NC State Placement Stats

Campus News General39

Read ’em and weep. Could you get into NC State today? Don’t short yourself too much…the SAT was recalibrated a more than a decade ago where you should add approximately 100 points to scores achieved before the change.

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Campus News General

39 Responses to NC State Placement Stats

  1. packpigskinfan23 01/23/2007 at 10:43 AM #

    ^I CAN!! in fact I did… started here this semester.

  2. Dr. BadgerPack 01/23/2007 at 11:00 AM #

    The average SAT score is certainly nice, and is moving up (for virtually all colleges). Unfortunately, I feel that you can put less and less stock in these tests– it doesn’t really measure “aptitude” anymore. Not with study guides, tailored prep courses and what I refer to as regurgitation strategies.

    I have seen way to many students with exceptional SAT scores just bomb in college for various reasons. I tinkered for a while with correlating SAT score and course grade (in my class) and didn’t find much of a relationship. It seemed that 10-15 years ago there was more correlation.

    What I really liked in those statistics is what appears to be great breadth in the out of state/country applicant pool. While in graduate science programs (being so narrow because that is where my expertise, and first hand knowledge lies) this isn’t a problem, getting quality out of state and international students as undergraduates is usually a tougher sell. This speaks well to the quality of student State is hoping to attract now.

  3. Dan 01/23/2007 at 11:13 AM #

    When they started letting kids take calculators in there, it all went downhill.. ;o)

    Even the GRE went the easy road. I hear they no longer have separate analytical and math sections. Instead they have an essay where applicants get to write about their feelings.

  4. Texpack 01/23/2007 at 11:15 AM #

    Incoming class profiles are always fun to look at and compare from school to school. I still remember that my SAT math scores put me around the 85% at State, 90% at Clemson and 54% at GaTech. This was early in the PSL (Post Slide Ruler) era. I agree that prep courses for the SAT have become one of the largest growth areas of our economy.

  5. statered 01/23/2007 at 11:18 AM #

    As far as the SAT goes the absolute score means nothing. All that matters if where a score falls in the distribution of all other scores taken at that time.

  6. Dr. BadgerPack 01/23/2007 at 11:20 AM #

    Dan- Even worse than the essay part on the SAT is students who try to incorporate essay into all of their college exams.

    I received a facinating two page essay for an exam in one course I took. Unfortunately for her, the class was organic chemistry and the essay (the only the written on the exam) was about why she thought she should still get into med school.

    Some people’s kids…

  7. old13 01/23/2007 at 11:21 AM #

    It’s all Foulup’s fault!

    Oh, sorry! Guess I got carried away! :>)

  8. tcthdi-tgsf-twhwtnc 01/23/2007 at 11:26 AM #

    I was shocked while reading in the last NC State Magazine that in the mid 70’s State raised the minimum GPA from 1.8 to 2.0. That was amazing to me that you could come to State with a 1.8 only 10 years before the Washburn fiasco. If he had been 10 years older he wouldn’t of had a problem meeting the requirements except maybe for his 500 or so SAT score.

  9. packof81 01/23/2007 at 12:34 PM #

    The current admissiions scheme works against the late bloomer. I had 1100 SAT but my HS grades were mediocre because I was busy partying, courting girls and playing in rock and roll bands.

    I treated NCSU like a job. I worked 7:00 – 5:00 every day. I made the deans list 6 of 10 semesters with a EE major and graduated with honors.

    I returned 20 years later and found I was competitive with students young enough to be my offspring.

    But I wonder whether a kid today with similar aptitude and inclination would even get a chance.

  10. Buddygreen 01/23/2007 at 1:03 PM #

    I was at a high school football banquet last night. The team had a successful season going deep into the playoffs. The coach gave out awards to all players that had over a 3.0. A 3.0 used to mean something in High school but today it means less. 60% of the team had over a 3.0. Some kids had over 4.0. One kid had a 4.4 GPA. Seems in high school if you put the words Honors in front of it, you can make over a 4.0 in the class. Honors history and all kinds of bogus classes exist now. Seems between the new subjective graded SAT and watered down GPAs it is very difficult to measure how good of a student the kid really might be. Oh yea and the coach is an NCSU fan and his top player is considering NCSU. Amato did not burn bridges with the high school coaches in the state. There is a lot of good will between State and North Carolina people as a whole. I know some give State a hard time for playing the likes of App. State, UNC-W, and ECU in football and basketball. But State has always done that when UNX would not and that has created lots of good will for us for years We must remember these HS coaches are App. State, W. Carolina, ECU, UNC-W, etc. grads also. Let us not forget the good will and appreciation we receive throughout the State by maintaining the tradition of playing, generating ticket sales, advertising dollars, and keeping that revenue stream inside the State. It does not go unnoticed believe me. Like UNX why play Furman when you can play Appt. State and Western? Our Radio personalities have always been favorable to other instate schools giving up dates and scores and such. You don’t hear that kind of coverage from Woody Durham and the crowd. Just one more reason to be proud to be a Wolfpacker. How many of us remember playing App. State and their was always three or four State transfers on the roster. Sheridan and O’Cain encouraged kids that were not going to get playing time to go to places like App. State so they could play and get an education.

