2007.03.20_ Big Dose of Bytes

The last week or so has been very good for NC State. We’ve blogged a ton of items and hope that you will take some time to scroll through the blog and make sure that you haven’t missed anything that of interest. Just this weekend we had almost a dozen entries that looked forward and looked back.

Even though we have been quite busy, a lot of comments/observations have fallen through the cracks. The following are some quick bytes that haven’t been shared since the ACC Tournament:

* Much is being made about the ACC’s poor performance in the NCAA Tournament. Although I think the ACC was the most competitive and deepest conference in America (as highlighted by the RPI), the conference’s failure to advance more than one program into the sweet sixteen does not surprise me. We were very deep this season, but it was never a secret that we lacked the “star power” at the top of the league to advance a lot of teams deep into the tournament.

* Despite the league’s struggles this season, you can always turn to history boost the ego. Dave Glenn logged an entry focused on the ACC’s dominance of the modern tournament history that will make you feel better. Just a couple to wet your whistle:

The ACC’s all-time NCAA Tournament winning percentage (.674) is significantly better than any other conference. The Big East (.625) is second, the Big Ten (.621) third and the Pac-10 (.609) fourth. Nobody else is over 60 percent.

Since 1980, when the NCAA lifted its limits on the number of participants per conference, the ACC has had just one losing season in NCAA Tournament play (5-6 in 1987) and has a success rate over 66 percent. Again, nobody else is close.

Since the field expanded to 64 teams in 1985, the ACC has had 111 teams in the NCAA Tournament, about the same as the Big East (116). Yet the ACC has 221 wins in that span — 35 more than the Big East. The Big Ten has had 124 participants since 1985 yet has 42 fewer wins. The SEC, with 110 participants, has 61 fewer wins. The Pac-10 has less than half as many NCAA wins as the ACC in the modern era. Since the Big 12 formed in 1996, it trails the ACC 96-72.

The ACC has won three of the last six (50 percent) national championships, with three different teams — Duke in 2001, Maryland in 2002, and North Carolina in 2005. The league also has won six of the last 16 (37.5 percent) NCAA titles, and eight of the last 25 (32 percent).

* UNC-CH had to play ABOVE their normal game to beat us in the Atlantic Coast Conference Championship. That’s a compliment, folks.

* The selection of Brendan Wright over Brandon Costner as the ACC Tournament’s MVP was ridiculous. I realize to the victor goes the spoils, except that I remember in 1983 when NC State won the NCAA title and yet Akeem was the Final 4 MVP. I guess only NC State gets a shaft like that.

* It was interesting to hear that many, many VT fans were pulling for UNC in the ACC. Tells you that they are indeed a newcomer and don’t understand basketball in their new league. I had heard that many VT folks were ‘VT football fans but UNC basketball fans’ – guess that was true.

* If I could have chosen the (non-Big Four) team for NC State to sweep this season then it would have been Virginia Tech. As I said in a comment on February 1st:

As likable as Seth Greenburg is, his propensity to publicly comment on NC State’s coaching situation (Herb Sendek) last year really rubbed me the wrong way. He talked A LOT on Fox Sports radio, etc about the situation in Raleigh and was too critical of Wolfpackers for my liking. IMHO, he would have been better served to have kept his mouth shut. In 2005, Greenberg defeated a deep and experienced Wolfpack coached Herb Sendek in their first battle in Cassell Coliseum. In 2007, Greenberg lost a thin and inexperienced Wolfpack team coached by Sidney Lowe. I guess I don’t blame him for loving Sendek so much.

* One of the biggest winners of the last two weeks has been Dennis Horner. The kid is making some clutch shots and is learning how to create his own shot more easily in the flow of the offense. Costner is a given, but Horner will be a critical role player over the next few years.

