V and DT Transcended Rivalry

DT

A nice find from a couple of weeks ago that we failed to link.

Link

For example, Sumner says, Duke basketball coach Mike Krzyzewski and former UNC coach Dean Smith aren’t the overall most popular figures in the Hall because some fans don’t like to acknowledge the accomplishments of their chief rival.

But he says N.C. State basketball All-American David Thompson and late Wolfpack coach Jim Valvano rise above fan prejudice.

“Valvano was very popular,” Sumner says. “The way he went out, the way he fought cancer, the great speeches he made restored his reputation.”

He said Thompson, who combined humility and greatness, is fondly remembered: “He also transcended the rivalry.”

About StateFans

'StateFansNation' is the shared profile used by any/all of the dozen or so authors that contribute to the blog. You may not always agree with us, but you will have little doubt about where we stand on most issues. Please follow us on Twitter and FaceBook

General NCS Basketball Tradition

28 Responses to V and DT Transcended Rivalry

  1. noah 08/23/2007 at 9:14 AM #

    Feelings about Dean softened after he retired. I don’t hate him anywhere near as much as I did as when he was coaching. And I will tip my hat to his acomplishments far faster than I would have done earlier.

    The same thing will happen for K.

  2. StateFans 08/23/2007 at 9:29 AM #

    ^As usual, I agree.

    His absence from the game doesn’t change his/UNC’s hypocrisy…but, I am more mature and at a stage where I will acknowledge that if we could craft an image where we say one set of things and DO a completely opposite set of things then I would take it in a heartbeat.

  3. tobaccordshow 08/23/2007 at 9:33 AM #

    ^^ I still can’t stand the guy and always will.

  4. Trout 08/23/2007 at 10:54 AM #

    Where did that picture of DT come from? It must be a freshman picture, because he is wearing #30, not the #44 which he himself would make famous in NC State history.

  5. TNCSU 08/23/2007 at 11:54 AM #

    Trout,
    You always notice these things….very nice!

  6. WolftownVA81 08/23/2007 at 11:56 AM #

    While I respect both as great coaches, I personally can’t stand a whiner.

  7. BJD95 08/23/2007 at 12:07 PM #

    Much like Fletch, was DT “6’10 with the afro?”

  8. Mike 08/23/2007 at 12:21 PM #

    BJD, got to admire a man that can work a Fletch comment into the Blog. Moved to NC in ’76 so DT was just before my time unfortunately. In that pic, he only looks 6’7″.

  9. redfred2 08/23/2007 at 12:43 PM #

    Mike, too bad about your timing, NC State’s 6’4″, 6’9″ with the afro, version of Fletch was unlike any other to set foot on the BB court.

  10. RickJ 08/23/2007 at 1:10 PM #

    “Where did that picture of DT come from? It must be a freshman picture, because he is wearing #30, not the #44 which he himself would make famous in NC State history.”

    Trout – I’m pretty sure this is David’s freshman picture. If memory serves me correctly, Bob Heuts (6’ 7” lefty forward) wore number 44 on the varsity during David’s freshman year and he had to take another number. I think Heuts left the program – it may have even been during David’s freshman year or in the off season and David took number 44 when it became available.

  11. Trout 08/23/2007 at 3:23 PM #
  12. RabidWolf 08/23/2007 at 4:47 PM #

    I am STILL convinced that if you took DT in his college prime and MJ in his, DT would beat MJ like a drum. No contest. DT—THE greatest to ever play in the ACC!!

  13. redfred2 08/23/2007 at 7:44 PM #

    RabidWolf

    Admitting that I am biased and a State through and through, but I can be objective. If you are talking about collegiate basketball there is no doubt that DT was the most dominant player on the court during every game he ever played. Thompson just was just so far ahead of anyone on the court even as a freshman on the JV team. Some say it was Dean’s system but Jordan was much later to develop.

    DT should not be out of anyone’s top five greatest of all time nationally. To me, he was the most complete and the physically gifted player I’ve ever seen.

  14. john of sparta 08/23/2007 at 9:08 PM #

    freshman # on the freshman team?
    now….
    who’s the next DT?
    there was Dr. J before MJ.
    Wilt before Lew.
    personally, i think it will be a
    3-point shooter since the NCAA
    knocked back the line.
    a 50percenter will be gold.

