State Screwed at Syracuse

13-14 Basketball61

State earned that shit tonight, but instead, wildly incompetent ACC officiating takes over and #1 Syracuse was handed the opportunity to win.

The ACC — old and new — has no shame. The irony is it actually hurts itself by screwing over its bubble teams.

About JackWolf

I'm an unapologetic NC State fan but also consider myself a rational one. Hit me up on twitter if you want to talk @NCStateFootball

13-14 Basketball

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  • 02/15/2014 at 10:00 PM #41106
    JackWolf
    Keymaster

    State earned that shit tonight, but instead, biased incompetent ACC officiating takes over. Why not and 1?????— Chris_Corchiani (@Chris_Corchian
    [See the full post at: State Screwed at Syracuse]

    02/15/2014 at 10:28 PM #41129
    I-Like-Tacos
    Participant

    I totally agree that the refs sucked some big nutz tonight. Way too many ticky-tack fouls called on us, especially off the ball.

    But I am sorry to say, the call on Warren was the correct call. Watch the play again if you have the means. The Syracuse guy clearly tries to reach around Warren and swipes at the ball THEN Warren takes two full steps before he jumps. Sure, Cooney most likely was trying to foul, but he did make an attempt at the ball.

    No continuation and no intentional foul.

    I will say that if you watch the ref calling the foul, it almost looks as if he waited to see if the ball would go in before determining it would be a shooting or on the floor foul.

    This game though was lost on mental errors at the end. Just couldn’t handle the pressure.

    02/15/2014 at 10:40 PM #41136
    NelsonHall97
    Participant

    What a complete and total HOSE JOB!

    02/15/2014 at 10:45 PM #41138
    WeAreCured
    Participant
    I-Like-Tacos wrote:

    I totally agree that the refs sucked some big nutz tonight. Way too many ticky-tack fouls called on us, especially off the ball.

    But I am sorry to say, the call on Warren was the correct call. Watch the play again if you have the means. The Syracuse guy clearly tries to reach around Warren and swipes at the ball THEN Warren takes two full steps before he jumps. Sure, Cooney most likely was trying to foul, but he did make an attempt at the ball.

    No continuation and no intentional foul.

    I will say that if you watch the ref calling the foul, it almost looks as if he waited to see if the ball would go in before determining it would be a shooting or on the floor foul.

    This game though was lost on mental errors at the end. Just couldn’t handle the pressure.

    I second this rational explanation of the night’s festivities. In a vacuum, the few ticky tack off ball whistles that resulted in 1 and 1s could be cited as one of many reasons for the L, such as missed free throws and ill-timed turnovers.

    02/15/2014 at 10:50 PM #41142
    Wulfpack
    Participant

    We only made 3 of 10 free throws in the first half. We threw it away twice in the closing moments, and were pretty stale offensively late in the game. So we could have certainly done some things better. Credit the Cuse zone on those items.

    There did seem to be some ticky tack called on us on D late in the game, but nothing on our end.

    I don’t think the Warren call merited an intentional. He made a clear play on the ball. Continuation could have gone either way however.

    02/15/2014 at 10:54 PM #41146
    WeAreCured
    Participant

    There is no continuation in the NCAA, though, correct?

    02/15/2014 at 10:55 PM #41148
    Wulfpack
    Participant

    No, there isn’t. But often times they let it go. Just depends on the ref.

    02/15/2014 at 11:02 PM #41152
    WeAreCured
    Participant
    Wulfpack wrote:

    No, there isn’t. But often times they let it go. Just depends on the ref.

    To me, it’s a shame when some get the special treatment in which a ref would incorrectly make the decision to call something a continuation. It is not a shame when they do not make the decision to call something a continuation, as that is the rule.

    Similarly, it is a shame when some get special treatment and get minor criminal offenses dropped, not when others are not given special treatment.

    02/15/2014 at 11:02 PM #41153
    PapaWolf
    Participant

    Heck of a performance. We didn’t play exceptionally well, but still came within a basket of beating the #1 team in the country on their court in front of 30k of their fans.
    I too am broken hearted, but not blaming anyone.
    I never thought we’d still be in the game at the half.

