Lots of UNC-CHeat news this week

The Final Four obviously is this weekend. The ACC has two of the four teams in Syracuse and North Carolina. This week has also brought out lots of discussions from a national perspective on the academic scandals at Syracuse and specifically in Chapel Hill. There are too many stories this week to have separate entries so here is a sampling of what has been written and said about UNC this week:

Pat FordeOn Probation vs. Under Investigation

The Final Four matchups are now set. In one national semifinal, we have Villanova vs. Oklahoma. In the other, we have On Probation vs. Under Investigation.

Also known as the Outside Counsel Billable Hours Invitational, underwritten by Bond, Schoeneck & King. Also known as Questions 1 through 30 for NCAA president Mark Emmert, should he have his annual meeting with the media in Houston. Also known as Syracuse vs. North Carolina.

Matt Jones

After that Interview, he was on Twitter as a follow-up:

Andy Katz

ESPN’s Katz interviewed Mark Emmert, president of the NCAA, about several items earlier this week. One of the topics was the UNC scandal.

NCAA president Mark Emmert said the final notice of allegations for the North Carolina investigation into academic fraud “will be done in the coming weeks or a month or so.”

In an interview with ESPN after his news conference Thursday, Emmert said the enforcement staff wants to get it done but also wants to make sure the facts are straight.

“The next step is the delivery of allegations,” Emmert said.

“It’s a great, big, complicated case, and it’s taking a long time to get all the information in place,” Emmert said. “We’re not putting a timetable on it.”

Dan Kane

Kane, who has been investigating this UNC scandal in an excellent way for the past few years with the News and Observer, wrote two articles this week regarding the scandal.

First, he wrote an article in which a 2003 UNC report contradicts what UNC says regarding the number of independent studies classes.

UNC-Chapel Hill, which is under investigation for fraudulent classes involving athletes, has maintained that students were not subjected to a limit on independent studies until the 2006-07 academic year.

That stance appears to have narrowed one key part of the NCAA’s investigation.

But a new document released by the university in March shows that the limit on independent studies started before 2003. Other evidence suggests that the limit was in place since the early 1990s.

In response to a long-standing public records request from The News & Observer, UNC provided a 2003 faculty report that proposed numerous curriculum changes.

Deep within the report, the authors cited a 12-hour independent studies limit. Noting that curriculum changes can’t happen if they run counter to General College and Arts and Sciences guidelines, the report said: “That might mean, for example, considering whether to reaffirm the current rule that an Arts and Sciences student can count toward graduation only twelve hours of independent study.”

The start date of that 12-credit-hour limit is critical because the NCAA considers that athletes who exceeded it received an impermissible benefit.

Going back further than 2006 would add well more than 100 athletes to the list of 10 that the NCAA said exceeded the independent study limit through classes that had no professor, never met and yielded a high grade for an end-of-class paper.

For example, records show many athletes on the 2005 men’s basketball championship team took multiple fake classes, which were directed and graded by a clerical employee in the African studies department – including a star player who took 12 hours’ worth in the spring semester when the team won the title.

His second article was an updated primer on the status of the scandal. Here is one of the questions (and answers):

Q: Men’s basketball coach Roy Williams says there are no NCAA allegations involving men’s basketball. Is that true?

A: No. The NCAA’s case against UNC alleges men’s basketball players received impermissible benefits by receiving special access to the fake classes, largely through the efforts of academic counselors in the athlete support program. Men’s basketball is among the three programs that primarily benefited from the special access. The exhibits along with the notice cite examples of that access, including men’s basketball counselor Wayne Walden working with Crowder to put athletes in the classes. Williams brought Walden to UNC from Kansas.

The notice does not accuse Williams or the coaches of wrongdoing, but the fake classes aided his players, particularly those on the 2005 championship team.

So, before UNC plays Syracuse in the Final Four on Saturday, go through the above links as these topics won’t be addressed much during the game.

About ruffles31

1996 NC State graduate who is still waiting on his first ACC conference championship in any of the four main revenue sports (football, men's basketball, women's basketball, and baseball) since enrolling. All I want is a ACC Champions t-shirt.