  15. redfred2 08/23/2007 at 9:50 PM #

    who’s the next DT?

    Um, I don’t think I’ll ever see another, BUT, if something anywhere close does happen to appear, you won’t ever see it, not but very briefly on a college basketball court anyway.

    I wouldn’t include DT at all, he made his mark on the NBA and everyone knew DT was a rare phenomia and something extraordinary up on there on the highest level, even though he had a short career and hard fall from glory. But, I would hate to change the times and think about how many former ACC/NCAA player’s that are solidly woven into the folklore of the college game itself, that wouldn’t even be remembered if they had only played one season of college basketball, and then went on to pretty much fizzle out in the NBA as they did. I could make a pretty long list just off the top of my head.

    I don’t they’ll ever be another DT, but for that reason alone now, it wouldn’t matter anyway.

  16. redfred2 08/23/2007 at 9:54 PM #

    …just waiting for noah to call me a name.

  17. EverettBeez 08/23/2007 at 10:28 PM #

    When I got to met DT, in 4th grade, he was this giant with huge hands – but was so quiet, and polite, especially to my mom. He even tolerated with good humor three boys (i was the oldest) going buck-ass wild, trying to wrestle both he and towe. I don’t know why we were so ill behaved that evening. DT was great.

    Dean still gives me an ill feeling. We are getting a new basset puppy in october (puppy mill rescues) I wonder if I can talk the wife into calling it dean, but I”d hate to curse a helpless creature with such a terrible burden.

  18. noah 08/24/2007 at 9:28 AM #

    I don’t believe Julius Erving was ever considered the best to ever play the game. I don’t even think he was considered the best basketball player at the time he was playing. He and DT and the Iceman were probably the best ABA players.

    Erving put up obscene numbers in the ABA (which, IMO, was a lot like the USFL — a goodly number of stars surrounded by a goodly number of scrubs). That was during his prime. I would have been interested in seeing what he would have done in the NBA during that period.

    In the ABA, he averaged close to 30 ppg and was always a double-digit rebounder. Considering that he was only about 6-6, that’s pretty amazing.

    I will say that his baseline drive in the 1980 NBA finals is the single-greatest play I’ve ever seen a basketball player make. I’ve never seen anything that compares to it.

    No, you’ll never see anything like Thompson in college basketball again. It’s called change. You’ll never see someone win 511 games in major league baseball or consistently hit over .400 either.

  19. redfred2 08/24/2007 at 8:39 PM #

    noah, so it is called change. So, does that mean that it’s good and right for the players/kids? Is everyone wise to embrace and condone this change and tell the kids “Hell yeah, if it’s out there that’s what I’d do!” or continually say that, “It was the only smart move for him to make.”

    It’s not like the NBA doesn’t already have a myriad problems, but you watch, with less and less exposure for these kids in the amateur ranks, or college connections to be drawn upon and bring in new fans, the NBA’s popularity will continue to plummet. You tell me that some of those arrogant attitudes and the style of play wouldn’t improve if some of those so-called “professionals” had had to try follow a few simple rules just to stay in college for a few years before moving on.

    You say it’s just change, may be, but it still isn’t good. If they aren’t already figuring it out, the NBA will find that out soon enough too.

  20. highstick 08/25/2007 at 10:42 PM #

    All right Fred and Noah, you can quibble over semantics, but “I was there and met David as a freshman” when I was a senior. Neat, mild mannered kid who could jump through the freakin’ roof! You can call it change, which it probably was, but I don’t think I’ll ever see another college player who could “take so much control and will a team to win”. He was just awesome to watch play. He followed me to the ER by a few weeks when he landed on his head against Pitt. I’d been there just a few weeks ago when I was trying to help a friend(Tarhole) move a desk out of his house in Raleigh at half time of the State-UNC game. Had to take the door of the hinges and accidentally hit the light fixture which fell on my forehead and I was “spurting some Wolfpack blood” when I got to the old Rex ER. I told them to “sew me up cause I wasn’t missing the second half”!

    It’s changed and it’s a shame that we don’t have more recruits coming into college with the skills and “upbringing”, if you want to call it that, as DT did. He strayed for “a while”, but I’ve still got a “ton of admiration” for him as a person and a ball player.

