DD and Recruiting … Has NC State moved into the Elite?

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This topic contains 84 replies, has 11 voices, and was last updated by  SaccoV 3 months, 2 weeks ago.

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  • #133823

    ryebread
    Participant

    Grey: go back and check the last 50 years of NC state football history. No head coach has survived hitting the trifecta twice. They can survive it once, but cannot again. Doing it twice is typically a sign that the program is just not healthy. I don’t think DD would have survived it either. Hey, what do I know? Doesn’t really matter because he pulled a rabbit out of his hat.

    At the same time if he hits the trifecta again, I think he’ll be gone. He’ll likely avoid the chance by not scheduling ECU and we can cite that schedules are set years in advance.

    I think we should play ECU every other year or so. The programs that have really established themselves have little trouble handling their little brothers.

    #133824

    SaccoV
    Participant

    Two more commits for the 2019 class has moved the overall class to #23. Doeren has mangaged at this point to out-recruit UN*!!

    #133825

    Greywolf
    Participant

    Two m
    ore commits for the 2019 class has moved the overall class to #23. Doeren has managed at this point to out-recruit UN*!!

    5-star Quavaris Crouch is visiting Wednesday while helping move in his brother who is a freshman Packer. We are recruiting Crouch to play LB. It’s somewhat of a long shot but the word is his family favors NC State and wants him to play close to home.

    4-star corner-back Warren Burrell has cut his list to 4: Auburn, Florida, Tennessee and NC State and is visiting us on an official visit next week. The teams he eliminated were Georgia, Notre Dame, Ohio State and Penn State. Hard to believe we are in that level of competition. Win, lose or draw we are competing with big-time teams for big-time recruits.

    We have an additional handful of 4-star recruits we are expecting to commit. Life is good.

    #133826

    Greywolf
    Participant

    Grey: go back and check the last 50 years of NC state football history. No head coach has survived hitting the trifecta twice. They can survive it once, but cannot again. Doing it twice is typically a sign that the program is just not healthy. I don’t think DD would have survived it either. Hey, what do I know? Doesn’t really matter because he pulled a rabbit out of his hat.

    Rye: Not interested in NC state football history. That was then, this is now. Debbie Yow is not firing and hiring out of a history book. Get real.

    Having way too much fun checking out the trifecta of recruits who have committed, are likely to commit and possibly could commit. The only trifecta I’m interested in today is 4 star Joshua Harris, 4-star CJ Clark and 4-star Zonovon Knight. Hit that trifecta and the trifecta of 4-star Walter Burrell, 4-star Derrick McClendon and 5-star Quavaris Crouch and we will be looking at conference and national championship possibilities in 2021/22.

    Rye, seriously. Get your head out of your past and enjoy what’s possibly the greatest recruiting class we ever had. No more speculation about Doeren getting fired. Didn’t happen. Ain’t going to happen. 😉

    #133827

    tractor57
    Participant

    I see improvement. Strong recruiting, better on field coaching and apparently better relationships with HS coaches in NC. The next question is will we lose some excitement if we step back a bit during the upcoming season. I don’t think we will but it is always possible. At this point I am optimistic.

    #133828

    SaccoV
    Participant

    Update — C.J. Clark (4* from North Stanly HS) just committed to the Pack!! The first of GreyWolf’s trifecta is coming. Haven’t hit the refresh button this many times since Lee Fowler was the AD!!

    #133829

    SaccoV
    Participant

    Also, Clark’s commitment moves the class up to #19 according to 247.

    #133830

    Greywolf
    Participant

    The only trifecta I’m interested in today is 4 star Joshua Harris, 4-star CJ Clark and 4-star Zonovon Knight.

    Hello!! Clark is in.

    #133831

    ryebread
    Participant

    Rye: Not interested in NC state football history. That was then, this is now. Debbie Yow is not firing and hiring out of a history book. Get real.

    Rye, seriously. Get your head out of your past and enjoy what’s possibly the greatest recruiting class we ever had. No more speculation about Doeren getting fired. Didn’t happen. Ain’t going to happen. ?

    If you think that Yow was going to survive a “DD or you” type ultimatum from the $$$ people, then I believe you are the one who needs to “get real.” DD was her guy. Gott was her guy as well. Gott was imploding. Had DD hit that second trifecta, Yow’s seat would have gotten red hot. She’d have made very short work out of him, particularly given the lack of a long standing personal relationship like she had with Gott. If she gave Gott the boot mid-season, she’d not have hesitated with DD.

    To your point about the today, then I agree that we should focus on today. No more saying things like “our fans are running off DD” or revisionist garbage, and I won’t remind you of why DD might not have been here. Deal?

