Judgment Day… IS ON

For some years now discussion among those of us who want Sendek out the door always includes one name: Barnes.

Most of us remember the Barnes of Clemson, the coach who took what was supposed to be the worst team in ACC history and … won with it. The Barnes who wasn’t afraid to get up in the face of Dean Smith, Gut and the rest of the Chapel Hill sachems. The Barnes who grew up in Hickory and loves NC State.

Well, now that Texas and Barnes have eked out what appears to a surprisingly difficult win over the Ivy League, Judgment Day is approaching for all of us: Sendek, we alleged “Herb Haters,” and our old friends the Herb Sendek Sunshine Squad. Barnes v. Sendek, for all the move-on marbles in the NCAA.

Personally, I think Texas will advance and will beat Sendek like a red-headed stepchild. Even Sendek’s patented – and infuriating – habit of pulling out victories just before he has to polish his resume won’t save him here. Save a win, that is. The sad thing is, Fowler and the rest of the HSSSers will argue that this California win, Herb’s first in the past five tries, is reason for keeping him on. We’ve all seen that movie before, you see.

Either way, and even though the HSSSers won’t admit it, the battle between these two coaches should be telling. My money’s on the Man from Hickory.

ADDENDUM: I am wondering – does the relative difficulty against Penn signal matchup problems against the Pack? We shall see … and I’ll leave the analysis there to the X and O guys!

General NCS Basketball

77 Responses to Judgment Day… IS ON

  1. Jeff D(BostonWolf) 03/17/2006 at 11:56 PM #
  2. jesse 03/18/2006 at 12:00 AM #

    i love it! the herb haters can’t even agree to what extent they hate herb!

  3. Jeff D(BostonWolf) 03/18/2006 at 12:02 AM #

    And in a twist, someone just EZIMd me and accused me of being anti-Herb for locking pro-Herb threads.

    I must be doing something right.

  4. Cardiff Giant 03/18/2006 at 12:07 AM #
  5. RedFred 03/18/2006 at 12:07 AM #

    Jesse

    I have tried to be concillatory but you are just not reachable. Did you see the Seton Hall game right after that impressive game against Duke. It was right back to square one, nobody carried any confidence into that game that should have carried over from the Duke game that was just a few nights before. Up, down, Up,down, Up, way down.

    Tonight’s game could have been a 15 point win if that was the way they were ALLOWED to play all year.

  6. Cardiff Giant 03/18/2006 at 12:09 AM #
  7. PACDADDY 03/18/2006 at 12:11 AM #

    Since you’re so insightful and have a clear view of the future. Did you post a blog predicting the collapse? Maybe I missed it…

    I’ve been here trying to understand the “otherside”, while we were top 15 and 2nd in conference. Clearly you should be able to see the frustration I must feel when we “collapsed” after spending so much time trying to “understand” the irrational thoughts on this blog.

    I should be more upset than you and others, because I didn’t expect it and you did…damn…you know what?…I probably am more upset.

    Fire Fowler for putting me through this!

  8. Jeff D(BostonWolf) 03/18/2006 at 12:14 AM #
  9. dan 03/18/2006 at 12:15 AM #

    Cardiff, like I said, I’m not trying to pile on or bash your site. It’s just that trying to deny a negative spin on your post doesn’t make much sense to me. You clearly feel negative about the team and coach (and admit it), and clearly it came out tonight. Why get defensive about it? Is it ok for others to feel positive after tonight’s game?

    For the most part, you guys do a GREAT job at trying to quantify your opinions. That’s why I read your site; to better understand your perspective. But when things deteriorate, it gets ugly. On both sides.

    Honestly, I just figured it’s Friday and St Pats Day, so you were probably drinking when you wrote all of this.

  10. BJD95 03/18/2006 at 12:16 AM #

    I was nauseous as soon as I saw this potential matchup in the bracket for this very reason. It’s going to be two very, very unpleasant days on the internet. Various barbs being shot back and forth, etc. More about calling out and drawing lines in the sand against the other “faction.”