* The other big winner is obviously Sidney Lowe. Some are comparing Sid’s run to Herb’s in 1997 in believe that this will put some additional pressure on Sidney to produce better results more quickly. That may be true, but I also think that Sidney is more prepared to elevate the program more quickly because of his recruiting philosophy differs from Sendek’s. In addition to his communication style with players and his inability to coach offense, Sendek struggled for his next 4 years because he effectively ignored North Carolina High School talent and opted to cash his ‘rising star’ chips on kids with no local ties like Adam Harrington. When something goes wrong for kids like these, their first instinct is to transfer as they have nothing binding them to the area or the school. This created significant turmoil and trouble in Sendek’s tenure. Coach Lowe has already shown that NC kids are an important cog in his philosophy (Johnny Thomas, CJ Williams, and even Tracy Smith). Te stability that these kids will create in addition to huge marketing boost fromt he last couple of weeks will serve Sidney well.

* Sidney became THE story over the last few weeks, which is much different than when Herb did this in 1997. College coaches are stars, they are mega-stars when they win big (Roy, K). Lowe has elevated himself in the national media tremendously over the past 4 days. His exposure and recognition factors have grown exponentionally – its not a Amex (K) or Coke (Roy) commercial, but the red jacket and Sid Lowe scored major points in the visibility factor.

* That will help tremendously in recruiting. We arent going to be stealing players from Roy and K, but many of those will at least look at Sid, and I think he’s already elevated himself to the #3 or #4 in the ACC in terms of visibility.

* Its funny, Gary Walters talked about the unbalanced Big 12 schedule on why Texas Tech got into the NCAA over K-State. I don’t give a shit about either team, but did the committee look at UVA’s unbalanced ACC schedule when they gave them a 4 seed despite their RPI that indicated they would be somehere around an 8 or 9 seed? They had the EASIEST schedule within the ACC. They completely folded down the stretch, losing to Miami, Wake and NC State in 3 of their last 4 games. (All 100+ RPI teams). Yet, they get a 4 seed? With an RPI if 52?

* Piece of advice – if you use a computer program (Yahoo, ESPN, etc) to track your NCAA Tournament brackets, ALWAYS re-check to make sure that your edits/changes have been saved properly. I made some changes to be bracket in SFN’s Yahoo Group that ultimately did not save. Of course, most of the changes would have been positive for me and would have put me tied for first place. Oh well.

* F- Wes Miller and Ty Lawson

* The ACC’s poor performance in the NCAA will hurt all of our checkbooks in the coming years. This is a GREAT article explaining he NCAA’s impact on ACC finances.

* Of course, what would a game day be without Section Six’s preview?

There is a certain amount of comfort that comes with playing West Virginia, comfort that is derived from this fact: the Mountaineers suck at rebounding just as much as we do. It’s like finding a familiar face in a foreign town. “Boy am I glad to see you!”

Those other teams, they’re tough. But not you, sweet, sweet West Virginia. Not you. You kindly offer opponents their missed shots while keeping none of your own for yourself.

When we played WVU back in early December, we had one of our best offensive rebounding performances of the season, grabbing 37% of our misses. Mountaineer opponents have posted an OR% over 40.0 eleven times this season (Wolfpack opponents have done it seven times). West Virginia has at least managed some improvement at the offensive end, upping its OR% from 21.3% to 30.4% this season. That’s still terrible, but it’s a step up from inept (and it’s better than our OR%).

With the two teams shooting and rebounding about the same in the first meeting, turnovers meant the difference. NC State turned the ball over 17 times (nine of those were Gavin’s) while WVU gave it away seven times

06-07 Basketball General

200 Responses to 2007.03.20_ Big Dose of Bytes

  1. noah 03/20/2007 at 9:42 AM #

    Choppack, Monroe was class of 1987. Rogers and Bradley were class of 1990. They all played in the tournament, but in different years.

    Monroe was a HUGE recruit for us though. Top 10 player.

    The class of 1987 was potentially V’s best. Monroe, Corchiani, Sean Green and Byron Tucker. All top 100 players and all of them had great college careers. Had those four stayed together, they would have won a national title.

    Those four plus Chucky Brown and Brian Howard in 1989 would have been as athletic and talented as that Illinois team with Kendall Gill and Nick Anderson. Those four in 1991 as seniors would have been a monster team.

  2. LRM 03/20/2007 at 9:45 AM #

    1) All Horner did this season was continue to improve as the season went on. He reminds me of Gugs in that regard. I like Horner a lot.

