Day of roster changes for Wolfpack BBall (3/24 Update @ 12pm)

RALEIGH, N.C. – NC State head men’s basketball coach Sidney Lowe has announced that redshirt juniors Brandon Costner and Trevor Ferguson will forego their final year of eligibility, and not return to the Wolfpack in 2009-10.

Joe Giglio at ACCNow has a more on the roster changes at this link. He also discusses the Wolfpack’s new recruit – Josh Davis – that was already being discussed in our comments section.

Davis, a 6-5 forward, is a “tweener,” Telep said, who will add frontcourt depth for the Wolfpack, which lost Costner, a versatile forward who decided to go pro on Monday.

“They added a really nice player, with great character, who wanted to be a part of the program,” said Telep, who has Davis rated as a two-star prospect.

Additionally, Ken Tysiac added the following:

Davis averaged 25.7 points and 12 rebounds per game this season as a senior. He had been considering UNC Wilmington and had scholarship offers from Gardner-Webb and High Point. Seton Hall’s staff also wanted Davis to make a campus visit, Clemons said.

“He’s always wanted to go (to N.C. State),” Clemons said. “He always talked about N.C. State. That was his school. He worked hard enough, and was able to get an offer.”

Clemons said Davis can score on the block as a power forward and is skilled enough to play small forward.

As our readers pointed out in the comments section, there are some pros and cons to offering/accepting Davis’ commitment. I must admit I am a little perplexed by the use of the scholarship and also a little concerned at the message of potential desperation that the scholarship sends. To be very clear – I KNOW ABSOLUTELY NOTHING – but, the addition of a local kid (Athens Drive HS) that is clearly not ACC caliber talent could potentially mean that the use of the scholarship is ‘flexible’. I can only hope that *potentially* Davis gets to use the scholarship as long as the program does not need it for another, highly-rated player in this class or the future.

By all accounts, Davis is kid of high character who wanted to be a part of the program. He loves NC State and exhibits true heart and passion on the court. (Certainly something that has been lacking from our program for a long time). He averaged over 25 points a game in high school and was considered as good or better of a player than the two ‘stars’ in his conference – Earnest Ross (Auburn signee) and Garrius Adams (Miami signee).

Davis is described as a very athletic, but undersized ‘hustle player’ akin to a Simon Harris &/or Johnny Thomas (who is already on the Wolfpack’s roster). He has been recruited to play the wing forward position at State.

But, at 6’5 he not a ‘tweener’ for the only position that existing skills set supports – power forward – as his outside shooting is weak. There seems to be some debate if Seton Hall was truly looking at Davis and it appears that State ‘beat’ Gardner-Webb, Charleston Southern and High Point for Davis.

There is most definitely a fit for a Josh Davis within NC State’s Basketball program; but, I am not necessarily convinced that there is an ideal fit for Josh Davis within the current state of the Wolfpack’s program with the current composition of our roster and scholarship spacing. In light of Johnny Thomas’ presence on the roster and sophomore status, it is fair to ask the question if we have ‘over-recruited’ the ‘undersized, high character, sleeper role on the wing’. As one of our readers said, “I hope someone knows more than anybody else here or gets this kid on the juice but this seems strange even by our standards.”

Much is made about State’s struggles and needs at the point guard position…and, Ryan Harrow may be scheduled to arrive in Raleigh one year too late for Coach Lowe. But, I see an even more glaring deficiency on the Wolfpack’s roster after the departure of Brandon Costner – NC State desperately needs some size, heft and toughness in the post. Despite the addition of Richard Howell in the 2009 recruiting class, an ‘ideal’ candidate for one of the Wolfpack’s remaining scholarships would be a junior college big man – preferably a true center of close to 7 feet – who can defend, block shots and rebound. Additionally, this would be ideal for current and future scholarship spacing needs.

Of course, there is still a very small chance that NC State pulls a rabbit out of the hat and can land the nation’s top remaining recruit, John Wall. Wall’s presence may not only help boost next season’s performance, but it would also send a message to other top recruits that NC State is a place to be. (Not to mention its potential impact on re-solidifying CJ Leslie’s commitment. Oddly, landing Wall may not only be great for next year’s performance, but also for the importance of long term spacing of scholarships for the program.

Looking Forward
If State is unable to ultimately land John Wall, I agree with Giglio’s assessment of next season’s line-up:

On paper, State’s starting lineup looks like: Javier Gonzalez at the point, Brown at the 2-guard, C.J. Williams at small forward, Howell at the 4 and Smith at center.

Off the bench State has guards Julius Mays, Farnold Degand and Wood. At forward, Dennis Horner and Johnny Thomas are the other returning scholarship players, plus Davis.