General UNC Scandal

Home Forums Lots of UNC-CHeat news this week

Viewing 23 posts - 201 through 223 (of 223 total)
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  • #102960
    choppack1
    Participant

    Ok. So Deb is saying we are dirty too so no use in complaining about it. If we are dirty I can’t think of anything more embarrassing – it’s like we are stupid criminals or something.

    Ok – if that is her position – don’t expect me to make a lot of efforts to get in for kickoffs or after halftime and don’t ever question my fandom again.

    If we are going to suck – we should at least be clean.

    #102961
    TheCOWDOG
    Moderator

    Question. How are other ADs responding to the proletariat emailer’s? Or is it just our gang firing off butt hurt missives?

    #102962
    TheCOWDOG
    Moderator

    By the way. Show us your Email. Roo’s matches up.

    #102963
    Wufpacker
    Participant

    da Fuq are you people thinking?
    Wow…I’m really happy I’ve avoided this thread recently.
    I shall now resume said behavior.

    #102964
    choppack1
    Participant

    Cow – probably just our gang.

    I didn’t fire off an email – I am sure she has enough. The wolfpack’s biggest challenge when it comes to me is apathy. In general, I am watching less sports than ever. I didn’t watch much of UNC or Duke games when we played them this year. I watches several of our games this year but haven’t set foot in the RBC in several years – can’t say I missed it.

    If Yow’s Leak reference isn’t genuine – shame on the jerk that posted it. But same on me for believing it… As if we haven’t been fooled enough in the last 2 years.

    Been a lot frustration here lately – from this to bathroom stuff to president Trump or Shrillary – take your pick.

    At times I feel like God is screaming at me, telling me to focus on that is paramount. In general, the message has been heard, but like Josh Hamilton, when I relapse, I relapse hard.

    #102965
    highstick
    Participant

    Stick: I post at both with pretty much identical messaging and an almost identical users. My thoughts are my thoughts, but they’re shared with different people. I have people that I like to discuss things with on each site.

    I stand by my statement. Just stop playing UNC. I’d bet that FSU, GT, Syracuse and Miami would join us given that all got way more from the NCAA and ACC for less. I’d bet that Clemson would too. The ACC would either completely implode or sanction UNC.

    Come on NC State. Give me something to believe in. By standing idly by, you are effectively complicit.

    I agree and have shared the same thoughts with Spurrier and Tanner w/o any results. And DY…

    "Whomp 'em, Up, Side the Head"!

    #102966
    highstick
    Participant

    …The NCAA final had its lowest TV rating, people did not turn in to watch the Cheats, they are sick of them. …

    I agree with several of your observations, particularly visibility of merchandise (from my personal observation), marketability of our graduates, and strengthening of our academic reputation. Can you by chance cite a source for your “merchandise sales” claim? Or a decline in their reporting academic ranking?

    However, you claim that lower TV audience resulted from distaste for Cheats without evidence. I will claim (equally valid/invalid without supporting evidence) that the lower audience resulted from the broadcast being on cable (TBS) exclusively for the first time ever. Neither of us has presented evidence to support such speculation.

    I desperately, desperately want you to be right about the backlash.

    …The NCAA final had its lowest TV rating, people did not turn in to watch the Cheats, they are sick of them. …

    I agree with several of your observations, particularly visibility of merchandise (from my personal observation), marketability of our graduates, and strengthening of our academic reputation. Can you by chance cite a source for your “merchandise sales” claim? Or a decline in their reporting academic ranking?

    However, you claim that lower TV audience resulted from distaste for Cheats without evidence. I will claim (equally valid/invalid without supporting evidence) that the lower audience resulted from the broadcast being on cable (TBS) exclusively for the first time ever. Neither of us has presented evidence to support such speculation.

    I desperately, desperately want you to be right about the backlash.

    I actually think it’s because the game of basketball sucks because it does not even remotely resemble the game that is described in the rule book…I won’t waste my time watching the Hanborough’s of the world hop around and call it basketball.

    "Whomp 'em, Up, Side the Head"!

    #102967
    highstick
    Participant

    By the way. Show us your Email. Roo’s matches up.

    By the way. Show us your Email. Roo’s matches up.

