Cut Lee Off – Help Your SCHOOL

With all our hysteria about continuing athletic mediocrity and inept athletic leadership at our alma mater, we sometimes forget that that we graduated from North Carolina State University. And NC State is not a football team or a basketball team, but an institution of higher learning. It is, in short, your school.

So, if you want to make a statement about the basketball program and help your school at the same time, why not take your money from Herb and Lee’s outstretched paws and donate the same amount to the NC State educational department/college that conferred your degree – i.e., stiff Jethro and fund CHASS?

“Whatchew mean, you is givin’ yer money fer book-larnin?”

Your support is certainly needed. For example, I had lunch with my former advisor from the English Department the other day. I learned that almost a THIRD of the teaching positions in the English Department have been cut since I graduated in 1991. If you are a CHASS alumnus, your department might have experienced similar problems.

That’s a disgrace. If you a reading this and have a job doing something other than selling apples, you know that your degree delivers as promised. Can Herb and Jethro make the same claim? Of course not – at least not with a shred of credibility.

I stress that your contribution should be to your college/department and specifically limited to its operations. Also, while I’d originally rejected the notion of contributing to the Alumni Association, recent discussions on that subject have convinced me that this entity too would be worthy of support consideration.

So, before you pay for still more athletic futility and athletic director arrogance, consider donating that money to your old department or consider joining the Alumni Association. Either way, keep your money away from athletics until we have an Athletic Director who takes some note of fan concerns. Your money will be more appreciated and certainly will be put to better use.

NC State, remember? Your school.


41 Responses to Cut Lee Off – Help Your SCHOOL

  1. David C. 03/28/2006 at 9:57 AM #

    I disagree, if you pull money from athletics and pass it to the academics, then Herb’s support by the Faculty Senate will only increase and you’ll never get rid of him…

    The University has to understand that HERB is a problem to everyone, not just a “Lunitic Fringe”…

  2. Only One 03/28/2006 at 9:58 AM #

    the only choice is a complete boycott of the school. drastic measures call for drastic actions

  3. Cardiff Giant 03/28/2006 at 10:03 AM #

    I don’t think there’s a real connection there – that the Faculty Senate will confuse increased donations to the academic programs with support for Herb Sendek on their part.

    And the situation is easily avoided. Simply inform the persons in question that you are donating to academic rather than athletic matters because of your dissatisfaction with the Periclean Age of Jethro.

  4. Jeff 03/28/2006 at 10:28 AM #

    I agree with David C. I think that Sendek & Fowler have far too much institutional support because the people at the institution don’t understand the frustration of the rest of us. I think the only way to make your statement is to (1) complain to EVERY contact that you have at the University AND (2) withold all financial support to all endeavors of the University.

  5. old13 03/28/2006 at 10:31 AM #

    I chose to (and did) give the annual donations I usually give to NCSU/WPC to another university’s fund for scholarships for deserving needy students. I also informed the Alumni Association concerning my actions and the reasons thereof (and received a response to which I commented further concerning my feelings about NCSU leadership, i.e., Oblinger, Foulup and Daytight Herbie.) While I really hate doing this, and do it with much pain, I feel that it is the ONLY way to get the attention of the NCSU leadership. It’s one thing to not be competitive. But having to suffer the added embarrassment of Foulup’s offensive public attitude and comments towards alumni and others, not to mention the comedic inept play on the court time and time again on national TV, has done in this Wolfpacker of some 40+ years.

  6. Cardiff Giant 03/28/2006 at 10:35 AM #

    Well, in the case of the liberal arts, unless things have changed since I graduated (which is possible, I grant) there is NO CHANCE that your donation will be attributed as Sendek support, because none of those faculty are fans of athletics in general. At the end of the Valvano era the mood was one of outright hostility, one in which I joined because the athletic shenanigans of the day cost State a Phi Beta Kappa chapter at the time – which I would have qualified for and would have appreciated.

  7. Cardiff Giant 03/28/2006 at 10:36 AM #

    “I also informed the Alumni Association concerning my actions and the reasons thereof (and received a response ”

    I am vastly curious about this – can you summarize the response you received to this action (for which I say, well done, incidentally)?

  8. class of '74 03/28/2006 at 10:53 AM #

    I don’t care if it’s athletics or academics it is all about the money. Even the bolsheviks that control the academics feel the pain when you tell them you would be glad to contribute but to do so changes must be made in athletics prior to your financial support. As someone said desperate times call for desperate measures.

  9. Greg 03/28/2006 at 11:09 AM #

    This is very short sighted. Do you really think your donations only go to the football or basketball team?

    How do you think we field teams in baseball, tennis, track, swimming, etc..