    02/15/2014 at 11:06 PM #41156
    I-Like-Tacos
    Participant

    It definitely would have been considered continuation in the NBA.

    If TJ just takes one step after the contact, I bet the ref calls it a shooting foul. You just can’t call it when the player gets two full steps closer to the basket in college ball.

    02/15/2014 at 11:06 PM #41157
    Wulfpack
    Participant

    Reffing ain’t easy. That’s my final take. Got a buddy that travels the country doing it. These guys are exhausted, and they take it nightly from fans and coaches. They are human like the rest of us. And for the record, I do not buy into the conspiracy theories.

    02/15/2014 at 11:08 PM #41159
    wolfpup44
    Participant

    Didn’t Lee make both turnovers at the end? Dribble off the foot and then errant pass. Impossible to understand how we lost this one.

    02/15/2014 at 11:15 PM #41162
    PapaWolf
    Participant

    Lee, then Cat

    02/16/2014 at 12:05 AM #41169
    Tuffy2
    Participant

    We hung in to the very end with the number 1 team in the land at their house. Everyone has been talking about the TJ play, what about Barber at the end? Was he fouled?
    Anyway we can what if all night. I think somewhere in the BPI formula there should be some positives given to us for almost pulling off the upset at their place. Maybe so but that might be fishing a little.
    We now need to focus on winning at Clemson this Tuesday and move on. Turn the page pack. You proved to the bubble experts you can play with the big boys. Now improve the resume before the regular season ends or it will take moderate to major impact in the tournament if you don’t.

    02/16/2014 at 12:52 AM #41173
    wufpup76
    Keymaster

    It felt to me more like we blew it … free throws, missed opportunities and turnovers that a team makes when trying to take the next step.

    Very deflating. It’s not over, but our ncaa chances are probably nil. I don’t see how we don’t lose by 20+ at Clemson after this.

    Syracuse was not very good; at the same time we had something to do with that. I didn’t like how they got to the line so much in the second half compared to our few attempts, but we lost to the usual suspects: lack of production late, turnovers, and other team ft’s

    Damn.

    02/16/2014 at 2:59 AM #41174
    MrPlywood
    Participant

    All due respect to those with more experience than I have, but I read the NCAA definition of “continuous motion” and a good post interpreting said definition with examples, and I think TJ’s play should have been an and-1. They key is that TJ does not dribble after the foul and has started his motion toward the basket.

    For the record, I’m not whining, I just like to educate myself and get a better understanding of the rules and concepts.

    source:
    https://www.arbitersports.com/myrefereeapp/?mod=Article&id=112500

    02/16/2014 at 4:59 AM #41176
    PackerInRussia
    Participant

    On today’s episode of Where’s The Beef?
    re: fouls, I have no beef with the no-call on TJ. He was making a play on the ball. There is no continuation in the NCAA. Now, what some (many?) have pointed out is that it’s often given in the NCAA despite the rule (just like traveling). Please don’t choose our team to start making correct calls on that you never call on others. There’s the beef.
    The other issue with the fouls: Cuse got a lot more calls. That makes sense considering the types of D each team plays. No argument on the surface. Question for the more observant, though (and the possible beef): It seemed like a lot of the calls against State at least the last part of the 2nd half (I didn’t see the first half) were off-the-ball fouls. Were those same things being let go on the other end? If so, then there’s the beef.
    I thought that whoever blew the whistle on the push-off to give State the ball back deserved credit for a good call. Obvious, yes, but the kind of thing that goes un-called towards the end of a game sometimes.