    I’ve got mine, but the exchange took place during the ACC tourney 5 years ago…I knew I was wasting time although we did share some chuckles comparing my 4 letter words to Gary William’s…

    "Whomp 'em, Up, Side the Head"!

    #102970
    ncsu1987
    Participant

    ’87…not expected. Will you join Ricky in re-classification drive?

    Holy Mother of f#ckin’ pearls.

    Must say I’m a little surprised myself at what I’ve been feeling. I sense that I’m falling for the PR narrative, but my confidence in this matter has taken a beating. Trying to keep the faith, hoping there’s still a surprise in the making….still tilting uselessly at the windmill, but starting to ask WTF am I doing?

    Good God…just re-read the previous paragraph…I sound like a whiny little b*tch.

    I’ll be back when I find my [email protected] testicles.

    #102971
    Wulfpack
    Participant

    I sense that I’m falling for the PR narrative, but my confidence in this matter has taken a beating. Trying to keep the faith, hoping there’s still a surprise in the making

    I’m going to help you here. No surprises. The new NOA showed the NCAA’s hand. If you think football and men’s basketball are going to face any punishment of significance, I seriously question your reading comprehension. I’ll save you the surprise now – it isn’t happening. You know it. I know it. Yow knows it. And she’s not about to even try to do a darned thing about it because she has the cuddlies with that sham of an organization in Indy.

    #102973
    modobrew
    Participant

    Cow – probably just our gang.

    I didn’t fire off an email – I am sure she has enough. The wolfpack’s biggest challenge when it comes to me is apathy. In general, I am watching less sports than ever. I didn’t watch much of UNC or Duke games when we played them this year. I watches several of our games this year but haven’t set foot in the RBC in several years – can’t say I missed it.

    If Yow’s Leak reference isn’t genuine – shame on the jerk that posted it. But same on me for believing it… As if we haven’t been fooled enough in the last 2 years.

    Been a lot frustration here lately – from this to bathroom stuff to president Trump or Shrillary – take your pick.

    At times I feel like God is screaming at me, telling me to focus on that is paramount. In general, the message has been heard, but like Josh Hamilton, when I relapse, I relapse hard.

    choppack1, if you’re calling me a jerk cause you think I added a paragraph in there about Leak, then so be it. Would a screenshot of my email account with the email from Debbie opened up be enough to suit your fancy? I’m a diehard pack fan just like the rest of this crowd. I only posted my email to show that she must have amended her original response. Whether the response I received was the original, I do not know. I do know that the response I posted was genuinely from Deb.

    Yow email

    #102975
    Rick
    Keymaster

    I sense that I’m falling for the PR narrative, but my confidence in this matter has taken a beating. Trying to keep the faith, hoping there’s still a surprise in the making

    I’m going to help you here. No surprises. The new NOA showed the NCAA’s hand. If you think football and men’s basketball are going to face any punishment of significance, I seriously question your reading comprehension. I’ll save you the surprise now – it isn’t happening. You know it. I know it. Yow knows it. And she’s not about to even try to do a darned thing about it because she has the cuddlies with that sham of an organization in Indy.

    No one with a brain believes they will get a substantial punishment at this point.

    #102976
    YogiNC
    Participant

    DY can’t do anything right now. What we should be doing (and I just did) is write our state senators and house reps and ping the crap out of them to put pressure on the BOG to take action. And hey while we are at it there is a new HMFIC of the UNC system. PING her! Between her and the BOG maybe the banners won’t come down and wins won’t be vacated but they could impose sanctions that would in effect do the same to UNX that was done to us. If you want to make sure your neighbors clean up their back yard expecting the NCAA to do it looks like it ain’t gonna happen SO, put tons of pressure on them that can make it happen. As far as the BOG is concerned we should start a castrate Larry and ‘ole Roy project, and take away 3 schollys a year from MBB and 5 a year from football for 20 years (a year for each year they cheated). Butch is long gone but put him on the castrate list too.