    You are trying to punish the kids who are out there playing for “your” school and thats not fair to those kids. The basketball and football teams are self supporting and really dont need your donations to remain viable. As long as we are in the ACC, we will gain money from tv contracts, shoe

    Some of the posts on this site has really gone to the edge of lunacy. Here are some of the general misconceptions people have:
    1) you think your opinion matters
    2) you think your opinion *should* matter
    3) you think you know more than the people paid to make decisions
    4) you think you know what its like to be a collegiate athlete
    5) you think you know how to play the game better than the guy(s) we pay to coach our teams
    6) you think NCSU would immediately jump onto the national radar again if we just had that one great coach…all our problems would be solved
    7) you think you know the *whole* story
    8) you think this is *your* school
    9) you think that by giving a donation, buying a license, etc, *entitles* you to something

    I know thats a lot to think about and I know I will be slammed for saying most of it. I dont intend it to be meanspirited, its just the truth. I also know it doesnt apply to everyone…..just the *lunatics*… 😉

  10. Cardiff Giant 03/28/2006 at 11:11 AM #

    Greg, if anything on this forum demonstrates the need for strong support of the English Department, it’s your posts. I’ll bet 111 and 112 were real head-scratchers, huh?

  11. Greg 03/28/2006 at 11:21 AM #

    Good comeback…

    I had gotten so mad when I read that article that I couldnt half think, much less concentrate on what I was typing. Either way, I think you got the point, which was what was intended. At least I know you read it.

  12. Jeff 03/28/2006 at 11:24 AM #


    I think that your response is short sighted in thinking that we think that our financial support only goes to support football and basketball.

    I think that it is short sighted of the University to admit that we don’t actively strive for excellence in some major facets of the Univeristy while expecting the donors to believe that we are striving for success in other facts.

    But, make NO MISTAKE that nobody here is dumb enough to believe that our opinion matters (as you so appropriately highlighted that our opinion doesn’t).

    Perhaps you can take my spot as the College of Management’s representative on NC State’s Foundation Board. Since my opinion doesn’t matter, there is no reason for me to spend time investing in the University.

  13. Greg 03/28/2006 at 11:41 AM #

    Jeff…when was the last time Lee came to one of your meetings and asked your opinion? When did the chancellor ask you what you think should happen with our basketball program?

    The bottom line is, ALL Wolfpack fans opinions matter, just not in the way that can influence a decision like this one.

    Sendek isnt the answer we want…everyone knows that. What do you suggest we do?

    Here are a few options:
    1) Fire a coach who has fulfilled the term of his contract (graduate players, make the ncaa, upper half of the acc, no rapists, murderers, or felons on the team)
    2) Have Lee Fowler come out publicly and say that Herb sucks and we wont tolerate another year where we finish 4th in the conference and only win one ncaa game. Then call up ALL potential recruits and tell them there is no reason to come to State, we dont know who our coach is next year and cant guarantee anything.
    3) Support the coach publicly, privately let him know we expect more.

    Now, which of these options do you think would be best for the University? If we take option #1, who exactly do you think we should hire and with what kind of carrot do you think we can lure him with?

    As for the College of Management. It would be hard to donate there after you let C.J. Skender leave for UNC.

  14. class of '74 03/28/2006 at 11:44 AM #

    We think your comments reveal you are a fool! That’s what we THINK.

  15. class of '74 03/28/2006 at 11:51 AM #

    ^^Read the latest from Seton Hall for ideas of what to do with a coach who beat us like a rented mule and got in the NCAAT only to find out he wasn’t cutting it. They have an AD who rightly or wrongly has a vision and isn’t afraid to make a decision and live with that decision. It’s called accountability. It occurs in the real world everyday but has yet to find it’s way onto our campus.

  16. Greg 03/28/2006 at 11:58 AM #

    ’74 – you think I am a fool?

    Prove my opinion wrong then. Show me I am a fool. You appear to be smart and wise. I implore you, PLEASE prove me wrong.

    Cant you see. I am on your side. I want someone else too…I just understand that the only way to get it is through patience. Complaining, witholding money, etc wont do it. Herb has to go out and prove that he cant get the job done and he hasnt proven that yet. We havent been great but we havent been bad either. Unfortunately, thats not enough to get him fired, yet. I dont think you should punish the athletes who are spending the best years of their life competing for our alma mater.

    You can insult me, call me a fool, make fun of my typing, whatever. It doesnt change the reality of the matter. Until something WORSE happens, we have a coach and his name is Herb.

  17. Greg 03/28/2006 at 12:04 PM #

    Comparing Seton Hall and NCSU isnt equitable.

    Seton Hall had more issues than a so-so record and first round loss in the NCAA. Add in some problems with the coach and the administration, a few off the court problems, and a complete lack of recruiting for the last three seasons (no commits for 2006) and you have the recipe for dismissal.

  18. old13 03/28/2006 at 12:09 PM #

    Cardiff Giant, the response from the AA dircetor expressed similar frustrations about Wolfpack basketball, advised that my comments have been passed on to the Chancellor, and urged me to not stop donations to non-athletic areas.

  19. Greg 03/28/2006 at 12:12 PM #

    Oh…as long as Seton Hall is on the list…are you willing to dismiss Herb to take one of the coaches they are talking about hiring?

