How Do They Do It?

Fans Football Recruiting General NCS Football53

GT

We’ve talked about this before, so it’s nothing that new. But it is kind of a natural time to re-approach the topic of ACC fan support in light of a recent observation made by EagleinAtlanta and the fact that one of the ACC’s best fanbases visit Raleigh this weekend.

I like to occassionaly take opportunities to educate and highlight items from athletics programs not named NC State because there are many fans out there who have no idea what athletic are like at other schools. If you haven’t been to many (basketball &/or football) games at a variety of other programs then it is hard to understand where NC State support is both good and bad. Most likely, however, a fan who hasn’t been to many other places would easily take for granted the strong support that both our basketball and football programs receive from Wolfpack fans when compared to other schools.

I wish that I could find some links to previous conversations that we have had about football fan support amongst ACC member institutions, but to this point I am not having any luck.

Of all of the schools in the ACC, it has always surprised me the most that Georgia Tech does not have better support. Additionally, it has always surprised me how well GT manages to recruit and perform on the field in light of fan support that is so sub-par and fails to compare with others. In a Lee Fowler world where coaching makes little impact and takes a back seat to facilities and support and everything else under the sun, the results generated by Yellow Jackets’ program are quite impressive.

My first eyewitness experience with this was in the middle/near the end of the Mike O’Cain years when NC State traveled to Atlanta for a very important 3:30pm ABC game vs a great Yellow Jackets team led by Joe Hamilton. The weather was PERFECT and…to add to the magnitude of the game…it was HOMECOMING at GT. If the game was played in Raleigh – even back then when football wasn’t as big as it is today – there is no doubt that Carter-Finley would have beeen filled to capacity. But in Atlanta, SEVERAL thousand seats remained empty. I remember sitting there wondering how the hell Georgia Tech could put together such a great product/program while we were/are mired in general mediocrity in light of the fact that they have such comparably poor fan support?

Well…another ACC blogger has noticed the exact same phenomenon. Take a look at this link from EagleinAtlanta from last week’s BC-GT game for a moment. Now, I think that we all find it a little ironic that a Boston College fan is criticizing another school for poor fan support…but, exclude the hypocrisy of BC and focus exclusively on Georgia Tech.

How do they do it?

Empty Seats

Those are empty seats for a primetime night game against a ranked opponent. Is Georgia Tech now bush league? No. Yet you’ll hear BC critics and TOB mention our occasional attendance issues when talking about BC. Once again let me restate, I want a packed house every week, but attendence has nothing to do with what happens on the field.

^ I ardently beg to differ.

First, attendance manifests itself in both energy and noise during a game. This leads to increased levels of emotion and energy on the field. Heck, if ANYONE should understand the impact of attendence….the folks at Boston College should recognize one of the primary reasons that an inferior NC State team was able to remain within striking difference in last year’s game with the Eagles was because the value of ‘home field advantage’.

NOBODY argues that the concept of ‘home field advantage does not exist? Well, you don’t have any home field advantage if you don’t have people in the stands.

More broadly, attendance creates a perception of support. Support helps with recruiting. Recruiting raises talent within a program. Talent raises performance on the field.

HOW in the world can attendance NOT impact what happens on the field?

For an addendum to this entry, make sure that you check out MrO’s comments in the #1 slot just below.

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53 Responses to How Do They Do It?

  1. McPete 09/21/2007 at 1:18 PM #

    unrelated, but noteworthy. Demario Pressley updated to probable on the injury report for tomorrow’s game. great news!

  2. RAWFS 09/21/2007 at 1:18 PM #

    Bo, the oft-complained-about Student Ticket procedures at CFS do not help.

  3. BoKnowsNCS71 09/21/2007 at 1:32 PM #

    /\ So true.

  4. packbackr04 09/21/2007 at 1:42 PM #

    Pressley updated as probable for tomorrows game,, thats good news if true

    also is the game on TV tomorrow???

  5. PAPacker 09/21/2007 at 1:47 PM #

    Charger 17, I watched Wofford and UCF on espn260. both times worked fine except for that it is way behind time on the field, it goes all black sometimes and they often start coverage of the game way after it starts. Does you broadband provider carry it? That has been a problem for me in the past.

  7. TheTruth 09/21/2007 at 2:03 PM #

    Good stuff here. Sadly, the picture is of GT’s NORTH stands which are the visitor section (and, yes, it is before the game – not halftime). On TV, every section shown was full.