Additionally, Ken Tysiac has added a great blog entry about the Wolfpack’s prospects next year that can be seen here.

When you look at the roster the Wolfpack has returning, it’s impossible to deduce that the team will be better off without Costner and reserve guard Trevor Ferguson, who also is leaving.

[snip]

As a whole, this roster will not scare North Carolina when it gets off the bus next season at the Smith Center. Against the rest of the ACC, N.C. State might hold up OK because there is a lot of backcourt talent leaving from the traditional middle-of-the-pack schools.

Toney Douglas, Tyrese Rice and Jack McClinton all were seniors, and Maryland’s Greivis Vasquez has already announced his intention to test the NBA waters.

But hoping the competition falls back to N.C. State’s level is not a where the Wolfpack hoped to be in Sidney Lowe’s fourth season.

Coach Sidney Lowe’s incoming recruiting class might turn out to be his best yet. But the members of his past classes will be sophomores and juniors next season comprising the bulk of N.C. State’s roster. Lowe’s initial difficulties gaining a foothold as a recruiter after coming to N.C. State from the NBA look like they will come home to roost next season.

Projected 2009-2010 NC State Basketball Roster

Senior Class
(1) Dennis Horner (F)
(2) Farnold Degand (PG)

Junior Class
(3) Javi Gonzalez (PG)
(4) Tracy Smith (4F)

Sophomore Class
(5) Johnny Thomas (Wing)
(6) Julius Mays (PG/SG)
(7) CJ Williams (Wing)

Freshman Class
(8) Scott Wood (Wing)
(9) Lorenzo Brown (PG/SG)
(10) Richard Howell (PF)
(11) Josh Davis (WF)
(12/13) Potential scholarships still available

2010 Commits
(12) Ryan Harrow (PG)
(13) CJ Leslie (hopeful)
(1) Departure of Dennis Horner if no other scholarships issued for 2009 class
(2) Departure of Farnold Degand if no other scholarships issued for 2009 class

2011 Commits
(1) Departure of Javi Gonzalez
(2) Departure of Tracy Smith

About StateFans

'StateFansNation' is the shared profile used by any/all of the dozen or so authors that contribute to the blog. You may not always agree with us, but you will have little doubt about where we stand on most issues. Please follow us on Twitter and FaceBook

09-10 Basketball Basketball Recruiting General NCS Basketball

217 Responses to Day of roster changes for Wolfpack BBall (3/24 Update @ 12pm)

  1. Justin Gainey 03/24/2009 at 2:12 PM #

    If you look at it, Sid’s recruiting might be getting worse. yet. We only brought in two recruits last year, Mays and Williams. Both 3 star. The year before he had a good one with hickson and smith, but that was it. Hopefully this year will be better, but signing a two star recruit and giving him a scholarship is a bit risky. If you look at the other acc recruits, they don’t even bother below 3 stars. Most are 4 or above with at least one 5 star.

  2. Rick 03/24/2009 at 2:13 PM #

    “So, we’re stuck with the talent evaluation of the people who brought you Marques Johnson, Bartosz Lewandowski and Farnold Degand?”

    While I agree those were awful and questionable (at best) schollies…

    Lowe has also spotted CJ Leslie and Ryan Harrow (and to a lesser extend Scott Wood)before they blew up

  3. primacyone 03/24/2009 at 2:14 PM #

    Josh Davis has not been evaluated by either Rivals or Scout. I do not believe he played AAU ball last year. Soe really nobody knows, because nobody has seem him play. Other than Leroy Harris, who I understand saw many of his games as he was looking at Earnest Ross and Garius Adams. Most people who seem to have some knowledge of conference play, say that Josh appears to be better than those two.

    Me personally, I don’t know anything about him at all. Other than he seems to LOVE the PACK!

  4. primacyone 03/24/2009 at 2:15 PM #

    Sidney Lowe discovered John Wall!

  5. BladenWolf 03/24/2009 at 2:25 PM #

    “Change has to begin with the AD.” Agreed. But it probably has to start higher to change the AD.” – old13

    That’s why I said “until the dollars dry up and the big boys take notice…”

    Oblinger will not do what needs to be done because he frankly doesn’t give a shit. It will have to come from the WPC (read: Murphy and the other red blazers).

  6. wolfmans brother. 03/24/2009 at 2:26 PM #

    “I don’t understand why we can’t take a wait and see approach.”

    Because that’s precisely what we have been doing. over. and over. and over. and over again. We are all reasonably intelligent people on here. However, even the most dim of intellects can identify repeating patterns and forecast expected future behavior from those patterns. Will it forecast perfectly every time….no, but at this point, what rational logical basis can we have to EXPECT things to just somehow miraculously pan out roses? Outside relying on blind optimism, I see no indicator that things are supposedly heading in the right direction. Nothing. The point being that negativity at this point in time is absolutely justifiable and rational.