  11. Buddygreen 01/23/2007 at 1:16 PM #

    Everybody see where we got JUCO All American DE Holmes. Seems TOB not wasting any time wanting to win right away. I believe that is our third JUCO committment and 21st verbal. TOB has held together what we had and so far has been able to build on it, good job considering the short time he been here.

  12. CarnifeX 01/23/2007 at 1:42 PM #

    There is a difference in what is required from todays young people that are graduating from college and what was required even as recently as 10 years ago. In todays world a graduate is expected to do more than just be able to properly work through an equation; todays graduate not only has to be able to work through those equations but to interpret those results and more importantly communicate those results and their impact on fields outside their own. This is the reasons that more and more admissions include, if not are based on, essays.

    thank you “The World is Flat” by Thomas Friedman.

  13. Gene 01/23/2007 at 2:29 PM #

    Seems in high school if you put the words Honors in front of it, you can make over a 4.0 in the class.

    They did that when I was in high school, back in the late 1980’s – early 1990’s. You got 5 grade points for an A, if it was an honors / AP class.

    GPA’s in high school effect class rank. Honors English, for example, covers more material and sometimes more difficult material, than non-Honors English. So do you penalize a kid for taking harder courses, in high school, which might result in a lower grade versus if the kid didn’t take the Honors / AP courses, knowing he / she could get straight A’s in the non-Honors course and therefore shouldn’t risk his / her class rank by getting a ‘B’ in Honors English, for example.

    High school isn’t college. In college you move from 100 level courses to 200 level to 300 level to 400 level and maybe some 500 level courses. Everyone, who is in your degree program has to take those courses. There are no “Honors” 400 level Hydrology courses versus “Non-Honors” Hydrology.

    So it make some sense for high schools to have more than 4 grade points for an ‘A’.

  14. noah 01/23/2007 at 2:58 PM #

    buddygreen – something that truly frightened me about the O’Cain years was when we had a marquee linebacker from Shelby (whose name I’m blanking on…played with Chris Coleman) Crest here at State. He was supposed to be THE guy on our defense, the star for the upcoming year.

    Something happened and he transferred to App….and was buried on their depth chart.

    It was an indicator of just how bad our defense had gotten.

  15. Buddygreen 01/23/2007 at 3:20 PM #

    Noah– we lost a lot of linebackers due to the party/shooting incident during O’Cain years. Certainly not a stellar moment in our football history. Of course I don’t know who you talking about but not unusual for some recruits not to work out.

    Gene. I am older than you. 4.0 was it man, you could not go higher. They put all the smartest kids in same classes when I went to school. Didn’t have to call it honors. Lawsuits prevent them from doing that now. But really think you deserve a 5.0 for an A in history, communications, AP civics? Gimme a break. Plus Gene when I went to State you could not drop a class/grade or make it up. What you got was it. Kids today fail a class and take it the next semester and it never hits their GPA. Some high schools doing that also. We had true GPA not this second chance grade stuff.

    Carnifex In todays world recent graduates work for older graduates like me and I wish they were as overly prepared for todays world as you claim they are. Seems most recent grads looking for answers their friends programmed in their calculator/computer or looking an open book company manual test to give them the answers. Some think they can google their way through the company. Most seem to be lost on the art of problem solving that is if you can get them to come in on time, show up, or not constantly call in sick. . There’s a real issue “today’s graduates” have. I guess that why most graduates get that so called entry level pay, as far as I know that has not changed.

  16. Dr. BadgerPack 01/23/2007 at 3:23 PM #

    Essays as part of applications are one thing; they typically ask for personal experiences, why you chose the school being applied for and things of that ilk.

    What was being referred to before (at least what I referred to) are the essays you find on the SAT. There exist trained, cookie cutter responses to these that don’t evaluate much of anything. The resonses aren’t readily available to admissions committees at individual schools either, so all the committee sees is a score. That is of no substantiative value in determining whether the applicant can communicate, etc.

    Today’s graduate might be expected to be able to work above and beyond the scope of their niche. But I’ve seen too often that today’s graduate expects an easy degree, at the school of their choosing, that translates quickly to $$$.

  17. Buddygreen 01/23/2007 at 3:36 PM #

    Oh yea and that cry baby drop a grade if you pass it next semester stuff was started at, that’s right you guessed it. UNC Chapel Hill. They did it for years before it was put in at NCSU. State just flunked you like you deserved, but the liberal wusses at UNC didn’t want their little future left wingers not graduating or having bad GPA’s. Why in the 70 and early 80’s you had ~60% chance of graduating from NCSU and a ~90% chance at UNC. Don’t know what the numbers are today. But no matter how you feel about it, it made a degree from NCSU back then harder to earn than one today.