    And if you think that NCState would have filled that section on a road game @ GT on a THURSDAY night, you are seriously mistaken. The only people that ever fill the visitor section at GT are Clemson, Auburn, Georgia.. period.

  8. bTHEredterror 09/21/2007 at 2:36 PM #

    This game wasn’t played on a Thursday night.

    And SFN is right, the fact there were empty seats in the visitors section is more damning to the host than to the vistior IMO. Boston to Atlanta is a challenging trip, probably too far to drive, and accomodations in the ATL aren’t cheap. A few days before a game, the unsold portion of visitors tickets are made available to the public. These are opportunities for those home fans unable to secure season tickets to see a game. This week at C-F, with an almost certain loss in the offing, at an early game to boot, we will still fill our stadium to at least 95% capacity. Many Wolfpackers will sit near CU fans, knowing they may have to listen to their braggadocio, just to enjoy a College football game.

  9. charger17 09/21/2007 at 2:44 PM #

    PAPacker, my provider doesn’t carry it . . . that’s the problem. But when SFN linked us to verizon’s website to create a username and password and then another link to espn360, it worked. I just haven’t been able to use those same links other than the UCF game. Does anyone know of a way to do this again (ie, post a link that would allow those of us who don’t have verizon or at&t to watch the game)? THANKS!

    And it doesn’t matter what time or what section. We’ve all been to Bobby Dodd and been unimpressed with the attendance.

  10. Clarksa 09/21/2007 at 2:48 PM #

    Kinda back on topic…GA produces good football players and they only have to divide them up between UGA and GT…that may be the reason GT can win 7ish games on a consistant basis.

  11. LRM 09/21/2007 at 3:04 PM #

    Seven wins just isn’t the benchmark of consistency it once was, especially now that almost every 6-6 team gets a bowl; a 7-win season now is only one game above .500.

    Georgia Tech is a perfect example; look at their past five seasons:

    2006 (9-5)
    Losses to Notre Dame, Clemson, Georgia, Wake, West Virginia (no FSU or BC or WF in regular season)

    2005 (7-5)
    Losses to Virginia Tech, State, Virginia, Georgia, Utah (no FSU)

    2004 (6-5)
    Losses to Carolina, Miami, Virginia Tech, Virginia, Georgia (no FSU)

    2003 (7-6)
    Losses to BYU, FSU, Clemson, Duke, Virginia, Georgia

    2002 (7-6)
    Losses to Clemson, Wake, Maryland, FSU, Georgia, Fresno St

    They’re 0-5 against Georgia and they’ve only finished more than a single game above .500 once — last season a ACC runner-up at 9-5. It’s a wonder Gailey still has a job with the record against Georgia alone. The only thing consistent with GT is their dominance over us.

  12. tcthdi-tgsf-twhwtnc 09/21/2007 at 3:21 PM #

    Gailey will always be in and out of trouble because he speaks his mind and doesn’t always resort to coach speak. Regardless of that fact he is a very good coach and Tech is lucky to have him. While he was head coach with the Cowboys he went undefeated in the NFC East which is quite an feat when you think of the great coaches in that division through the years.

  13. EverettBeez 09/21/2007 at 4:14 PM #

    Big city college teams often face a problem of fan support – Pro football takes a lot of cash and fans from college ball. Charlotte will surely face this problem. TCU faces this issue, and has been struggling with for 20 yrs. They play exciting ball, and even when they were in the Southwest, before its demise, they had trouble filling their very large stadium (I believe its 60K +). This is a team with a national championship in the 50s, and proud tradition in a huge metropolitan area. But you can go to see the Cowboys, the Rangers, go to 6-Flags, on and on. Not to mention the love affair with high school ball.

    A town like Clemson, where the ball game is the only option, its easy to sell out. Nebraska loves their team – but other team are they going to love?

    Remember this was an issue with hockey in Raleigh – could you pull enough people away from basketball . . .

  14. LRM 09/21/2007 at 4:18 PM #

    Everett,
    I Agree. Tennessee has been the perfect example of this. They can put 110,000 in the stands every week because they’re the only gig in town — the entire state.

  15. EverettBeez 09/21/2007 at 4:19 PM #

    I’ll speak up for both Ole Miss coeds, and the game day experience.
    Lincoln & Nebraska also had a great game day experience, with the add benefit that the campus is right downtown, and the stadium is on campus – all walking distance to the bars & hotels in the old warehouse district.

