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Thank you, erichack! Bravo!
*At this juncture I’d like to remind some folks of a basic rule in SFN: Keep it civil. I let a couple posts stand, ’cause I didn’t see them in the moment. Carry on-CD.
So it would seem that the logic that is being used to justify the disrespect of the flag, anthem and nation would be that since they said it was something different it must be different.
Would this same logic hold if someone displayed and waved a confederate battle flag on MLK day at a MLK rally in honor of MLK. They would just need to say they were doing it in honor of what was accomplished because of the sacrifices and leadership of MLK. Would that be ok as long it was explained that there was no disrespect intended but actually honor.
Would they be believed or would it be more like don’t piss on my head and tell me it’s raining?
Standing up if able with hats off at least, not talking and usually hand over the heart in public when the flag is displayed and the National anthem is sung has traditionally been in honor and respect of the nation and those who bravely served.
I imagine most people would stand out of respect when another nations anthem is played unless they wanted to show disrespect.
Colin Kaepernick started off by sitting until someone talked him out of it. He mentioned specifically the flag and the country in his statement about why he was sitting. So yes they are protesting the flag and the country. That is what was mentioned specifically. He does not respect them and wanted to show it.
“I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color,” Kaepernick told NFL Media in an exclusive interview after the game. “To me, this is bigger than football and it would be selfish on my part to look the other way. There are bodies in the street and people getting paid leave and getting away with murder.”
Came across this article just confirming this league is full of trash:
http://www.dailywire.com/news/21476/who-needs-rules-nfl-player-arrested-every-7-days-joseph-curl
Bye bye, NFL! I’ll take my Sunday afternoons back.
I wonder how that graph would look when you compare it to high school grads with at least a semester of college.
When did kneeling become some gargantuan sign of disrespect? All my life Iāve been taught that kneeling is a sign of reverence.
DSD I never thought a big deal. I might disagree with the method of protest BUT it has always been nonviolent and I can understand some of the issues. I’m afraid it is now a “thing” rather than a heartfelt protest – maybe I’m wrong. I am boycotting the NFL for the crappy product on the field not what players do before they play.
Chop, we could slice and dice that data a thousand ways and I don’t think it would tell us a lot (I hope) we don’t already know. We might not want to admit it though. Also, if we’re going down that road then we need to take a closer look at all of the variables that created the environment in which “they” grew up in.
Btw, did anyone really think the NFL was a bunch of choir boys? Pretty sure we’ve all known about the behavior, arrests, etc. for a long time. Bringing it up now and making it a big deal feels like trying to justify stop watching the NFL. Just turn off the TV.
I still think this all of this pales in comparison to how the NFL has handled concussions, i.e., health and welfare of their own players. Then again, maybe as long as the players are able to stand for the anthem, it isn’t really such a big deal. š
In the end it is a workplace issue. The workplace being the televised games. I as a consumer have the right to watch or not as I wish. If the NFL, the owners and the teams are fine with the “protests” well and good. If you are not change the channel. THAT will influence things more than anything else. $$$ matter.
Look, this explains the level of education we are dealing with.
Take an knee, take a stand against…well quite frankly other than the goof ball prez I’m not sure what warrants a “stand” in our society, overall. Yet, keep leading with our helmets, violently destroying guys who are down with the crown of our helmets into their earholes when the NFL has identified CTE and is taking serious steps to protect players.
A protest is notādisrespecting the flagā anymore than not supporting a war is not supporting the troops.
This very well might be the most preposterous thing Iāve ever read on SFN.
We MUST be on different pages.. let me just let you clarify.. which protest are you speaking of?
Surely you arenāt speaking about the protest where the football players do not stand to show their respect for the flag and national anthem? Because THAT protestā¦ wellā¦ thatās their entire point of the protest. Not sure how to drive this home to you. Disrespecting the flag IS the fVcking protest!
This is why we can have an intelligent discussion.. absolute truth just gets entirely perverted, warped, and ultimately disregarded.
No, ATroll, it’s not different pages…it’s different wavelengths. Different planets. Different races. Different life experiences. So much untruth in what you say here and then you speak of absolute truth? Many blacks of all walks of life, including NFL players and most certainly some of NC State’s black athletes, are simply tired of seeing unarmed black men being shot and killed by police even when they may be INNOCENT, even when they OBEY the officer’s commands. Many whites are also protesting this. If you think this is not happening, you are either not paying attention or some bias within you blinds you to this ABSOLUTE FACT.
The protesting players are doing so in a respectful manner. You may not like it but you should be able to understand the need they feel to do SOMETHING to shine a light on racial inequity under the law, and kneeling instead of standing for the National Anthem is a way of making that statement. You want to protest this inequity another way? What do you suggest?