    You ever see years in the NBA draft where teams trade their first round pick for future picks? The reason they do that is because there isnt anything out there they think can help them. I see NCSU being in the same boat. Who is out there? We are better off taking a chance on another year of averageish basketball and then see what we can scrape up.

    Everyone repeatedly mentions Barnes but he has an abysmal record vs K and Roy and has the advantage of having a monsterous recruiting base to recruit from there in Texas. He has yet to prove he can coach a team to victory even with superior talent.

  20. old13 03/28/2006 at 12:18 PM #

    If alumni and fans’ opinions don’t matter, then why does NCSU even participate in NCAA athletics? Are they only for the top 25 contributors, the chancellor and the academic committees? If the adacemic side doesn’t even care about athletics, why not just eliminate them? BTW I can identify a skunk by smell even though I was not a zoology major.

  21. Sammy Kent 03/28/2006 at 12:23 PM #


    Sorry dude, your arguements don’t wash. People that are paid to perform a job are not more qualified or gifted simply because they are paid. People are paid to do a job and fired for not performing to standards every day, sometimes by people that know absolutely nothing about the nuts and bolts of the job in question, but can judge results. The problem we have is an athletic director that claims to know all the nuts and bolts, but nonetheless makes his decisions based on criteria OTHER THAN MEASURABLE, QUANTIFIABLE RESULTS. He sets no specific goals, no definitive criteria, brandishes no measuring stick, and demands no results. In any other real world venture he would have been gone long ago.

    Let me use the example of my profession: video editing. There are tens of millions of people in this country that know absolutely nothing about the intricacies of video editing. Nonetheless, they know good television when they see it. They know poor editing when they see it. If I understand that my job depends on having satisfied viewers I don’t alienate them by telling them their opinion doesn’t matter because they’ve never been paid to sit at an Avid console and edit.

    Worse, we have a basketball coach that has concocted a coaching and recruiting strategy SPECIFICALLY DESIGNED TO AVOID COMPETING EITHER IN THE RECRUITING WARS OR ON THE COURT WITH HIS SCHOOL’S BIGGEST RIVALS, guaranteeing that he will never be able to consistently do what he has already conceded that he CANNOT do: compete and win against the best. But because his employer doesn’t make that any kind of priority, he feels no conscience about being a consistent loser, no shame in failing to accomplish any achievement of note in a decade, and incredibly arrogant, snobbish condescension to anyone with the audacity to suggest that either he or someone else could do better.

    The attitude of the athletic department, and so perfectly enumerated by you is what is sooner or later going to be Lee Fowler’s and Herb Sendek’s downfall. Whether you like it or not, yes indeed, we feel that our committments of time, effort, money, passion, and devotion to our school entitles us to a voice and a say. It does give us the right to matter. Your opinion to the contrary notwithstanding, I assure you we WILL have our voice heard because we DO matter.

  22. class of '74 03/28/2006 at 12:34 PM #

    If you are walking in the woods and you suspect you are going down the wrong path do you continue down that path? Do you say to yourself if I will just stay patient everything will work itself out in time? Is that your answer?

    That seems to be your answer with Herb. Personally I would make the change just as Seton Hall has done, and just as Ohio State, Florida and USC did in football. Guys like Herb are not hard to find as evidenced by the lack of interest from other schools in his services!

  23. BJD95 03/28/2006 at 12:37 PM #

    I’ll second Jeff’s notion – we all KNOW that our opinions don’t matter. That’s why I haven’t bothered with writing letters to the AD, chancellor, or even Bobby Purcell.

    Unless you’re in the Top 25-100 range of the WC, they don’t care. So be it. They will reap what they sow as a result of making it abundantly clear that we don’t matter.

    I’ve said repeatedly that I don’t expect Fowler to fire Sendek. But he could sure as hell give him the old Dave Odom treatment – i.e., “it’s not working out here – you had better find something else while you still have SOME degree of marketability.” With that in place, Sendek would have considered some jobs that might actually be willing to talk to him (e.g., Oregon State), rather than just “A list” openings which wouldn’t touch him with a 10-foot pole.

    Of course we don’t know ALL of the story. But we know enough to figure out that are concerns are being marginalized, and all that the athletics administration wants us to do is be quiet so business as usual can continue.

    The administration had the necessary cover from statewide media (thanks at least in part to the voices of protest arising from this blog and elsewhere) to push Sendek out the door. They chose to do NOTHING but “stay the course.” And, as I said, they will now reap what they sow.

  24. class of '74 03/28/2006 at 12:38 PM #

    May I remind you sir that hope is not a strategy! Bold men take action and NCSU is lacking in bold men when it comes to the athletic department!

  25. Cardiff Giant 03/28/2006 at 12:38 PM #

    Old13, thank you.

    I should note that this is not a new concern of mine. There is definitely something amiss when departments are losing faculty for lack of funds and the freaking assistant basketball coach is tooling around in a donated Cadillac Escalade. That’s sickening.

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