    I’m tired of this notion that I should somehow hold my tounge and sit by and “accept” horrible performance. Sid is very well compensated to perform the job that he has, as is Fowler, etc. We have hashed the accountability mantra to death on here, but the fact is there is none. I can assure you that if i worked with 11 other people and I was the only one to not achieve some statistical modicum of success in a three year period….I would not have a job. That we are the only ACC team not to go to the NCAA’s since Sid has been here is pathetic and I don’t feel like I have to feel bad about holding him accountable for that, nor should anyone.

  7. Justin Gainey 03/24/2009 at 2:28 PM #

    John Wall will go to Memphis. i don’t know why he is holding out from announcing it other than getting more free visits to schools and being pampered. We all know where he is going, why wait until the third week of April. I guess he just wants to be a big Grand Finale and wants all the attention drawn to him. CJ Leslie will be the next recruit we lose to Memphis, and who knows, harrow might decommit and go there also.

  8. choppack1 03/24/2009 at 2:29 PM #

    primacy – I don’t do a lot of defending of Lowe, but I don’t really think it’s fair to criticize the signing of someone you haven’t seen play. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again – it is encouraging that he put up 25 ppg.

    I do share the concern that we are not getting enough big men on the roster.

  9. Afterglow 03/24/2009 at 2:53 PM #

    ^^Don’t get me wrong; I think it would be great if John Wall signed with us. I would be as happy as a puppy with two peters if he pulled a 180 on Memphis and surprised us. Just as well, I’m fine with moving on from the John Wall saga. Who knows why he’s waiting-personally, I don’t care. As for CJ Leslie, I don’t want to spend the whole year speculating on him either. And if Harrow blows up, we may encounter the same “opening of recruitment” with him as well.

    Spotting the talent is just as important as selling the program, maintaining the relationship and landing the talent. We’ll see how Lowe does but he has to prove himself in short order otherwise, it’s only a matter of time before recruits see his shortcomings.

  10. Noah 03/24/2009 at 3:14 PM #

    WHAT EXACTLY WOULD EVERYONE LIKE SID TO DO RIGHT NOW? IF YOU WERE SID, WHAT WOULD YOU DO???

    Resign. Go away. Go back to the NBA and never darken these doors again.

    Seriously.

    If you can’t recruit at a very high level, you can’t coach in the ACC. People are mad because I said that the lowest-ranked incoming recruit in the ACC next year won’t help us. And some people are saying, “Maybe he’ll be like Googs.”

    Yes, maybe he’ll become a lottery pick and a future olympian. Maybe he’ll become a 6-10, 250 pound power forward who puts up 18 and 10 in the NBA every night.

    That’s probably a much more realistic future for a guy so lowly-regarded that when he committed, the people who evaluate these players for a living all said, “Um..who? What?”

    Silly me.

  11. Clarksa 03/24/2009 at 3:19 PM #

    “Been There / Done That: http://basketballrecruiting.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=926443

    I posted for the Georgetown information, but there is a C J Leslie mention.”

    It is interesting that Memphis is known for its “up-tempo” offense which scored an average of 74.7…a whole 1.7pts above our pathetic, boring NBA offense.

  12. Noah 03/24/2009 at 3:20 PM #

    primacy – I don’t do a lot of defending of Lowe, but I don’t really think it’s fair to criticize the signing of someone you haven’t seen play. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again – it is encouraging that he put up 25 ppg.

    You know who Derek Lowe is? He pitches for the Braves now. He was with the Red Sox a couple of years ago. When he was in high school in Michigan, he was an all-state player in baseball, basketball, football and golf. He hit .470 as a senior in baseball.

    Dan Shaughnessy was talking to him one day and asked him about hitting .470 and asked if he could have made the majors as a hitter.

    Lowe shook his head and said, “It’s high school. Didn’t everyone hit .470?”

    That’s sort of how I feel about kids scoring 20 points a game. That’s great. But it’s high school. It doesn’t translate.

  13. pakfanistan 03/24/2009 at 3:24 PM #

    We could just wait and see, rather than having a personal mental situation about it.

    Two of the big stars in the ACC right now weren’t highly rated. He might not turn out to be the next Googs, but maybe he could be the next Jared Dudley.

  14. PoppaJohn 03/24/2009 at 3:29 PM #

    Wow, I look at the probable roster for next year and can only think of two words to say … Bye Sid

  15. Pack Leader 03/24/2009 at 3:35 PM #

    “Resign. Go away. Go back to the NBA and never darken these doors again.

