College Basketball Notes

ESPN has two pieces of note this morning. First, the NCAA alleges that Derrick Rose might not have taken his own SAT (if one reads between the lines). It sounds like the only punishment being discussed is vacating Rose’s Final Four, but even that would suck for Memphis, a program whose best days are behind it. Unlike with Kelvin Sampson, no penalties (even if the allegations are proven true) would follow Calipari to UK. This will obviously be high profile, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it ultimately comes to nothing. Yes, I still wish Calipari had come to NC State.

On the shocking front, mad bomber Terrence Oglesby will leave Clemson to play professionally in Europe. Oglesby did seem like something of a head case, but the Tigers will now be without two of their three leading scores from last season. This development likely means more playing time for Clemson’s other goofy looking white guy, Tanner Smith.

About BJD95

1995 NC State graduate, sufferer of Les and MOC during my entire student tenure. An equal-opportunity objective critic and analyst of Wolfpack sports.


54 Responses to College Basketball Notes

  1. choppack1 05/28/2009 at 10:45 PM #

    This loss potentially looms pretty big for Clempson. He was the only consistent threat they had from the perimeter the last couple of years – and probably opened up the middle a good bit for their guys. However, he was definitely a head case and may have shot them out of several games as well.

    Clemson was the one team DECENT team last year that I figured would likely be better this year, does this take them out of that category?

  2. rtpack24 05/29/2009 at 12:25 AM #

    Alot of D-1 programs operate in the gray area from time to time. However, Cal operates in an area that most coaches would not even consider. So far what the NCAA is looking at concerning Memphis is the tip of the iceberg. Unfortunately, as BJD95 pointed out alot of this stuff is hard to prove. Coach Cal usually does a very good job of insulating himself. It is refreshing to see that at least there is some accountability. I doubt that you will see any D-1 coaches coming to Cal’s defense.

  3. primacyone 05/29/2009 at 9:30 AM #

    From this article:

    “An NCAA spokesman released a statement Thursday disputing Kentucky athletic director Mitch Barnhart’s assertion that the school had “checked records and facts” concerning Calipari before he was hired.

    “Contrary to what may be portrayed in statements in the media from others, NCAA vice president of enforcement David Price followed standard procedures when Kentucky officials requested information regarding any potential violations regarding John Calipari,” the statement said. “Price did not discuss any investigations, but instead urged the university to follow up with Coach Calipari directly.””

    Seems pretty clear to me in the letter from the NCAA to Memphis that the NCAA believes they have proof that someone took Rose’s SAT’s and someone at Memphis knew about it. Either way, should find out in a couple of weeks.

    Here is a link to the letter:

  4. primacyone 05/29/2009 at 9:39 AM #

    From here and other places:

    “A UK statement released Wednesday said that Calipari “has received a letter from the NCAA stating that he is not at risk of being charged with any NCAA violations in this case.”

    On Thursday, The Courier-Journal requested a copy of that letter from UK, Memphis and the NCAA. Both Memphis and the NCAA referred requests to UK.

    UK acknowledged the request on Thursday afternoon. It was pending as of Thursday night.”

    I sure hope they are able to produce that letter! There are a lot of people expecting to get copies of it! Me personally, I could not imagine a letter of that type from the NCAA existing or even have been contemplated to have been written by the NCAA. No way something like that makes it out of legal IMO.

  5. packplantpath 05/29/2009 at 10:06 AM #

    As someone who never really liked calipari, I don’t see this the same way adventuroo and others do. The NCAA alleges that a player did not take his own SAT. No matter if anybody at Memphis knew it or not, that is a legit reason to punish the team since the player was ineligible. If the university knew about it, that would be a different and more serious violation. Right now, the first part has not been proven but appears likely. There is no indication that the university knew about it at this time, so it has no impact on calipari. You may believe that calipari knew about it based on his history and your opinion of him, but that would just be confirmation bias on your part.

  6. bradleyb123 05/29/2009 at 11:50 AM #

    ^ “Get back to me if and when your hypothetical is proven. Until then, it’s just speculation on your part.”