    02/16/2014 at 5:19 AM #41177
    PackerInRussia
    Participant

    More than the fouls, I keep re-playing those 2 turnovers in my mind. They had the game. It was theirs for the taking. If Lee had looked up to pass immediately instead of trying to dribble, he would have seen someone (Turner?) wide open in the corner with numbers at the basket. Would have been a very high-percentage chance to score. If it was Turner, he would have had a wide open shot at a 3-pointer or would have drawn out the defender and had someone open under the basket. Instead, dribble off the foot.
    It was bad that State was not in a 1-and-1 situation b/c TJ would have gotten shots regardless. But, it also meant that if they had played their cards right at the end, Cuse would have had a really hard time getting the ball back for a final shot because they would have had to foul several times, each time resetting the game clock just to have a chance. Why not pass the ball in deep on the other side and if they bring the full or half-court pressure, run the play that Lee’s errant dribble didn’t allow (and this team can break pressure well). Or, just make quick passes and play keep-away, knowing that they need to foul. Instead, it was a pass to the near-corner, trap, the rest is history. That’s not to blame the players. Cuse won by doing what they do best. And they’re #1 undefeated. It wasn’t like blowing it the last second to some of the other teams we’ve lost to this year.
    Hard to be mad about the loss, all things considered. Disappointing for sure, though. Could still be a confidence-builder for the team. They came a cat’s whisker away from beating the #1, undefeated team on their home field…er, court. Just remember how you did it.

    02/16/2014 at 6:24 AM #41180
    Rick
    Keymaster

    The acc wants it’s marquee matchups and will do anything top keep them.

    Sure was in the bonus with more than twelve minutes left inn the game and inn the double bonus with right.

    We NEVER were I’m the bonus in the second half. His is out possible that the team taking the entire half never got called for any fouls?

    Screw the acc

    02/16/2014 at 6:40 AM #41183
    Wulfpack
    Participant

    Barber was not fouled. We inbounded the ball into the corner, which fed right into the trap. He saw it coming and threw it away.

    The Warren play is most certainly debateable, as is the foul discrepency.

    02/16/2014 at 6:58 AM #41184
    wilmwolf80
    Participant

    How about the phantom foul on Turner when the Cuse kid slipped and fell? That was as terrible call as I have seen. There is no legitimate reason for the foul discrepancy in the second half. The style of play didn’t change. One team wasn’t fouling in the attempt to make a comeback. Our guys are playing against a hockey team on one end, and getting called for touch fouls on the perimeter at the other end. Typical ACC incompetence. We lost because of our own mistakes, but if not for the terrible calls, our mistakes would not have mattered.

    02/16/2014 at 7:35 AM #41187
    Whiteshoes67
    Participant

    Newlywed that I am, Valentine’s is a weekend event, and I didn’t see much of the game. Caught the end of the first half and the last few minutes of the second. Convenient bathroom breaks while at dinner. Bless my wife. She knew but didn’t say a word.

    Needless to say, I was shocked as hell when I arrived at the bar and it was close. Credit to the team and staff for making it a game. If they’re mettle is that of a winner, and we’re truly improving, I think we bounce back and make a run. at the NCAA. Still have some games left to boost RPI and resume. The remaining games are all winnable. We could also drop every last one.

    Suppose it comes from some hard lessons on the field and court, but I never blame officials. 10 turnovers against that zone isn’t bad, but the turnovers late killed us. Hell, I watched about 10 minutes, and they’re are plenty of other things to pick at besides a few questionable calls by the zebras. Bottom line, we let one slip away. That’s several this year we’ve let slip away, or had a chance to win, and didn’t. Now, must win at Clemson, VT, and at home BC and Miami; plus take either UNC at home or Pitt on the road. If we drop one of the first four, we need wins against UNC and Pitt to make a case for the NCAA tournament. I think we take Clemson, VT, BC, and Miami. Not sure if we get over the hump versus UNC or Pitt.

    02/16/2014 at 7:43 AM #41189
    Rick
    Keymaster

    I did not realize a team was required to play a perfect game in order to expect competent nonbiased officiating. Apparently if you miss a free throw or turn the ball over once it is OK for the refs to call crap calls. Wow

    02/16/2014 at 7:47 AM #41191
    Whiteshoes67
    Participant

    ^Refs always call “crap calls.” It’s the nature of officiating. You can’t control it. Why you focus on what you can control, as in, not turning over the ball, making free throws, not giving up second chance points, etc, and taking quality shots. The little things. Syracuse is damn good. They can afford to play poorly and still win with or without the benefit of bad or good officiating. We’re average. Not the first game we’ve thrown away this year.

    02/16/2014 at 8:04 AM #41192
    btownwolfpack
    Participant

    Totally one sided officiating in the second half. And the guys can’t panic every time someone charges them. And Gottfried needs to manage timeouts better. This is two end game situations where commentary to the team before the last play would have helped…a lot.

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