I think their protest is valid and on point and I support them in it. Those standing and those kneeling are all Americans and all of them are exercising their rights.Not sure just how often unarmed black men are being killed by police officers…if your point is that it happens, I can believe that…is it such a problem that all of america (flag) needs to be drug through the mud…NO…to be honest, not sure what events you are speaking of…what are the numbers…how often does this happen…and when it does how often does it go without any justice being dealt to those that would commit such a horrible crime…personally, I need specifics not generalities and certainly not media lies…at least I am not willing to just concede such a position when it is based on race bomb throwers that use this type of incendiary protests based on things like Ferguson, MO, which was clearly shown to be a situation where the police did NOT shoot an ‘innocent’ black male…and even when something like that does happen, ALL of America (flag) is what you protest?..are you suggesting we just burn down ALL of America?…
you want something to protest, then focus on the real problems like the black family unit…that is worth protesting…that is worth making a real effort to change…all of these wealthy NFL players need to put there efforts and money towards making a real effort to effect a change there…maybe, just maybe by doing so, kids will grow up in a secure family unit and not ever get anywhere close to a situation where a cop with a gun is even a possibility…
all of this protesting going on now is just bull**it…they are either hypocrits or fools for believing a lie…the lie that the problem is something does not point right back at there own behaviors…
NFL Players taking a knee and protesting equates to burning down ALL of America???
Erichack, how about a little greater perspective and a little less WAY over the top commentary.
No, ATroll, itās not different pagesā¦itās different wavelengths. Different planets. Different races. Different life experiences. So much untruth in what you say here and then you speak of absolute truth? Many blacks of all walks of life, including NFL players and most certainly some of NC Stateās black athletes, are simply tired of seeing unarmed black men being shot and killed by police even when they may be INNOCENT, even when they OBEY the officerās commands. Many whites are also protesting this. If you think this is not happening, you are either not paying attention or some bias within you blinds you to this ABSOLUTE FACT.
The protesting players are doing so in a respectful manner. You may not like it but you should be able to understand the need they feel to do SOMETHING to shine a light on racial inequity under the law, and kneeling instead of standing for the National Anthem is a way of making that statement. You want to protest this inequity another way? What do you suggest?
I think their protest is valid and on point and I support them in it. Those standing and those kneeling are all Americans and all of them are exercising their rights.Good enough.
I like the racial identity and racial unity aspect of their stance. I like it so much that other groups should respond in kind more racial unity in the face of offenses like the interracial rape issue (oh no, can’t speak about that!). It is a good thing these people protesting against the police (and let’s say it, white police) stand on racial unity while at the same time ignoring the rampant murder within the own community. Their “stand” (pun intended) is low hanging fruit or high cotton if you want to be provocative because if they had to drag their sorry black (and white two) a$$es back into the war zone known as the ghetto, the hood, etc to take a “stand” against the shooting of blacks they’d get shot, would be a waste of time or would require more time than 45 seconds during pre-game.
The great irony of this “protest”, and damn funny too, is that is was started by a mulatto raised in a white community whose entire interaction with ANY black community started in the last decade.
So racial unity and solidarity for all groups and that includes the whites.
Let’s see how it works out.
McCallum
Peaceful protest and respect for the First Amendment are the two guiding rules for everyone to remember. It is simply a lie to say that anyone is disrespecting whatever. I hope everyone saw some of Burn’s Vietnam War series, if you want to talk about protests.
I don’t have the time or frankly the interest to watch the NFL. I typically would watch the last few games of the year during the playoffs. This year, I won’t even do that. This country has been good to me and I didn’t earn it, it was earned long ago on many battle fields. Our flag and Nation Anthem are the symbols of our country that countless thousands have given their lives and limbs for. I have no interest in watching a bunch of spoiled over paid sports celebs make a protest or statement or whatever you want to call it by not honoring our national symbols during the time they are being paid to entertain. That’s my protest to the protest.
I served 20 years in the USAF under some Commander in Chiefs, including all the way back to Nixon, who I thought didn’t deserve my respect. But I always respected the office and not the man. Same with the flag for me. You stand and salute when it passes. I don’t always agree with what my country does and has done to many folks over the years, both at home and abroad, but it is the best country on earth. I really think the players could find a better outlet to exercise their “free speech”. Never understood having to tear down one group in order to build up another. And no matter what has been said above, I think most veterans would agree that kneeling during the National Anthem is disrespecting those that have worn the uniform and in particular those that have paid the ultimate price.
I think most veterans would agree that kneeling during the National Anthem is disrespecting those that have worn the uniform and in particular those that have paid the ultimate price.
Most veterans also generally vote for the party that is most likely to send them into harm’s way for good reason or bad. Veterans have been “indoctrinated” by their leaders who depend on war (and threat of war) for their advancement through the ranks.