    If we play like we played today, we CAN beat Texas. I think they’d beat us 8 or 9 times out of 10, but they are quite capable of laying the proverbial turd, like they did in the Big 12 final, or tonight against Penn.

    And, on the broader topic, Sunday’s game – while it will be painted as a titanic coaching showdown – I certainly don’t want Barnes b/c of a win Sunday, nor would I change my mind about wanting Sendek to move on if we win. Barnes has had better regular seasons, and better NCAAT success. He should have won a conference title by now (like Sendek should have), which is his Achilees’ heel. Sendek needs three more consecutive wins to get on par with Barnes’ NCAAT record.

    My best guess on what WILL happen? Texas will win a hard-fought, close game. It will be enough for some to say that we’re moving in the right direction, etc. – but not enough to really satisfy. It will be yet another B-minus season, which is becoming as predictable as the sunrise.

    Also, I don’t see how anyone could POSSIBLY consider this season to be great. Pretty good, sure, I could see that. But GREAT? That’s a seriously warped view of what greatness entails. I know NC State hasn’t produced much greatness in many of our adult lifetimes, but we should still be able to recognize what it is!

    Anyway, I’m very happy for our players, especially Cam. What a great play he made at the end.

  11. jesse 03/18/2006 at 12:16 AM #

    well show me a team that goes thru a year without bad performances. yes herb has had some bad games this year no doubt. i concede that he is not the greatest in late game situations and he is not particularly good at adapting and changing schemes during the game. but show me a coach who doesn’t have some imperfections. even the almighty coach k has some problems i.e. blowing big leads in the tourney and hardly ever using his bench

  12. Cardiff Giant 03/18/2006 at 12:17 AM #

    Pacdaddy, understand something: I am not your enemy.

    Personally, I think Fowler is THE problem with the athletic program in general. Across the board, and in every sport. On this, it seems we agree.

    I can well understand your position of never predicting State to lose. I just don’t choose to follow it. To coin your phrase, I think it’s irrational.

    As for this:

    “Did you post a blog predicting the collapse? Maybe I missed it…”

    No. I predicted two losses to UNC – and that prediction can be confirmed by many people – and a Sendek swoon. The only thing I missed was the timing of the swoon.

  13. Cardiff Giant 03/18/2006 at 12:21 AM #
  14. dan 03/18/2006 at 12:26 AM #

    To get back to your original post….what will Sunday’s game tell us? In the grand scheme of things, I’d argue very little.
    – Nothing significant will change in the statistics compiled re: Sendek, regardless of outcome.
    – I can’t imagine your feelings for Sendek will change, win or lose. Same probably goes for anyone with a strong opinion about him.
    – Will the admin/AD think of the game as a job interview for Barnes? I can’t imagine that.

    Sure, it’s going to be a fun game because of Barnes. But I just don’t see much beyond that.

  15. RedFred 03/18/2006 at 12:26 AM #

    ^
    PACDADDY

    I’ve stated this before. All I want to do is to be able to sit down BEFORE, BEFORE is an important word here, a basketball game and have at least half an idea of what kind of team I think I am pulling for. If they are going to stink, then thats all I expect. If they look like potential world beaters with talent to compete with anyone, then that is what I expect to see their coach give them an opportunity to do, EVERY NIGHT! Not just here and there.

  16. BJD95 03/18/2006 at 12:31 AM #

    ^^ Dan, I agree with you, except for the “fun” part. I don’t think it will be fun at all. This matchup is the last thing our already splintered, battered, and bruised fanbase needed.

  17. BJD95 03/18/2006 at 12:34 AM #

    PACDADDY, I did not predict the collapse, but I did note frequently that the team hadn’t really played at a high level since mid-January, even when we were winning. I consistently maintained that the pattern needed to change, or march was going to be very dissatisfying.

    Tonight, we played with the intensity, focus, and passion of the late December/early January team. The one that I said could accomplish great things. I’m glad that it came back, at least for one night. But it’s quite hollow unless it shows up again, and produces a few more NCAAT victories.

  18. Cardiff Giant 03/18/2006 at 12:38 AM #

    “Sure, it’s going to be a fun game because of Barnes. But I just don’t see much beyond that.”