    #133832

    john of sparta
    Participant

    NCSU/Elite/No

    #133833

    Greywolf
    Participant

    If you think that Yow was going to survive a “DD or you” type ultimatum from the $$$ people, then I believe you are the one who needs to “get real.” DD was her guy. Gott was her guy as well. Gott was imploding. Had DD hit that second trifecta, Yow’s seat would have gotten red hot. She’d have made very short work out of him, particularly given the lack of a long standing personal relationship like she had with Gott. If she gave Gott the boot mid-season, she’d not have hesitated with DD.

    To your point about the today, then I agree that we should focus on today. No more saying things like “our fans are running off DD” or revisionist garbage, and I won’t remind you of why DD might not have been here. Deal?

    You can disabuse yourself of the notion that $$$ people or anybody else is giving Debbie Yow an ultimatum. The only person who can do that is Randy Woodson. $$$ people couldn’t get Lee Fowler fired, for goodness sakes, how in the heck do you think they can get Yow fired?

    As for your “trifecta” story, that dog won’t hunt. The best “fans” can do to “run a coach off” is through heavy doses of vitriol like SFN gave HWSNBN and Doeren.

    #133834

    ryebread
    Participant

    You can disabuse yourself of the notion that $$$ people or anybody else is giving Debbie Yow an ultimatum. The only person who can do that is Randy Woodson. $$$ people couldn’t get Lee Fowler fired, for goodness sakes, how in the heck do you think they can get Yow fired?

    As for your “trifecta” story, that dog won’t hunt. The best “fans” can do to “run a coach off” is through heavy doses of vitriol like SFN gave HWSNBN and Doeren.

    We can agree to disagree on whether or not what didn’t happen because it didn’t play out that way. Only a handful of people know, neither of which are us, and those that did know then would surely spin it now.

    Employment is a bit like a marriage. When things go bad, they can be really nasty (up to one spouse killing another), but things can improve, people kiss and make up and then it is human nature to forgive and forget. Shrugs.

    I still go back to my original ask. If you focus on the now, then I’ll focus on the now. Stop making statements like our horrible fans almost ran DD off (which in this last post you’re saying clearly can’t happen), and I’ll let it drop.

    DD may have left, but it wouldn’t have been due to the fans. It would have been to:
    1) Reset the clock
    2) Add $$$ to his bank account
    I wouldn’t have blamed him at all if he had left for either reason. He ultimately has to do what he feels best for his career and his family.

    The sun would have risen the next day. We would have still fielded a team, with some chance that it was better and some chance that it was worse. To me the program is bigger than any one coach or player.

    #133835

    Pack1997
    Participant

    Lets not mention DD and HWSNBN in the same sentence because there is nothing similar to their tenures. DD has us on a slow upward projections, HWSNBN was mediocre at best, in a sport where you could turnaround a team much faster. . I have always pointed to this year as the year we will learn how good a coach DD is. When losing a ton of leaders, how well does the team progress? All indications so far are good, but who knows what happens. I am excited about the upcoming year as well as what we are doing on the recruiting trail.

    #133836

    Greywolf
    Participant

    DD may have left, but it wouldn’t have been due to the fans. It would have been to:
    1) Reset the clock
    2) Add $$$ to his bank account
    I wouldn’t have blamed him at all if he had left for either reason. He ultimately has to do what he feels best for his career and his family.

    One thing he was fighting for was more money for his assistants and staff. Don’t know how true it was but DD said his wife not wanting to leave was the deciding factor. I say it jokingly but what was he going to do with the extra million? Pay alimony? Lot’s of failed marriages in the sports coaching professions. I did a list on another thread showing the ages of coaches children. All were married with at least 1 young child except Aaron Henry, who is single, and Hux and Roof. Doeren want’s his coaches home for dinner even if they have to come back. That’s big to guy who have new wives and young kids. The coaching profession isn’t noted for great hours and time with the family.

    The sun would have risen the next day. We would have still fielded a team, with some chance that it was better and some chance that it was worse. To me the program is bigger than any one coach or player.

    Just thought and opinions…Could be but if most of his assistants and staff had left with him, we would be back to square one. His coaches are very loyal to him. He treats them well. Staff continuity is important in football. Not all CEO’s are of equal ability. No guarantee the next HC could handle the job of HC or CEO or both. We could have been in another 3 coach cycle trying to get back where we are now.

    We would have survived but IMO been set back a few years regardless.

    I’m going to go spend my energy creating the karma for Quavaris Crouch to commit. Maybe Derrick McLendon, DE too.

    #133837

    ryebread
    Participant

    I’m going to go spend my energy creating the karma for Quavaris Crouch to commit. Maybe Derrick McLendon, DE too.

    I like the sound of that. On some level, it’s not the X’s and O’s, but the Jimmies and Joes.

    #133838

    Greywolf
    Participant

    I’m going to go spend my energy creating the karma for Quavaris Crouch to commit. Maybe Derrick McLendon, DE too.

