Gonna Need a Clean Piece of Paper

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    Rye? Have you been hacking my Emails?


    Great minds or idiots one……….


    Great minds or idiots one……….

    Well let’s see…

    We started out with Mr. Dog asking for some toilet paper…
    and we had movement all the way to a two party political campaign in less than 48hrs…
    that’s better than Kale …

    One the one hand, we have the “Make NC STATE Great Again” folks who are proposing a two year stopgap plan that proposes to get our financial ship right for the future. Let’s call them the Whites.

    On the other hand, we have the “Open Door, Let’s Celebrate our Diversity” folks who are proposing a long range plan that radically changes the landscape and culture of NC STATE football. Let’s call them the Reds.

    To be clear, BOTH the Reds and the Whites love the history and tradition of NCSTATE, a fact neither side disputes — they just see totally different futures.

    The Whites are rich, like minded and few in number and, at best, only replacing themselves. The Reds are many, diverse in their thinking and poor (compared to the Whites), and are multiplying by the thousands every May.

    Paradoxically, the “Make NC STATE Great Again” plan is based solely on increased property taxes on the rich (the Whites) that effectively keeps the Reds out.

    The “Open Door, Let’s Celebrate our Diversity” plan proposes to lower property taxes on the Whites while leaving them their privileged seats and replaces the lost revenue with a Flat Sales Tax where everybody pays their fair share that results in a healthy increase in total revenues.

    On the backside, there have already been hints of subterfuge and hacked emails…

    Who knows where the hell this goes next???

    Ya’ll have fun with it.


    #NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!

    Bill: Interesting that you see two camps. I see one — what is best for NC State. I don’t see a lot of disagreement that DD isn’t it.

    I think there are a lot of questions in the situation:
    – How much money do we really have?
    – How much do we think Yow can hire someone good?
    – Can we afford a buy out?
    – Can we afford an improvement?


    ^Most all Reds and Whites are in general agreement that the current way of running the football business needs an major overhaul and if that includes management personnel, so be it.

    As for the rest… ah…
    the devil is in the details… for both plans.

    #NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!

    Bill, I like that you are persistently pushing this idea that I simply chuckled at in your first post and actually have me brainstorming.
    Add a drawing each game for one lucky fan to attempt an in-game field goal. You add a new wrinkle in the game that will bring outside attention and be an extra draw to get fans to the game.


    So, today, I did some serious (well not really) analyzing of the alternative plan. I picked up some key points….

    If you like your FB team and Coach, you can KEEP your FB team and Coach.

    We have to FUND the plan to know what is IN the plan….

    We need a Booster Club that actually “boosts” our athletic program and provides direct and hidden benefits so that we can prosper.

    If we party like it is 1999, then why have a ticket….we paid our $$’s at the gate.

    There were other nuances that I probably missed……..but it was amusing….



    It started as a joke…
    It was a really slow and 100% negative day at the office so I was looking for a place to think positively…
    that’s all…

    But damn, the thing has legs…

    and will evoke the predictable responses from those who may feel threatened by new ideas and outside the box thinking that changes the status quo…

    which means “IT REALLY has legs!”

    and for those folks… just two business questions…

    1. There’s this “cost center” named “Parking Lots” which are totally underutilized… How do we make it a “profit center” and maximize it’s revenue potential?

    2. What’s your 5-10-20 year plan to sell your value added products to people who don’t think like you do, while at the same, NOT bastardizing your traditional core market segments?



    #NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!

    ‘B’rer ‘Roo…

    Let me say first, I personally have the utmost respect for what you and many others have done over the years to support NCSTATE atheltics thru the Wolfpack Club.

    And I’ll admit it, everyone of ya’ll can call me a SOB if you want too — I, like many others, checked out in 1990 and haven’t sent one dime to Rawlee since…

    And fwiw… I did the same with the Alumni Assoc about the same time over the restructuring of the Park Scholarships.

    To paraphase a certain political candidate… “I did NOT pay my taxes, because the rules allowed me not to…I did not make the rules.”

    Nevertheless, I hold no malice…

    I’ve gone to my one football game and my one basketball game on average every 2 years since my abdication…. and enjoyed everyone of them, regardless of the score. You are dead right when you bring up the “Social” dimension of the game.

    On the other hand, the University has been damn glad and well pleased for forty years with guys like me and you who traveled and worked all over the country and told those folks proudly…. I graduated from NCState.

    For this, the University has never given either one of us — one dime…

    So I’m thinking, me and the University after all these years are “even”.