    By the way, I’ve felt like I’ve been under a “gag rule” for the past few days that I’ve spent working in “Tarhole Land”. Couldn’t get my normal motel reservation so I stayed in the old Holiday Inn at Eastgate. Dang, there’s a lot of blue there! Plus they furnish you with a Daily Tar Heel everyday. I’ll post this separately, but they discovered how the graduation rate is so high for the jocks.

  21. john of sparta 08/26/2007 at 6:17 PM #

    highstick……upbringing is exactly right.
    i’ve had enuf of the Vick criminal family.

  22. noah 08/27/2007 at 9:45 AM #

    “You can call it change, which it probably was, but I don’t think I’ll ever see another college player who could “take so much control and will a team to win”.”

    I agree. Durant or Lebron James or Kobe Bryant probably would have developed into one of those guys. Those days are gone from college basketball.

    redfred – It’s the way it is. It will be great for some kids and bad for others.

  23. redfred2 08/27/2007 at 11:18 PM #

    “It will be great for some kids and bad for others.”

    How so?

    Allow me to anticipate your answer. The cream of the crop will go pro early, robbing the best athletes from the college game almost entirely. That’s a “So what?” I guess. Then you’re saying that that will leave room for some other kid to still become household name on the collegiate level. Then after that, and a few years later, that once collegiate phenom fizzles out when his talent level is once again matched up with reality again, or the true best players on the planet, and all the while us dumb collegiate fans are left to ponder why the best they’ve seen just didn’t quite measure up.

    OK, I give

    I guess I can live with that, after all, we’ve certainly seen that already anyway. Good answer, thanks for straightening me out on that there noah. Not that I give a rat’s ass about it, but I still say that the NBA has a choke hold on it’s own popularity by aggressively taking these players early. It definitely doesn’t help to assimilate the many diehard college fans into the ranks of NBA fans. Just the opposite. Also, they seem to be unaware that their own NBA announcers are really hurting their on cause by not openly promoting the player’s college connections often and vigorously during NBA games. I don’t understand that at all, but to me, it seems like they overtly shun that aspect like it’s a put down to their league or something.

  24. noah 08/28/2007 at 11:44 AM #

    Well, you’ve made a habit of accusing me of saying things I’ve never even thought, let alone uttered…so I guess you might as well attack me for things you clearly admit I’ve YET to say.

    For the record – plenty of players will go pro and fulfill their dream of playing in the NBA. They’ll use their contract money and their endorsement money to get their parents or siblings out of poverty. They’ll be productive members of their community and they’ll have a nice professional career.

    Other players will go pro early, be completely lost, squander whatever money they do earn and spin hopelessly out of control before winding up dead after getting shot during a botched robbery attempt of the corner liquor store.

    The popularity of sports in this country is largely fueled by gambling. If you’re someone who appreciates the art and pageantry and athletic competition of sports and the purity of competition — you’re in the minority. The better a sport is for gambling, the more popular it is.

    I read somewhere the other day that sports gambling alone is a $400 billion business in the US.

    What’s the most popular sport? Pro football. What sport is the best to gamble on? Pro football.

    That’s why the regular season in college basketball isn’t anywhere NEAR as popular as March Madness….the tournament is a great place for gamblers.

    Boxing stopped being popular once people stopped believing it was legitimate. Once everyone figured out that it was rigged, it stopped being on national television and disappeared to pay-per-view

    Nobody gambles on pro basketball. You can never tell when a team is just going to decide not to show up. So why waste your time? In pro football, every game is critical, every play is critical. If you go anything less than full speed, you’ll get killed. So it’s easier to predict the results.

  25. packfanstk 08/28/2007 at 10:14 PM #

    Noah posted Quote:
    Feelings about Dean softened after he retired. I don’t hate him anywhere near as much as I did as when he was coaching. And I will tip my hat to his acomplishments far faster than I would have done earlier.

    The same thing will happen for K. :Quote

    Not for me. Never ever ever ever ever. Dean will always be the personification of the most putrid pile of rancid vomitus ever excreted from the vilest of Satanic orifices.

    On second thought, I guess my opinion of him HAS mellowed a bit.

    K is just a whiney little Bobby Knight the second that needed to get his ass stomped a few times when he was a kid.

Leave a Reply