    Here in Alabama, my school Jacksonville State, is lucky to pull 5,000 for games. We try actually to play on thursday nights so our students can go to the Bama or Auburn games on saturday – because that is where their loyality lies. Same with Troy.

    Bama winnobegos will show up on tuesday for the saturday game – they use to spend all week in Oxford!

  16. EverettBeez 09/21/2007 at 4:20 PM #

    I am glad to hear that if we decide to by GT tickets next year, their won’t be an issue.

  17. LRM 09/21/2007 at 4:26 PM #

    I grew up near Boone going to most of the App St. home games since my dad was an alum and a big fan. I recall a story about Jerry Moore — an outstanding coach for any level — when he first got to App, he held a team meeting and made a rule that the players could no longer wear State and Carolina hats around campus or to practice. After all, this was their competition.

    That’s what more regional schools deal with every day.

  18. EverettBeez 09/21/2007 at 4:38 PM #

    One any give day in class, I will see 5 or 6 Auburn shirts, and the same number of Bama shirts, and maybe one or two JSU shirts. they go to school here, but their hearts are elsewhere.

    Our Board of Trustees see the solution as moving up one division. I am deeply opposed to this now (funding, faculty shortage, etc) – but we’ll never make the attendance requirements!

    As an App grad, I loved the football team (not so much interest in basketball) – but my first love will always be NC State.

    For both GT & BC, they will always face this problem.

    Miami is a strange exemption isn’t it? They were packed in last night for the TAMU game – and this with a very small student body.

    How do UCLA & USC draw? they have very large stadiums to fill.
    Arizona can’t give away enough tickets to fill their stadium – though the team stinks pretty much year in and year out, lol. Sill – they’ve got a great slogan “Bear Down Arizona!”

  19. tvp 09/21/2007 at 4:41 PM #

    Boy, what a shock that a BC fan, ATLEagle in particular, would misrepresent facts to try to make other schools look as bad as BC…

    BC fans continually try to argue that attendence and fan support does not have any affect on the success of a college football program…which goes to show how little they understand about the game.

  20. Wulfpack 09/21/2007 at 5:05 PM #

    LRM, Tennessee fans have the Titans about 3 hours down the road. UT is the state university, and they have wicked support. You could put the Indy Colts in Knoxville and there’s still be 110,000+, not to mention all the boats. Go to a UT-Vandy game in Nashville and it’s all orange.

  21. EverettBeez 09/21/2007 at 5:13 PM #

    Wulfpack – you could put the Colts in Knoxville, and they would draw well – but over time one or the other would loose out – sure as shooting. Especially if one of the teams produced numerous losing seasons.

    UT’s been good, they are The State university, and until recently praticaly the only game in town. ETSU gave up football. Vandy gives it the college try, but . . . and Memphis is Memphis.

    When the Titans played in Memphis – no one went. They were angry that Nashville got the team and they didn’t, lol. What a bone head move to have them play in Memphis at all.

  22. TNCSU 09/21/2007 at 5:43 PM #

    ^^he held a team meeting and made a rule that the players could no longer wear State and Carolina hats around campus or to practice.

    If I was the coach, I’d do the same thing! Pretty funny, though, I never knew that.

  23. joe 09/21/2007 at 5:57 PM #

    GT does not produce as many alumni as NCSU or other big schools. They are about at 18,000 students compared to 31,000 for NCSU. Over time that difference can really add up with the number of alums that are put out.

  24. wufpaxno1 09/21/2007 at 6:58 PM #

    I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, Eagle in Atlanta has a very low football IQ and he manages to demonstrate that early and often. Why does anyone give him any play at all. Though, I will say that he does support his school, albeit from afar.

  25. john of sparta 09/21/2007 at 7:38 PM #

    everettB……Exactamundo.
    when the College game is The Game (clemPson) = sold out.
    when the Pro game is close by (ATL) = no sell out.
    Atlanta has Pro Everything: NASCAR, NBA, NFL (sorta, this year),
    MLB (5 out), NHL (sorta, this year).
    Boston has all the pros.
    Raleigh has the NHL and Div.1 State.
    Durham has AAABulls and Div. 1 Duke.
    Chapel Hill has UNCX with no competition.
    so….EB, i agree. there’s a triage in effect.

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