    Here’s what we know: (1) A kid cheated on his SAT, and (2) At least one person at the school knew about it.

    Right? If I’m wrong about either of these two assertions, stop reading now. The rest is based on (1) an (2).

    I think what that other poster is saying is that it is naive to believe SOMEONE at the school knew about this, yet did not tell Calipari about it. Of course this is all speculation, not fact (which is what you said).

    The only other viable alternative is that the school simply told Calipari, “Don’t worry about the academics. We’ll handle all that.” and just did what they had to do to get kids eligible, leaving Calipari in a position with plausible deniability. If that’s the case, then this really is all on U. of Memphis and not on John. Even if this is true, I’m sure there’s a lot of winking and nodding going on, and looking the other way.

    I just find that very hard to believe.

    One thing’s for certain. It’s very difficult to imagine a scenario in all this that leaves Calipari’s reputation untainted.

  7. packplantpath 05/29/2009 at 12:10 PM #

    bradley, I think 2 is definitely in contention. I haven’t seen anything indicating they think the university knew about it other than the NCAA essentially saying “we have to find out” if the university knew. Saying they charged the university with “knowing fraudulence or misconduct” doesn’t mean the university knew about it. It means the student who “took” the SAT knew about it. I think…..That’s the way I interpret it anyway. They have regulatory control over the school, not the student, so they can’t charge or fine him with anything right?

  8. bradleyb123 05/29/2009 at 1:22 PM #

    “bradley, I think 2 is definitely in contention.”

    If #2 is not a given, then I agree. I thought that was an assumption. I thought that had to do with the harsh degree of sanctions levied by the NCAA. If the school didn’t know, they’d get lesser sanctions. If they knew and allowed it to happen without saying anything, they’d get more harsh sanctions.

    I don’t know the details, just going by what I’ve read on here mostly.

    I think I’ll let the dust settle in all this before I post again. 🙂

    Even if it isn’t fair to Calipari, I still think this taints his reputation, which I think was already a little shady to begin with, wasn’t it?

  9. packplantpath 05/29/2009 at 2:18 PM #

    He does have that reputation, yes. I don’t know whether he deserves and earned it or not, but he has it. That was the main reason I didn’t want him at NCSU. Getting someone with that reputation here would be asking for trouble, even if he were to run the tightest ship around. I find it unfortunate, because I would love to have a coach of his caliber here, but that is the world of NC State, “where perception matters more than reality”.

    I do also agree that it is naive to believe that Calipari would not know about it if the university knew about it. If it turns out the university knew and turned a blind eye to it, then yes, Calipari almost certainly also knew.

    I don’t think these sanctions are that harsh though. Of course they should forfeit the wins if they had an ineligible player. When they lose scholarships, then it’s harsh. Were there other sanctions I’m missing?

  10. VaWolf82 05/29/2009 at 2:23 PM #

    Here’s what we know: (1) A kid cheated on his SAT, and (2) At least one person at the school knew about it.

    I don’t think we know either one.

    Since all athletes have to go through the NCAA Clearinghouse, it is going to be hard for the NCAA to claim that a school should have somehow known about the cheating. If someone at Memphis assisted with the cheating, then that is a completely different story.

    But the NCAA just didn’t wake up one morning and decide to start investigating Memphis. So the big question is exactly what type of information the NCAA has and if their sources are more reliable than those that people like Golenbock use.

  11. VaWolf82 05/29/2009 at 2:26 PM #

    which I think was already a little shady to begin with, wasn’t it?

    Maybe you could enlighten us on what Calipari has done to earn this shady reputation? As far as I know, he has never been sanctioned or caused his school to be sanctioned by the NCAA.

  12. BJD95 05/29/2009 at 2:37 PM #

    Wait, you guys are right. I’m glad he’s not here. Sucking hind tit is much better. And honorable, too!

  13. tjfoose1 05/29/2009 at 3:12 PM #

    Of course, it’s not too early to judge, convict, and sentence… Just like those rapist lacrosse Dookies. The press said so, so they must all be guilty.