    2) College recruiting has taken on a life of its own — it’s now bigger than the game itself. I’m old school, I reckon, but I still think good coaching and hard work wins ball games. Obviously, you need talented players (that are willing to work hard), but even Kevin Durant isn’t playing in a Final 4 this year. For every Hodge there’s a Wilkins, for every Simms a Rivers. The fact is, we can’t recruit EVERY great high school football or basketball player in the area, more less nationally, but yet every time a senior at VCU hits a game-winner we question why he wasn’t recruited (that whole Friedgen-Slaton scenario). I just don’t get the fascination, personally.

  3. skywalkerdt 03/20/2007 at 9:47 AM #

    the fact that of sendek’s last recruiting class horner was the only one to stay true has turned into a good thing. Despite the lack of depth this state group has what can only be thought of as a successful year (maybe ncaa’s were atsur healthy all year) and it has allowed open scholarships for sidney to bring in his kind of guys instead of filling those spaces with sendek style interchangeable parts

  4. chris92heel 03/20/2007 at 9:50 AM #

    I think UNC has the best recruiter in the game going for us – unlike most coaches, he actually LIKES it.

    That said, Sidney Lowes strikes me as a lot like Roy – enjoys getting out and seeing players and talking to them and their families. He’s obviously personable. Right now, he’s not going to be able to go out to California and compete with Roy for top 10 recruits, but he certainly shouldn’t back down for any recruit in the ACC area.

  5. redfred2 03/20/2007 at 9:52 AM #

    Thanks noah, good stuff.

    You kinda shut me up with that post. I guess the thing that riled me was the constant mention of David Thompson’s name being linked almost solely to the word “probation” whenever it was mentioned in the press. There were other infractions, as your post has shown, but it seemed that the media, to me anyway, wanted to taint Thompson’s playing days and say that NCSU had done something shady in his recruitment. And therefore, NCSU didn’t really deserve the title that was achieved while he was there.

    Thanks for shedding some light on that noah.

  6. noah 03/20/2007 at 9:52 AM #

    College recruiting has ALWAYS been huge. Having better players than the other guy is an oustanding strategy for success. 🙂

    It’s just there’s far more attention on it today than there was 20 years ago. Twenty years ago, there were about three people covering recruiting. Now, there’s several thousand.

  7. skywalkerdt 03/20/2007 at 9:52 AM #

    redfred2- i’ll tell you this the only thing state really did wrong in the valvano era was to name him head men’s basketball coach and athletic director. no one man can do both of those jobs properly at the same time, NOT EVEN V

  8. skywalkerdt 03/20/2007 at 9:57 AM #

    if dt ever did anything wrong it was to be an innocent 18y/o kid from tiny shelby, nc who didn’t know any better. look at my name i obviously respect the man, i’ve met him several times and heard his stories of everything he went through in the nba, you can’t help but love and respect david thompson when you’ve heard him tell of what he went throgh and to then come out of it the man he is now.

  9. CedarGroveWolf 03/20/2007 at 9:58 AM #

    “NCSU is NOT second class to those “schools” but as long as that attitude is taken it sure will look that way”

    never said NCSU is 2nd class. NCSU should be able to recruit with anyone. unc & duke will get who they want most of the time since they are the top 2 programs in the country with the 2 most famous coaches.

  10. skywalkerdt 03/20/2007 at 10:02 AM #

    gavin grant’s attitude to the nit is much how we should all consider recruiting against other major programs- “we in it, might as well win it”

  11. RickJ 03/20/2007 at 10:06 AM #

    I’m going to have to respectively disagree regarding the recruiting of Chucky Brown, Chris Washburn, John Thompson, Walker Lambiotte and Rodney Monroe. UNC didn’t offer any of these players.

    Brian Howard and Marcus Melvin would be the closest we’ve come to beating UNC for a player since Thompson & Burleson. In both cases, UNC wanted another player more (Ricky Jones instead of Howard and Eddie Griffith instead of Melvin). Jones ended up at Clemson (he was from SC) and Griffith went to Villanova (I think). UNC went after Howard & Melvin when they lost out on Jones & Griffith but to Valvano (Howard) and Sendek’s (Melvin) credit, they had already sealed the deal.

    C. J. Williams may be a similar case. It is my understanding that UNC wanted C. J. to wait until next year before committing.