  18. Buddygreen 01/23/2007 at 3:42 PM #

    Packof81 My sister-n- law a State grad of 84. Also went back recently and got another degree maintianing a 4.0. She said same as you, had no problem in class but wondered if she too would have been admitted in todays admission standards.

  19. tooyoungtoremember 01/23/2007 at 3:56 PM #

    Buddygreen, you are so much better than everybody else because you have an antiquated education. I am so jealous. Did you also have to walk to school barefoot in the snow uphill both ways? Get over yourself. You are just afraid of being replaced.

  20. CarnifeX 01/23/2007 at 4:09 PM #

    ^ Going to happen.

    Read “The World is Flat” by Thomas Friedman.

    Actually probably not in his lifetime. But in ours TooYoung.

  21. Gene 01/23/2007 at 4:25 PM #

    Gene. I am older than you.

    I guessed as much.

    Kids today

    I don’t have kids yet, but I am getting to the age where there’s basically a generation gap between me and kids in K-12 . I am working very hard to never say “kids today [FILL IN BLANK]”, because I remember them saying it about my generation years ago and yet civilization hasn’t ended, as my generation has settled into adulthood.

  22. packpigskinfan23 01/23/2007 at 4:28 PM #

    I have had the understanding that the essays on the new SAT’s are very good tools at seeing the way a kid percives(or at least bullshits) topics. Maybe its just me, but this dosnt see like just some simple essay on your “feelings”!!!

    “Many persons believe that to move up the ladder of success and achievement, they must forget the past, repress it, and relinquish it. But others have just the opposite view. They see old memories as a chance to reckon with the past and integrate past and present.

    —Adapted from Sara Lawrence-Lightfoot, I’ve Known Rivers: Lives of Loss and Liberation

    Assignment: Do memories hinder or help people in their effort to learn from the past and succeed in the present? Plan and write an essay in which you develop your point of view on this issue. Support your position with reasoning and examples taken from your reading, studies, experience, or observations.”

    You must also remember that these kids have to write the WHOLE thing in 25 mins!! It must be well structured and everything that would be expected of any paper in college.
    I also agree with the GPA calculations for high schools. Some kid who takes AP Chemistry, AP English, and AP TRIG and Calc3 SHOULD be given extra points over some kid who takes weightlifting, woodshop, or band. I dont know anything about AP Civics or AP Historys… maybe my GPA would have been a bit higher if I had classes like those. but have never heard of a school with them. If there are, I am sure these classes are on a very paper and essay oriented curriculum which is representitive of those of a student would see in college.

    go here for more info:

    http://www.collegeboard.com/student/testing/sat/prep_one/essay/pracStart.html

    I for one never had to write an essay on the SAT. in fact I never even took the SAT. it was a complete waste of time and money(I believe its close to $90 to take these days!!!) for a kid in the lower 20% of the class that wasnt going straight to a 4 years school. talk your kids in doing the RIGHT thing… get a 2 year associates at a community college and transfer!

  23. packpigskinfan23 01/23/2007 at 4:29 PM #

    ^ the link is regarding the essay not the GPA calculations.

  24. GAWolf 01/23/2007 at 4:53 PM #

    As a criminal defense attorney, it absolutely amazes me how many college-aged kids today have their parents deal with their troubles. I think as a whole parents are staying way too involved in their kids lives way too long. It’s not exactly a “kids these days” thing as a “parents these days” thing.

  25. GAWolf 01/23/2007 at 5:11 PM #

    And I agree with everyone else, trying to compare SAT and GPA scores from the 60’s-90’s to kids these days is just not possible. A lady who worked with me told me that her daughter made a 13-something on the SAT and had a 3.9 GPA and I told her not to worry about her having any trouble getting into any school in the state. The only school she was accepted to was ECU and she got wait-listed by them. That’s when I finally learned how drastically the “everyone wins generation” had been shistered by these inflated “scores”.

    It reminds me of youth sports where they don’t keep score anymore. I understand the need to temper the parents who have gone completely overboard (see post above for what seems to be a societal trend), but not letting young kids learn how to compete and lose… or win… in stride is ridiculous.

    Before I ever quit hitting a ball off a T, I had learned that some years you’re on the good team and some years you’re on the shitty team. That’s a part of life, and I had accepted by the age of 6. What makes me any different from kids today? Probably nothing except over-protective parents and a society that thinks if kids lose at anything they’ll be scarred for life. Hell… I would even bet that things have changed so little from the kids’ perspective since I was little that even still most kids don’t care if they win or lose as long as they get a grape barrel drink and a fudge round after the game.

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