
BTW, I’m wondering. People still watch basketball? I’ve watched a grand total of 30 minutes in the past 3 years.
It has become a horrible game and I can’t sit through one anymore.
The implication is the refs are either biased against NC State men’s basketball, or they are biased for…somebody.
My questions are, if it is truly a bias for a subset of teams, why can other teams make significant strides when we cannot? I keep forgetting I can’t use personal pronouns when referencing the basketball team. Sorry. And why do the remaining teams not raise hell?Like I said earlier, the head of the ACC officials has stated they study tendencies and those tendencies show that UNC does not foul much. How is that not a bias?
As to losing your mind, I was giving you the benefit of the doubt as I assumed someone in thier right mind would not call someone they are having a discussion with irrational and inflamatory but if I am wrong I apologize.
As to losing your mind, I was giving you the benefit of the doubt as I assumed someone in thier right mind would not call someone they are having a discussion with irrational and inflamatory but if I am wrong I apologize.
Please note this was after you had attacked me repeatedly.
This particular picture is from the Mizzou game, but they are there every game.
Damn you powerade.
I wonder if FSU uses Gatorade or some other sports drink.
As to losing your mind, I was giving you the benefit of the doubt as I assumed someone in thier right mind would not call someone they are having a discussion with irrational and inflamatory but if I am wrong I apologize.
Please note this was after you had attacked me repeatedly.
I did not realize I had attacked you. Please show me what I said so I can apologize for it.
Given what Clougherty has openly admitted, one has to wonder what he hasn’t.
If I began speculating about that then I would truly be in conspiracy mode. All I have stated is what Clougherty has actually admitted to. I am not sure why other posters want to call that conspiracy when it is straight from the horses mouth. I am not dealing in subjective reasoning but actuals words from the refs boss.
I did not realize I had attacked you. Please show me what I said so I can apologize for it.
You said you are an alumnus? I have to admit I figured you were still at State given your seeming inability to argue without calling someone stupid.
I did not realize you were part of the team. I thought we as fans were discussing the game. My bad.
You and I cannot control the team so we should not bother about discussing them. That is the logical extension of your absurd argument.
His opinion is every bit as valid as yours and I would have thought more than mine given how much you hate my opinions. But it seems you just ignore anyone who disagrees with you.
These aren’t directed at me, but…
Wah wah,
Somebody dares to disagree with the great cowdog.Either you or cow dog. It is so predictable.
Whatever. You win. The refs are awesome and State sucks.
That seems to be what you want.I don’t feel like going back farther than a page in your post history.
Please note this was after you had attacked me repeatedly.
So are you saying I did not “attack you repeatedly” or that I did?
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