    That’s what makes it so fascinating. It will, as BJD says, continue to split the fanbase (this win tonight has brought some of the waverers back into the fold, which is amazing to me, but never mind). But … Barnes, the coach probably MOST mentioned by those who want Sendek replaced, versus SENDEK? You couldn’t create more drama with a tactical nuclear weapon. Great stuff.

  19. dan 03/18/2006 at 12:41 AM #

    BJD95, sorry for effectively repeating your post. You said it much better than I could have.

    Cardiff, we’re degenerating here, but if you don’t consider you post negative, then I guess that’s my bad for misinterepting. Note, negative doesn’t mean “wrong” or “not a true fan” or anything like that. It just, well, negative.

  20. Cardiff Giant 03/18/2006 at 12:42 AM #

    ^ OK, that’s fine. You have a right to your opinion.

  21. RedFred 03/18/2006 at 12:42 AM #

    dan Says:

    March 18th, 2006 at 12:15 am

    “You clearly feel negative about the team….”

    “The team” is not the problem and I don’t think Cardiff or anyone has else led you to think any of us here believe that. For that matter, we haven’t convinced you of anything that you didn’t already have your mind up on before you even logged on tonight.

  22. dan 03/18/2006 at 12:49 AM #

    RedFred, please, let it go.

  23. dan 03/18/2006 at 12:56 AM #

    “That’s what makes it so fascinating. It will, as BJD says, continue to split the fanbase (this win tonight has brought some of the waverers back into the fold, which is amazing to me, but never mind). But … Barnes, the coach probably MOST mentioned by those who want Sendek replaced, versus SENDEK? You couldn’t create more drama with a tactical nuclear weapon. Great stuff.”

    Two things about this:

    1. It’s not clear to me any more splitting of the fanbase can occur.

    2. Again, it’ll be fun. But telling?

    In fact, I think the Barnes/Sendek match-up could end up being the less important storyline. ‘Pack wins, and you’re going to hear alot of “Two consecutve sweet 16’s” coming from the pro-Sendek camps. If he loses, it clearly reinforces the rational arguements against Coach Sendek (i.e. he can take us to the tournament, but not do anything when he gets there).

  24. PACDADDY 03/18/2006 at 1:00 AM #

    BJD95..you did say that, but that’s normal. Teams adjust over the course of a season and we have off nights.

    Look…Duke should have lost 3-4 games more than they did…they struggled. We had IE 50% AGAINST UNC and didn’t practice for the last month and it clearly affected his play.

    Losing Bennerman at end of BC game hurt. We basically had 2 seniors and Bethal struggle for a couple of these games.

    We lost games to some pretty good teams and we weren’t 100%.

    Everyone seems to forget Costner…he could have developed into quite a player by now. Ben probably wouldn’t have seen the court this season had Costner been playing.

    I’m not saying these injuries were the reason why we lost, but they had a lot more to do with it than poor coaching on Herbs part.

    Teams started putting pressure on Bethal and Atsur. Ced disappeared at times. You can look at him and see great improvement, but he still struggles on postioning down low or making silly fouls.

    Most of what has happened at the end of the season had MOSTLY NOTHING to do with the coach… BUT…it is his team…injuries, shooting slumps, stupid turnovers, and poor rebounding is all about adjusting so Herb does deserve some fan backlash…but not to the extent he’s recieving.

    I agree with this statemnt 100%..

    “Tonight, we played with the intensity, focus, and passion of the late December/early January team. The one that I said could accomplish great things. I’m glad that it came back, at least for one night. But it’s quite hollow unless it shows up again, and produces a few more NCAAT victories.”

    Herb needs to produce this season!

  25. william 03/18/2006 at 1:02 AM #

    Guys, enjoy the win. You have all spring to worry about this stuff. NCSU had a damn good win and the ACC is starting to look like a hell of a lot tougher place to play than the Little 12 Conference where Rick Barnes sort of coaches. And to all you Wolf Pack fans who howled about the conference tournament, ask yourselves just how much good it did Kansas? Would you really rather win the frickin’ ACC tournament and lose in the first round?

Leave a Reply