    You can win a National Championship without beating UNC and Duke in recruiting. Florida did it last year and Maryland did it in 2002. Neither of these teams had a single player with an offer from Duke or UNC.

    With the 13 scholarship limit, there are plenty of top level players available for NC State to win big but in my view it cannot be done recruiting the Stephen Curry’s and Eric Manor’s of the world and hoping that they turn out to be great. For every Curry & Manor you sign, you end up with 10 Jeremy Ingram’s & Cameron Stanley’s.

  12. yannes 03/20/2007 at 10:09 AM #

    I am pretty sure that Roy wanted Costner and that UNC would have loved an in-state top-25 guy like Simmons. I also think that UNC wanted CJ Williams (another in-state recruit) to wait so that they could give him a better look.

    But really why should we have to match up with UNC and Duke on the recruiting trail when we can get players that are just as good or better for what Lowe wants to do by matching up against recruiters from other power conferences?

    Recently, for Julius Mays we beat out Big-10 schools like MSU and Indiana, for Fells we beat out SEC schools, for GG we beat out BE schools, etc.

  13. redfred2 03/20/2007 at 10:12 AM #

    “unc & duke will get who they want most of the time since they are the top 2 programs in the country with the 2 most famous coaches.”

    Thinking like that is the problem…in a nutshell.

    It wasn’t ALWAYS that way, those programs are NOT entitled to anything anymore than anyone else, and thank God that thinking like yours is a fairly new phenoma. Otherwise, NC State wouldn’t have a single banner to hang anywhere.

  14. redfred2 03/20/2007 at 10:14 AM #

    boo boo ^phenomena

  15. Gene 03/20/2007 at 10:16 AM #

    i’ll tell you this the only thing state really did wrong in the valvano era was to name him head men’s basketball coach and athletic director.

    I also think an appearance of inpropriety, with what seemed like a lackadaisical attitude towards off-the-court infractions by players, did not help. Along with low graduation rates and players not working towards a degree, though not NCAA infractions, created a public image that people could believe accusations that NCSU athletics was not above board.

    If Valvano wasn’t AD and coach, you could’ve shifted the blame for the short comings of the basketball program to the AD and made him the fall guy for the program.

    In the end Valvano’s a controversial figure. The truth lies in between those, who want to condemn him for everything and those who want to absolve him of any failures and blame other outside parties for the nose dive our basketball program took.

  16. redfred2 03/20/2007 at 10:23 AM #

    Who would like to place a friendly wager that WHEN Sidney Lowe starts to consistently make noise within the NC school system/ACC, that vague innuendos will start popping out all over the local media? History has already shown.

  17. noah 03/20/2007 at 10:24 AM #

    I had an interesting conversation with someone on an airplane once regarding Thompson. The guy was a UCLA graduate and was miffed about losing in 1974. He said that he never liked DT because he took his talent for granted.

    How so, I asked.

    He threw it all away for cocaine!

    That surprised me. Here’s a guy who actually lived in LA during the 1970s, and he’s shocked, SHOCKED that young black athletes in the 1970s used cocaine. If you were a celebrity (or just had a lot of money) in the 1970s and you were over the age of…say…12 and under the age of 50 and you DIDN’T use cocaine, you are probably on a very short list.

    I’m not trying to make any value judgements here. I’m not talking about whether or not substance abuse is a disease or whether drugs should be legal. Those are for another day.

    But it really REALLY shouldn’t come as a shock that cocaine was EVERYWHERE from about 1973 on. Once George Jung and Pablo Escobar figured out how to get high quality stuff into the country, it kinda went everywhere. Escobar ended up as the seventh richest man in the world because of cocaine.

    The stories that people tell describe parties with PLATTERS of cocaine everywhere. Just huge piles and everyone participating. Richard Pryor’s joke about how it wasn’t addictive (I’ve been doing it for 10 years and I ain’t hooked!) was the logic of the day. No hanger, no jones…just a nice pick-me-up.

    There were entire TEAMS that were cocaine addicts in the 1970s. The Pittsburgh Pirates, the “We Are Family” squad? The Oakland As? The KC Royals? The Phoenix Suns? Some of you younger guys may not know this or remember this, but in the early 80s, there were huuuge investigations of all the sports leagues for cocaine usage.