    That being said…

    The RED plan proposes that the University…
    1. Buyback from you WPC guys all LTRs and lets you keep your current seats for as long as you want them.
    2. Take over all the athletic scholarships in place and continue to grant new ones at current NCAA rates from their coffers, not the pockets of WPC members.

    Then, the WPC can do what it does best… the traveling roadshows and gameday stuff that truly UNITE the Wolfpack nation…. for which the University will pay the WPC 100% of its costs.

    What the WPC does with the remainder of the endowment is up to the WPC members.

    3. Assumes/refinances in the University’s name… all loans made by WPC for “improvements” on campus.

    Then we party like 1999….


    #NCSU-North Carolina's #1 FOOTBALL school!

    Downtown Abbey on DVD, say good bye to the losers in Raleigh.



    BOTB, interesting that you said you “checked out” in 1990. I was on a trip back home to Craven County in 1991, and stopped by Wilber Shirley’s place in Goldsboro…(Wilber’s Barbecue). Wilber has a picture of V as you enter the restaurant. I was at the counter eating, and Wilber came and sat down beside me. We struck up a conversation of things relating to NC State (based on the shirt I was wearing), and he said that he will always be a fan, but he would never send another dime to Rawlee because of how they treated V. Decisions have a long lasting affect, which is what (I’m afraid) the administration will never understand. Wilber Shirley makes some damn good barbecue, and think of the impact it has had on his life. I have never forgotten that conversation, on a happenstance afternoon on my way home.


    I’ve never given them a dime, never will.

    Occasionally I’ll send them a retort when they ask for money. Such retorts usually spare me another letter asking for money until the next fresh face attempts to cultivate “lost” alumni and then I get another letter which calls for another retort which assures no other letter until…….you get my point.

    They just don’t know what the hell they are doing. They are even bad at being disingenuous, with clowns like the Raleigh cabal at play even bad used car salesmen appear to be Tony Robbins up close.

    I’ve always thought the damn place should be wiped clean from the AD all the way down to the assholes running the botany labs who required us to HAND WRITE the lab practicals back to them prior to the lab.


    On to season 3.



    CowDog: Any chance that idea has legs?


    CowDog: Any chance that idea has legs?

    Well, first and foremost… y’all still have that 8 tucked away, right? OK. Then ya have to go on the scuttlebutt of some former teammates, miles closer to the program than moi. Guys who sometimes rub elbows with names plastered on buildings and such.

    Kitchings gets alotta play in those circles, but I get the feeling certain individuals are aiming higher. Obviously, wallets will need to be opened wide.

    There’s a sh#@ton more involved that I can’t say in a public forum, but that’s because I don’t know diddly, first person, and it would be totally irresponsible to yap in here.

    Come to think of it, it’d be even more irresponsible if what I’ve been told was 1st person.
    Know what I mean?

    …So, until all possibility for this is exhausted;

    I gotta let it ride.


    Cowdog: Completely understand. I can read between the lines there. I don’t know if you have access to our email addresses given you are a moderator, but feel free to drop me a line sometime if you want to chat more privately.


    Man, such wasted time and energy, when reality is 2 more wins at most. I saw DD on tv ,said State was a few plays from 7-1 . Nothing will change and he’ll be back. Bring on BB.


    That’s the problem aint it.

    Funny, I saw a blurb that DD was 2-4 against P5 schools + ecu and Notre Dame in games less than 1 score. Bump that up to 8 which reflects the opportunity to tie and he is 2-5.

    Now here’s where you run into the query of – well, we are in more close games right? Remarkably, in his first 3 years we were in 3 close games with the same category of schools. So, in a weird way, it’s improving.

    The next 4 should tell us all we need to know. Are we on a slow, but real road to improvement – ie Sendekian progress….or have we seen the summit of the DD era? (Year 2).

    I still can’t get over his implication that our squad had to execute to perfection to beat a team with a 12 game conference losing streak.


    BTOB, et. al.,

    I guess living in Raleigh, the “effort” that goes into attending WPC and WP functions is not a bad as driving in from out of town. If we did, then I would pop (and that would cost me BIG TIME….think almost 6 figures) for a MH Pass.

    As to the University….I gave up on the Alumni Association circa 1990. They were the Administrators of the Caldwell Scholarships. My son was the “first out” in 1988 or so. His roomie, since they placed the Caldwell Applicants in the same dorm or floor, was one. That kid stayed a Caldwell scholar and collected all the $$’s for about 2 years. His GPA was lower than mine (OK…I did go LOWER one semester when I had a 0.33…that is NO TYPO). BUT, I partied 10X more than the norm in 1999.