    Smarter than the average bear

    #102977
    Adventuroo
    Participant

    Well,

    I see that you lads have saddled up your steeds and googled the nearest windmill farm and are ready to do battle. With a little tongue in cheek…..I HAVE BEEN THERE. I did this when Jimmy V was being lynched. I think that I wrote….yes, you had to actually WRITE a letter, but I did have a word processor on my home computer and it was easier…..EVERY person in Raleigh that I could think of and a few in DC. How’d that turn out, eh?

    BUT, it does tell me that a LOT of you and me included are honest and devoted to the pack. I, too, have written Margaret Spellings. BUT, she now has bigger fish to fry. She nominated (OK, the Search Committee did the selection) a Theologian with BUSINESS experience to run ECU. Read that one…..there will be MOBS of folks protesting this as violation of Church and State.

    BACK ON POINT….

    How about looking OUTSIDE of Raleigh…..perhaps to Louisville.

    http://www.courier-journal.com/story/sports/tim-sullivan/2016/04/26/sullivan-carolina-case-invites-skepticism/83543548/

    If you follow the above, you will have to (unless my link got modified) submit to a 6 question survey….that was presented by the “Come on Down to Campbell University” folks. I kid you not….it focused on which Universities you knew about and kept homing in on Campbell and there were open ended questions about it….

    SO, to save you time, I cut and pasted and cleaned up the article…..

    BUT, when you read it, think of how that would play out in NC. IF the “Louisville Sex Orgies” had been OPEN to all students, then Louisville….using the UNC defense….would have been given a similar PASS. BUT, in NC and also based on Federal Title IX regulation, the “entertainers” would have had to have been “muliti-faceted”. Males for the straight Female students….as well as entertainers that could relate to the LGBT Crowd’s penchants. It would have been a HELL OF AN ORGY…..

    If it was NOT done as I suggested, the the Feds and all the LGBT protesters would make the NCAA’s little Louisville investigation seem like a Sunday School picnic. READ and ENJOY…..there seems to be HOPE….

    On second thought, stop thinking. Stop trying to make sense of the NCAA’s investigation of the University of North Carolina because it defies reason and eschews explanation.
    In eliminating references to men’s basketball and football in an amended Notice of Allegations, and in replacing the charge “impermissible benefits” with an allegation of a “failure to monitor,” the NCAA continues to contort itself to avoid confronting the central fact of the most shocking academic fraud scandal in memory.
    Specifically: Bogus classes disproportionately populated by athletes with eligibility issues over a period of 18 years; including 167 enrollments by Tar Heels’ men’s basketball players during Roy Williams’ coaching tenure.
    That the classes did not meet, offered no instruction, existed as an affront to the core values of education and were perpetuated by faculty and staff (including athletic tutors) is a bewildering outrage. That the Carolina men’s basketball team has yet to be punished by the NCAA or to self-impose sanctions has to cause University of Louisville fans to wonder if their school might have been better served to respond to the Katina Powell scandal by admitting nothing, disputing everything and channeling Jimmy Cagney’s taunt from White Heat: “Come and get me, Copper.”
    (An earlier investigation of the UNC football program resulted in both university and NCAA sanctions in 2011-12.)
    Though the troubling truths of the interminable Carolina case are no longer in dispute, interpreting them has become a high-stakes battle the NCAA shows little appetite for winning. Because the issues were systemic and of long-standing, they would seem to warrant some of the most severe sanctions ever imposed on a college athletic program. Because the courses were available to all students, however, the NCAA has shown a reluctance to assert jurisdiction and a willingness to backpedal when pushed.
    The revised version of the Notice of Allegations released Monday reads as if it were rewritten by Tar Heel attorneys in an attempt to minimize punishment of the school’s two highest-profile athletic programs. In the absence of an official explanation, the changes underscore the widespread suspicion that the NCAA has no stomach for this fight after mishandling the University of Miami infractions case and overstepping its bounds with Jerry Sandusky and Penn State.
    Furthermore, it suggests that the first mistake made by U of L was in limiting attendance at Powell’s Minardi Hall sex parties to basketball players and recruits rather than opening the orgies to all students. Granted, that argument is fundamentally absurd, but it is a logical extension of efforts to color UNC’s corruption as a university-wide issue rather than a practice aimed primarily at preserving the eligibility of athletes.
    See Bylaw 16.01.3: “The receipt of a benefit by a student-athlete or his or her friends that is not authorized by NCAA legislation is not a violation if it is demonstrated that the same general benefit is available to the institution’s students, their relatives, and friends determined on a basis unrelated to athletics ability.”
    According to a 2014 report commissioned by UNC, 47.6 percent of the students enrolled in the bogus classes were athletes. That the majority of the students were non-athletes might be more mitigating if the majority of Carolina’s students were scholarship athletes.
    “Saying anything else but the class scam at UNC was academic fraud is a flat out misrepresentation,” said Ohio University’s David Ridpath, president-elect of the Drake Group, an organization founded to promote academic integrity in collegiate sport. “This would not have happened but for the benefit to athletics.”
    University of Oklahoma professor Gerald Gurney, the Drake Group’s current president, cautions that the revised Notice of Allegations still leaves room for significant sanctions. Though women’s basketball is now the only sport specifically mentioned in the new NCAA notice, Carolina continues to face five Level I violations.
    “Allegations of lack of institutional control and failure to monitor permit broad penalties,” Gurnery wrote in response to an e-mail question. “It is premature to speculate what this means.”
    In the absence of an explanation, though, the NCAA encourages speculation. And, given its recent history, skepticism.