    Willie Wilson, Willie Aiken, Claudell Washington, Willie Stargell (what’s with all the Willie’s?), Omar Moreno, Pascual Perez, Steve Bedrosian, Steve Howe, Darryl Strawberry, Dwight Gooden, Ferguson Jenkins…these were all-stars. It wasn’t like steroids today where the only people getting busted are the 25th man on the squad.

    Walter Davis (of UNC fame) managed to sell out the entire Phoenix Suns franchise in exchange for immunity.

    So…it just surprised me that someone would try and judge DT through today’s vantage point.

  18. CedarGroveWolf 03/20/2007 at 10:25 AM #

    “Thinking like that is the problem…in a nutshell”

    it’s the truth

  19. shellnc 03/20/2007 at 10:33 AM #

    I would rather win with players from this state and a few all-stars sprinkled in from all around the country, than be like Duke and have 90% of my players come from outside of North Carolina or uncch and have 75% of our players come from outside of North Carolina.

    I think having 5 or 6 from outside the state is a good number. We can find talent in North Carolina. If we focus on getting the NC player, then the best will want to come here. Force UNC and Duke to have to go outside of NC to get all of their players and we will break them in the end.

  20. BJD95 03/20/2007 at 10:36 AM #

    I don’t care where the players come from. Just get good players and get results. It’s a bottom-line business!

  21. westwolf 03/20/2007 at 10:37 AM #

    Duke and Unc have a recruiting edge at this time. But with Sid as our coach, it that advantage may become less pornounced over time. Compared to our previous coach, Sid actually has a compelling story to offer to recruits, something that can realistically allow him to compete for their services. Unlike Herb, Sid can tell a recruit:

    1) I played for a legendary high school coach, so I know what it’s like to be recruited by a bunch of schools. I can relate to your situation.

    2) I played on a National Championship team. I was the leader on team that went head-to-head with Unc(even Jordan), and other future NBA legends and we came out on top. Unlike Roy or K, I can related to your hopes in this area from a players perspective.

    3) I know you want to get to the NBA. Well, I’ve played in the NBA, was a head coach in the NBA, was an assistant for a staff that won multiple NBA championships. Coaches and GMs accross the country know me on a first name basis. We’re friends. They call me after we win big games.

    Well, this is just a start. With our upgrade in coach, from what’s his name to Sid, we will be able to recruit much, MUCH better.

    Finally, even with our improved recruiting, we will not always have equal talent with whom we are competing. At State, we need to find other advantages to offset that fact. I think Sid has proven himelf to be a better bench coach than anyone in the Acc. He simply outcoached Roy and K this year. Unc is loaded with McD AA’s this year, future NBa talent, and yet Sid’s coaching lead us to a win over them at home, a tie at half at their place, and within a shot or two of beating them in the Acc tournament.

    Another advantage we now enjoy is an improved staff. Larry Harris chose to stay, and the new staff in INFINITELY better than what we had before.

    The future is bright.

  22. redfred2 03/20/2007 at 10:38 AM #

    “it’s the truth”

    No, it’s your own reality, that’s all.

  23. LRM 03/20/2007 at 10:42 AM #

    Noah,
    Not trying to start anything here, but I do think the kid beside you on the plane indeed had a VERY good point, but I don’t see it as a value judgment necessarily: DT in fact is very public that he’s a guy that wasted away his God-given talent because of his rampant drug use. Tough to argue any other way.

    Unfortunately, Len Bias never got the message.

    Besides, if you’re going to list coke-head athletes, how can you leave off Carolina’s most prominent football player and the reason the left tackle is the second highest-paid position in the NFL, Lawrence Taylor, who just happened to be the most-notable coke head of all.

  24. cedarblockhead 03/20/2007 at 10:42 AM #

    CedarGroveWolf Says:

    March 20th, 2007 at 8:35 am
    unc & duke will get 90% of the kids they want every year.

    Brought to you by http://www.madeupstatistics.com

  25. MadWolf92 03/20/2007 at 10:43 AM #

    My grandpa didn’t like DT because of his cocaine use, and this is a man that included Babe Ruth and Mickey Mantle among his heroes.

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