    I like the sound of that. On some level, it’s not the X’s and O’s, but the Jimmies and Joes.

    Do you remember President Kennedy saying, “We will have a man on the moon in this decade.”? He was standing for our doing something we did not even have the technology invented to do. That was very powerful speaking. He literally spoke something into existence with his stand.

    I’m standing for Quavaris Crouch choosing the Wolfpack and committing to us.

    #133839

    SaccoV
    Participant

    News regarding landing the 5* long snapper … Although a bit hokey, I really like Doeren giving some pub to a forgotten part. I love the videos we’ve seen of the walk-ons getting their scholarships as this attests to Doeren’s ‘family environment.’ It’s a good thing to see because as fans, we mirror this sentiment in our daily lives. We have our spirits lifted when we see another Pack fan or Pack alum, and we seem to share a special bond … one that doesn’t come with the purchase of a t-shirt and a degree from UNCG.

    Making the ‘little’ guys and role-players feel important can only increase his status with potential recruits. And GreyWolf, your previous post reminds me of another aspect of that story with Kennedy and the Space Race. The janitor at NASA was once asked by an outsider, “What is your job here?” and the janitor replied “I’m working to put a man on the moon.” Items like this one help further that sentiment with the team.

    #133840

    tractor57
    Participant

    SaccoV I agree. We need talent (coaches and players) but we should never forget the need for that atmosphere. I remember my freshman year Holtz would not start a running back who was ripping up practices. That until early season losses forced him to reconsider his stance. Ted Brown who was lightly regarded coming out of HS and who eventually became Mr Everything for us and had a stellar pro career. Those things do happen but yes are rare. Even so we should not stifle that…

    #133841

    SaccoV
    Participant

    Tractor57, it’s one thing when talent and losses demand change, it’s another to recognize the importance of role-players among the context of highly-regarded recruits and potential NFL stars. Although I’m certain that Lou Holtz probably did the same thing in his day with role players, I really enjoy what Doeren is doing to promote these unsung guys among his team.

    #133842

    john of sparta
    Participant

    well, in my opinion, DD is doing it right.
    Dress for the job you want, not the job you have.

    #133843

    tractor57
    Participant

    SaccoV I agree entirely. Every team needs some of that type player. I am excited about what has been done so far under DD.

    #133845

    Greywolf
    Participant

    well, in my opinion, DD is doing it right.
    Dress for the job you want, not the job you have.

    My work philosophy was “Work now to earn the raise I’m going to get.”

    #133846

    Greywolf
    Participant

    Although I’m certain that Lou Holtz probably did the same thing in his day with role players,

    Remember the Rat Pack? Holtz’s name for special teams. Mostly freshmen were in the Rat Pack.

    #133847

    Greywolf
    Participant

    I love the videos we’ve seen of the walk-ons getting their scholarships as this attests to Doeren’s ‘family environment.

    Seeing those walk-ons getting the love from the scholarship players contrasts so greatly with another school where 4 scholarship players beat up a walk-on for talking to one of the skolly’s girl friend or some such nonsense.

    Walk-ons are genuinely appreciated and valued as part of our team.

    #133848

    Greywolf
    Participant

    We need talent (coaches and players) but we should never forget the need for that atmosphere.

    The recruits visiting get a feel for the culture here at NC State. As has been said before it’s work ethic, family, community, etc. Recruits who see and feel the culture in the locker room and want that in their lives are putting NC State on their lists of schools to consider. On the other side of the coin potential recruits who don’t pass muster on fitting into that culture, don’t get offered. It’s wrong for me to do so but when I see a good player from our state who gets an offer from the holes and we don’t offer, I can’t help but wonder if he doesn’t pass muster on character issues, be it work ethic, 1Pack1Goal, or academics or what. It’s one thing for a young man to be struggling with academics because of IQ issues than to be struggling because of lack of effort.

    Winning may put us over the top in the future but just winning will never be NC State with Dave Doeren at the helm.

    well, in my opinion, DD is doing it right.
    Dress for the job you want, not the job you have.

    Bradley Chubb is dressing like a businessman, not some hip hop singer. Teronne Prescod has eliminated his red, top “do” and now is “dressed” to impress in the business world. They say clothes make the man. Sometimes they make him a clown.

    Sure they are college age kid but you can see them maturing as they age in the program. Not a lot gets said about the social programs that Doeren has established to prepare players for life after football. How to dine using appropriate silverware etc., is likely to impress even those who don’t need it.

    A lot of schools have winning records. Not a lot of schools are investing in their players to prepare them for life after football. Citing football reasons for recruits to choose NC State only puts State down in the group of also rans.

    It’s great to see you guys touting the culture and Doeren for creating a football program that stands out of the crowd. Thanks to Sacco in particular for stepping up and writing the lead post for this discussion.

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