    #102999
    budfox88
    Participant

    If they are not punished appropriately, then stop playing UNCheat in all sports. Let the chips fall. Organize a petition, start a movement. We’ll flounder in a corrupt NCAA and ACC anyway, so why not go for it. If DY makes any public comment about how we should just accept it because we aren’t clean…and she is not fired…that’s it for me folks.

    #103005
    choppack1
    Participant

    Modo brew – the statement only applies if that wasn’t Yow’s response. If was an “if / then” statement, that’s all.

    #103006
    Packzingo
    Participant

    On a lighter note:
    I understand Fedora / UNC have made a standing offer to the Ole Miss coach once he is released from
    his position!! He has talents they can utilize!
    and yes, this is a joke!

    #103284
    Wulfpack
    Participant

    Hatchell argues UNC WBB has been made the scapegoat:

    The new NOA that UNC received April 25 represented good news for the men’s basketball and football programs, which aren’t mentioned at all amid the five Level 1 allegations the NCAA has levied against UNC. It was bad news, though, for Hatchell and women’s basketball, which appears most at risk to endure significant sanctions.

    “I’m real happy for the other sports – for football and men’s basketball, that they’ve sort of been taken out of this,” Hatchell, her voice cracking at times with emotion, said Tuesday. “And of course (football coach) Larry (Fedora) and (men’s basketball coach) Roy (Williams), they’re great guys. Great professionals, good buddies, so I’m happy for them.

    “But I must admit that I’m heartbroken that this has happened to women’s basketball, that we’ve been put in this position. And so it’s hard to believe, to be honest with you.”

    http://www.newsobserver.com/sports/college/acc/article76836992.html#storylink=cpy

    #103285
    Prowling Woofie
    Participant

    The Carolina Way… Throw the cancer patient under the bus, and then back up over her again…

    #103287
    Wulfpack
    Participant

    I throw this out there for anyone that still thinks football and MBB are going to face punishment of any significance — they aren’t. NCAA knows it. Hatchell knows it. Hat knows it. Roy knows it. I know it. You know it. Oh, she’s got beef all right.

    #103288
    Rick
    Keymaster

    I throw this out there for anyone that still thinks football and MBB are going to face punishment of any significance — they aren’t. NCAA knows it. Hatchell knows it. Hat knows it. Roy knows it. I know it. You know it. Oh, she’s got beef all right.

    I am willing to bet she got paid for all of this.

    #103290
    BJD95
    Keymaster

    But of course, she says nothing BAD about the other programs in defending herself. She just wants to get away with it, too. Now that the Holes got the NCAA to go along with their “patsy” scheme…is anyone surprised by the media campaign to rally in defiant support of said patsy??

    Like the NCAA will do anything about it.

    #103299
    FergusWolf
    Participant

    But of course, she says nothing BAD about the other programs

    Of course. She may have gotten caught up in this, but she still wants/needs her job/payoff

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