The supremely disrespectful stance toward any country’s service people (those who fight and are wounded, captured, or killed) is to send them into harm’s way without a damn good and justified reason. Self enrichment or to stay in office is NOT a valid reason. Neither is American imperialism or the denial of self rule to the “enemy.” Yes, I watched Burns et al’s Viet Nam War. And I lived through that period but, fortunately, did not have to go there… or Canada (although, I did go to Buffalo for a couple of years and from there, visited Toronto <g>).
Good enough.
I like the racial identity and racial unity aspect of their stance. I like it so much that other groups should respond in kind more racial unity in the face of offenses like the interracial rape issue (oh no, canāt speak about that!). It is a good thing these people protesting against the police (and letās say it, white police) stand on racial unity while at the same time ignoring the rampant murder within the own community. Their āstandā (pun intended) is low hanging fruit or high cotton if you want to be provocative because if they had to drag their sorry black (and white two) a$$es back into the war zone known as the ghetto, the hood, etc to take a āstandā against the shooting of blacks theyād get shot, would be a waste of time or would require more time than 45 seconds during pre-game.
The great irony of this āprotestā, and damn funny too, is that is was started by a mulatto raised in a white community whose entire interaction with ANY black community started in the last decade.
So racial unity and solidarity for all groups and that includes the whites.
Letās see how it works out.
McCallum
There’s not a shovel big enough for the above.
Nothing short of diving in front of bullets would satisfy you.
Kaepernick is incredibly charitable.
The union announced Friday that on Sept. 7, Kaepernick gave $25,000 each to four charities, part of his pledge last year to donate $1 million to organizations working in oppressed communities.
The groups are DREAM, which provides after-school activities and sports opportunities to New York youth; Coalition for the Homeless; The Gathering for Justice’s War on Children, a program meant to reduce child incarceration that will launch next year; and United We Dream, which advocates for young immigrants.
The union says Kaepernick has given $900,000 of his $1 million goal.
The organization said that Kaepernick dropped off two large boxes of custom-made suits at a parole office in the borough of Queens. The quarterbackās youth-focused initiative, Know Your Rights Camp, noted, āWhile he waits to see if heāll get signed, Kaepernick is keeping up with his commitment to help empower communities in need.ā
http://knowyourrightscamp.com/about/
KNOW YOUR RIGHTS CAMP is a free campaign for youth fully funded by Colin Kaepernick to raise awareness on higher education, self empowerment, and instruction to properly interact with law enforcement in various scenarios.
There are plenty of other ways that they could have chosen to get their message across besides disrespecting and protesting against the flag and the country. They could take a knee when giving interviews if taking a knee is important to do. They can take a knee on every step onto and off of their practice times. They could rally and take knees outside of police departments, court houses etc… . They could explain exactly what they are protesting and what they think needs to happen to change it. They could pool their resources and take out ads, billboards, write articles that explain what they think and to convey their messages with the picture of people taking a knee.
To try and say that it is not disrespectful is the lie. When you protest something you are showing or stating your disapproval of it. If you disapprove of the flag and the country then that is not respect it is disrespect. To try and say differently is absurd.
I disapprove of and I protest against your flag and your country. The police officers in this country intentionally murder unarmed black men and are not punished for their crimes instead they get paid leave. This is a country that is and the flag represents, institutional racism. No disrespect intended.
Was there any KNEELING today?
I had to stop to tie my shoe.
Was there any KNEELING today?
I do NOT know, Bill. I did NOT watch. Got a lot done for once on a fall Sunday.
Thereās not a shovel big enough for the above.
Just pointing out that if racial solidarity is good for one group then you should be willing to accept it for all groups. You can not allow it for some and then not for others.
If you donāt like it then tough but people notice the hypocrisy.
Nothing short of diving in front of bullets would satisfy you.
Take a Midol.
My point is that the big talk is just that. If they hauled their a$$es into the war zone theyād know what would happen. Very convient to blame the police for attempting to control crime and violence in a segment of the country where crime and violence are the normal.
Kaepernick is incredibly charitable.
I donāt give a damn what he does or does with his money. I
pointed out the irony that a half breed like him, that was raised by whites in an all white area, would decry police brutality.It is still funny as hell.
He is looking for an identity so letās hope he finds it. He appears to now have plenty of time on his hands so he can use his money and his hands. I expect once he gets a good look at the culture the police deal with daily heāll quietly slip away.
I could care less if they stand, sit, crawl or sh.it. I stand before games, remove a hat if wearing one but never face the flag nor do I sing. Too much bad stuff done in the name of freedom and that extends to Lincolnās War which destroyed the constitution to invading a high school in Little Rock 60 years ago with the 101st Airborne to attacking countries that did not attack us to exporting pornography and other bulls.hit āfreedomsā.
And one last thing, give those alms in silence. If you are going to let it be known tell us the % that goes to administrative costs and how much you are writing off through taxes or a trust.
McCallum
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