    Seriously. ”

    lets get real, that wont happen

    would you quit your high paying, no accountablity job for a lesser paying assistant job if none of your bosses ever put any pressure on you???

    me either…

  16. wolfmans brother. 03/24/2009 at 3:37 PM #

    What exactly is the point in waiting and seeing? We know how this story ends. Chapters 1 through 3 kinda gave it away. I don’t see any surprise plot twists coming to light absent the inroduction of a new character by the name of John Wall, and even that will only prolong the inevitable conclusion. Maybe it’s me, but I honestly don’t understand why everyone isn’t negative right now. At some point you have to say yeah, the glass is half full…..but it’s half full of shit.

  17. pakfanistan 03/24/2009 at 3:44 PM #

    What exactly is the point in waiting and seeing?

    What else are you going to do? Sit on a message board and bitch?

  18. wolfmans brother. 03/24/2009 at 3:55 PM #

    Yes, because bitching is more productive than abject complacency. If enough people are vocal about their displeasure….even on message boards or with their donations….heads turn.

  19. Afterglow 03/24/2009 at 3:58 PM #

    What exactly is the point in waiting and seeing?

    “Dude… did Cartmen just crap treasure?”

    You never know…

  20. choppack1 03/24/2009 at 4:05 PM #

    Noah – If Derek Lowe had a high school batting average of .470 – I wouldn’t say that he couldn’t hit. I have no idea what hitting in .470 in Michigan meant. But I have been following (albeit casually) North Carolina High School basketball long enough to realize that there are lots of quality basketball players who don’t hit the rankings but end up being great players. And I’m not saying that he will be a great player – I realize the odds are against. I’m only saying it’s kind of foolish for me to weigh in on a kid I haven’t seen play when he’s putting up 25 PPG.

    Heck, Tim Wells averaged like 12 PPG his senior year in Winston – and he contributed his freshmen year. Marcus Melvin averaged 14 PPG his senior year in high school – and averaged almost the same thing his sophomore year.

  21. 61Packer 03/24/2009 at 4:07 PM #

    This is great stuff to read after getting home from work, but one thing I haven’t heard about so far is State’s OOC home schedule next season. Anyone know who the next platter of cupcakes will be? This, to me, is going to be the key to whether or not we have to suffer into a FIFTH year of Lowe & Company, because if State can rack up enough OOC home wins against the Gardner-Webbs, the ODUs, and the UNCWs, regardless of another subpar ACC mark as long as he can win 5 or 6 ACC games, the Wolfpack Gods will say “He’s improving, he needs more time”, and they’ll give him another year. Had State played just an “average” OOC schedule last season, their mark would’ve been more like 12-18, and THAT might have gotten Lowe out of here by now. But I guarentee you, just you watch, that with the godawful OOC home schedule we’ll have, 10 wins will be no problem. And this could go on even longer than it did with HWSNBMITC.

    And that’s what I predict will happen again. We have a coach who flat isn’t going to quit and an administration who won’t fire him, unless he comes up with an 8-20 record. The only way we will ever be good again I think is when we have an entirely different cast of LTR seatholders in the lower level of the RBC Center. And whoever gets my 2 seats after next season, good luck.

  22. Classof89 03/24/2009 at 4:11 PM #

    I find it hard to imagine how our schedule could be any WEAKER next year…I suppose we could schedule the entire MEAC except for Hampton and Morgan State… Maybe a couple of bottom feeder Atlantic Sun conference teams…

  23. wolfmans brother. 03/24/2009 at 4:33 PM #

    I’m not as worried about our OOC schedule as the talent level on our team and on the sidelines.

  24. TheCOWDOG 03/24/2009 at 5:04 PM #

    CHOP: I can’t quote your whole passage, but ’cause we’re on the same wavelength…let me do this. ( And watch the Casper act.)

    “If you can’t recruit at a very high level, you can’t coach in the ACC.” Circa Noah.

    Exhibit A: Gary Williams.

    Exhibit B: Clev ST. ,Wisco, Mich, USC (with pause)

    Bunch of well known boys with that bunch.

    “That’s sort of how I feel about kids scoring 20 points a game. That’s great. But it’s high school. It doesn’t translate.” Circa Noah.

    How the hell do you know whether it translates or not? Last I knew, you don’t “translate” ’til your out of high school and get a shot at another level.

    There isn’t a scout alive that knows anything contrary to that. There are can’t miss’s all over time. And more “where did he come from” aplenty

  25. Wulfpack 03/24/2009 at 5:49 PM #

    I heard that Steph Curry’s brother at Liberty is transfering. Early word is VT (where the elder Curry shined), WFU, and us. I’ll dig for more info.

Leave a Reply