    I never forgave the University for how they treated Jimmy V. I did keep up my WPC membership. When we got closer in 1978 to Raleigh, I started going to FB games and took my kids. Eventually, I bought Season tickets. I upped that for my BIL and his wife to 4. I had to go to the LTR (and they did as well) to keep them. SO, that is FB.

    My wife loves BB. We had Seasons for a while, but when I started to travel, it was NOT economically viable. When I retired, I bought HER two LTR’s….which morphed into the Champions Club….and that multiplied into 4.

    In the interim, my BIL’s son and wife (stellar CHEM ENG Grads) bought two LTR’s and two additional Season….then the Season were up for grabs and he converted to LTR for his Brother or Friends or Family or perhaps, little ones….so we have 8 LTR’s in FB in our Block.

    Other than my WPC dues and some “targeted” gifts for some V stuff and Reynolds, most of my contributions go to charities and church…and V gets a big percentage. Folks like RJ Sweezy (whom I know as I played FB with his dad) and Philip Rivers have Foundations….so I give to them. I also made a nice donation to Chris Combs’ Foundation (or whatever).

    We enjoy the entertainment (and endure the frustrations). We go to some of the other functions as well and have a circle of quasi-friends that we see “socially” there.

    There are a LOT of folks that cut off NCSU and that is their call. I have my reasons….and that is my call.

    The focus of this was, I thought, a real problem question….but it morphed. Yes, the joke took legs.

    Maybe it was comic relief. But, when the sun sets tonight and I am putting up my kayak, the reality will be that we have an UGLY chance of being 4 and 8 this year….and 6 and 6 is looking slimmer every day. THAT, is totally unacceptable.

    We could have hired a LOT of role models for the team to counsel them. We certain have a great, from a character and personality standpoint, one in Coach Doeren. The “Boy Scout” or the “Admiral” or as AD Yow called him, Coach O’Brien was also one. I will NOT talk about our OTHER major $$ revenue sport…

    Bottom line, he is not living up to even 50% of our expectations. One good year, out of four, would be grounds for change if we were a company.

    AD Yow tries to run the AD as a business…and it is time that some performance reviews are done.

    My point, pure and simple, was to see if our business model would support that. And also, using the brain trust here, check my logic.

    Lest ye think that someone that got a A in ROTC and a D in PE be somewhat “ill equipped” to do business planning, I would add that AFTER I got married and quit “going out to hunt…”, I was mid Dean’s List for my last two years. And I did OK in the business world….professionally and from a personal satisfaction standpoint….

    What will happen, I dare not speculate….but no one has answered by question….

    Would a WP Fan pay $3 MORE for each ticket for 3 years to “remove” Coach Doeren?

    Would a WP Fan pay and ADDITIONAL $4 MORE for each ticket to “up the ante” so that we paid the NEW coach 50% MORE than Doeren and that was “in the range” of what “The Hat” collects down the road?

    Maybe one of the Keymasters can check my numbers. Maybe THAT needs to be the NEW poll….?

    Gotta take the wife and find a lake and get rid of some frustrations with a paddle…


    ^In this day and age you have to be careful with your words. You’re liable to have someone looking at the bottom of the lake for a bludgeoned woman.

    On the question of “8”: just curious which side of the ledger that number needs to be on for it to become a magic number.


    Packer: With the 8’s and 4’s comments, it feels like the answer is to get to 8.




    Como me dicen.


    Dang cow – you are good…I would be shocked if we got to 7-6 even.


    I live up in Northern Virginia in the Shenandoah Valley and graduated from State in 1992 and heard directly from the father of one of the top 5 linebacker prospects that coach Doreen was a real arrogant jerk to his son on a recruiting visit. Here’s the kicker… this top prospect’s dad also graduated from NC State and after the visit said his son said he would not consider going to State! How’s that for a kick in the teeth. This kid, a 6’5″ 230b kid, goes to the same high school as my son and is an A-B student, captain of the football team, and an all around nice guy, as is his dad. For Doreen to behave arrogantly toward this guy and his sone when he wanted to attend NC State is unbelievable! In the end, he chose Penn State and will be attending under full scholarship next year. This was not even a swing and a miss… it was not even trying! Sad… I am actually hoping we lose all of the rest of our games, except UNC of course, to get him out the door.


    This last post makes no sense without more information. If the guy was recruited,then WTF. DD may not be the best coach, but I have met him, and he’s not an A hole.


    The number of Fathers feeling their child was scorned on the recruiting trail could reforest the Amazon.

    I know, ’cause I’ve been guilty, too. Wound up as a Banyon tree, somewhere in Ceylon, though.

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