  14. tjfoose1 05/29/2009 at 3:34 PM #

    It sounds like many of you are afraid of success. Lot’s of people in this world are like you…

    Better to wallow in the comfort of mediocrity (or worse), than to push the envelope to endeavor towards excellence. Spare the blood, sweat, and tears of effort to stay comfortable and dry in a bubble of contented failure.

    For those of you with challenged comprehension skills who like to read between the lines and inject their own perceptions, no where in this post did I mention anything about Calipari (until now) or questionable ethics.

    Simply stating an observation – I’ve noticed over the last few months that any hint or thought of success, past or present, seems to bring out the hordes of naysayers and their negative speak, searching high and low for excuse of failure and justification for their eschewing the pursuance of excellence.


  15. tdawg 05/29/2009 at 3:38 PM #
  16. primacyone 05/29/2009 at 4:20 PM #

    So BJD95 quick question just for clarification:

    You would prefer to cheat to win – yes or no?

    Just an FYI – It’s May 29th, 2009 and Wall, Cousins and Bledsoe have yet to qualify academically.

  17. BJD95 05/29/2009 at 4:52 PM #

    Cheat, no. Push the envelope? Work in “grey areas”? Hell yes.

    It’s really a moot point, though. I firmly believe that NC State is playing by the same rules and standards as everyone else (which is what I want – college sports is a big business, and there’s no “Miss Congeniality” prize). Which is why one should judge the bottom line, and not embrace silly “pride” (based on nothing) about our shittiness somehow being noble.

    It’s merely a defense mechanism for suffering through a culture of losing.

  18. tdawg 05/29/2009 at 7:27 PM #

    “Push the envelope? Work in “grey areas”? Hell yes.”

    It’s comments like these that only serve to validate our great athletics director, “Coach Fowlup” when he calls our fans the “lunatic fringe”. It’s obvious that people like this have lost sight of whats really important in college athletics: the STUDENT athletes. In exchange for dedicating themselves to the school, and their sport, they are given the opportunity to earn their degree for free, since more than likely, they’ll end up going pro in something other than sports.

    Lowe is fulfilling his duties on that end, and since these are students first, he is actually doing a first rate job in promoting whats most important, getting an education (See NCSU APR). Not satisfying the fans of the school who are so far removed from the academia portion of the college equation that all they can think about is winning in sports. Kind of sad really that there actually is a “lunatic contingency” that seems to gather here on SFN :(.

  19. 61Packer 05/29/2009 at 10:40 PM #

    “Lowe is fulfilling his duties on that end, and since these are students first, he is actually doing a first rate job in promoting what’s most important, getting an education.”

    Huh? Sidney Lowe promoting education? Here is a guy who didn’t pursue finishing his degree for 25 years after leaving NC State, and the only reason he got one (online) was to qualify for the Wolfpack coaching job.

    Tell me all you want about Lowe’s ability to coach and we can have a good exchange because he’s had only 3 years so far, but please don’t tell me he’s concerned about education when he blows off finishing his degree for a quarter of a century.

  20. NCSUownzJoo 05/30/2009 at 1:07 AM #

    Well let’s think about this for a minute… Who’s at fault? The school or Calipari?

    Well let’s see, how many school’s has Calipari been the head coach at? And how many of those schools are being/have been investigated immediately after his tenure?

  21. Gene 05/30/2009 at 4:12 AM #

    For some NCSU perspective: none of Calipari’s players (that I am aware of) have been arrested for stealing stereo’s or pizza’s, while playing for him.

    He gets little programs, like UMass and Memphis, to the same level as Kentucky, UNC-Ch, etc.

    That’s incredibly impressive because those schools didn’t have anything before he got there and probably won’t have anything after he leaves.

    I think a lot of people who “hate” on Calipari are just mad he builds those schools up to be legitimate contenders and doesn’t “stay in his place”.

    Hat’s off to coach Cal for finally landing a plum job after nearly 20 years of coaching college basketball.

    It’ll be interesting to see if the NCAA can prove anything against Memphis. Rose is denying he did anything wrong, from what I’ve read.

    Also, keep in mind the NCAA’s investing Memphis because their former women’s golf coach paid a total of $3,000 to players for travel expenses. I guess the transgressions of the women’s golf team were so great the NCAA felt they needed to veer off and investigate the rest of the athletics department, but nothing Calipari or the Memphis athletic’s department did with regards to Men’s basketball caused this investigation.

    The Rose-SAT “scandal” is making headlines because a women’s golf coach broke NCAA rules and the NCAA seems to have nothing better to do with its time.

    I know I’d be furious if NCSU’s basketball program was investigated because our women’s golf team violated NCAA rules. I’d be crying about a Carolina-media controlled have-to-keep-NCSU-down conspiracy, if the same thing happened to us.

    It’ll be interesting to see if anything comes of this other than building to the “legend” Calipari’s somehow crooked.

  22. Gene 05/30/2009 at 4:28 AM #

    “Lowe is fulfilling his duties on that end, and since these are students first, he is actually doing a first rate job in promoting what’s most important, getting an education”

    Coaches don’t have a lot to do with graduation rates.

    It’s the universities and athletics departments that set up the tutors and support services athletes need to keep up with their course work that are primarily responsible for graduation rates. It’s the university that decides if the athletics department can look the other way, if someone isn’t keeping up with their course work or not.

    School’s with traditionally good graduation rates keep having them even after they change coaches.

    ” Well let’s see, how many school’s has Calipari been the head coach at? And how many of those schools are being/have been investigated immediately after his tenure?”

    Calipari had as much to do with Camby accepting money from an agent, as Valvano did with Washburn selling shoes and tickets.

    It’s too bad there’s not a way to penalize the Chris Webber’s and Marcus Camby’s for violation NCAA rules, because for them all they got was extra money from boosters or agents, with no repercussions whatsoever.

    Also, please note the investigation into Memphis was due to their former women’s golf coach’s giving money to players and had nothing to do with any improprieties by the men’s basketball program.

  23. rtpack24 05/30/2009 at 7:26 AM #

    It is extremely hard for coaches to keep agents away from their players because most have at least some contact before they even get out of AAU ball. Coach Cal uses the guys to recruit. World Wide Wes is a close associate of Cal’s which he readily admits. Wes is the premier street agent in the USA. Are all the Cal defenders naive enough to think that Derrick Rose set up his bogus SAT test. Cal knows exactly what he is doing and exactly what is going on in his program. The NCAA just needs to review the passenger list on the teams charter flights to figure out what is going on. They won’t because they have no desire to actually nail Cal. There will be a dog and pony show and Memphis will get nailed with violations and Coach Cal will slide.

  24. Rick 05/30/2009 at 8:18 AM #

    Lowe is recruiting the exact same players as Calipari.

    These kinds of things happen when you recruit those types of players. The difference is Lowe has not been winning with them.

  25. haze 05/30/2009 at 11:19 AM #

    What’s the essence of this debate? Seems to be “Would we have been better off with Cal than with Sid?”

    Well, it’s all guess work, complete conjecture and unprovable; pro or con. However, if you buy the replication of the facts of UMass and Memphis, you can say that he’d probably have won a lot of games (b/c he always has) and that he’d have recruited questionable student athletes (b/c he always has) and that he’d eventually leave for a better job (b/c he always has… and don’t doubt that UK is a better job than NC State) and that NC State could well have ended up in trouble with the NCAA (b/c that’s always been the case too).

    For the stats oriented, where, exactly, does one stop projecting Cal’s history into the future? Do we say he’d have won here but would not have gotten NC State in trouble? On what basis? Do we say that he wouldn’t have won here at all? On what basis? Personally, I find the idea that you can understand which trend would hold and which trend would fail to be naive.

    The historical data say, he’ll win and he’ll get YOU in trouble. The data do not say that he’ll lose or get himself in trouble. Beyond that… pure conjecture.

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