Holland credits NC State for allowing ECU athletics to stand on its own
Thanks, Terry!
“both of you (Lee Fowler and Dick Baddour) have been extremely cooperative in helping us in ways that have given ECU Athletics an opportunity to stand on its own”
This whole pissing match between the embarrassment that is Lee Fowler and the AD too-good-for-his-current school (Terry Holland) is too ridiculous for words.
Since our great conversation earlier in the week, the N&O updated the scheduling snafu with a link to an adobe version of the actual letter.
Although the N&O says that “both schools” released the letter we know that is obviously false and are already catching them in lies! There is no way that anyone inside of Lee Fowler’s Athletics Department has enough computer savy to understand how to scan a letter into a PDF file. I can’t fathom that NC State would even spend the money on Adobe software to allow them to convert to PDF. If the letter was hand-written in crayon and stapled to some other sticky notes, THEN we could believe it.
The letter is interesting on many fronts, if for no other reason that we get to see some insight into things that we don’t typically get to see. We think Fowler shows some good and some bad here:
(1) Good for insisting that NC State not play ECU any more than UNC does. It’s about time we find some parity in this situation.
(2) Bad for discussing a 20 year continuation of the series! Good God, I’ll be retired if this thing goes through.
850 The Buzz has some background and perspective in this blog entry but it is Adam Gold’s entry that has more meat in it and picks up on some of all of his:
In a recent interview, Lee Fowler said that East Carolina wanted to “back off” their non-conference schedule and that was the reason for the amended deal. Terry Holland had to be livid at that remark — even though it’s almost certainly the truth — as it really wasn’t Mr. Fowler’s place to give out East Carolina’s motives for the changes. And, as a result it’s hard to blame Mr. Holland for lashing back with his 5-point memo posted on ECU’s web site.
But, sometimes the truth hurts. And Holland doesn’t want to appear to the be the impetus for spacing out these contracts over longer periods of time. But, it would create more schedule flexibility in the short term, and at the same time it would enable him to tell his constituants that those precious deals now extend well past the quarter pole of the 21st century.
2037?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? ARE YOU NUTS? (Sorry for the all caps, I was channeling Mr. Holland for a second)
There is no way on this earth that either Lee Fowler or Dick Baddour would ever agree to that part of the addendum. How about this, let’s just credit Terry for thinking outside the box.
Bottom line. It’s really much ado about nothing, but Mr. Fowler lit the match and Terry Holland fanned the flames and that’s where we are.
Of course we’ve all ignored the impact of what the behavior of the Einstein in the AD’s chair at NC State (sarcasm).
You see…during the week after the Wolfpack was propelled into the national spotlight and are gearing up for a chance to take on another Top 15 team on an ESPN network, what topic BETTER to distract the media from keeping Tom O’Brien and the momentum of NC State’s program than a scheduling battle with ECU?
I mean, if the media were actually talking about Coach Tom O’Brien and NC State then they may not be talking as much about Lee Fowler!! And, can Lee Fowler REALLY accept a situation where he isn’t front and center in the middle of media attention?
29 Responses to “Holland credits NC State for allowing ECU athletics to stand on its own”
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A lot of double talk coming out of Terry Holland. You better watch that guy. He’s like that guy at work that only acts nice when he wants something from you. LOL…
Oye vey.
If you read the letter – it’s pretty interesting. My big thing is this – how could any AD worth his salt – agree to a home and home series…unlike ECU, such a series COSTS US A CRAPLOAD OF $$. To remove a potential home game or big game from the schedule every four years is short-sighted.
Of course, Fowler certainly messed up unless he was wanting to get out of this agreement when he opened his mouth.
Does any other BCS conference team play a regular home and home series, on a 1 for 1 basis, with a non-BCS conference team? The only example I can think of is Colorado-Colorado State, and I’m not even sure that is the case there. Anyone?
SFN: That is a really interesting question and a fantastic thought? Does anyone out there have any research/thoughts on this? We should make this a ‘group homework project for the readers of SFN.
Posturing aside, The Pirates have grown. ECU is an established program which packs a 50,000 stadium, their fans travel and they compete against top level teams.
SFN: (1) Their stadium is not 50k seats. They do not pack it for anyone other than the top programs. They do not travel in a manner consistent with this comment. What ‘top level’ teams do they consistently compete against? West Virginia is currently 1-2. VPI is 2-1 and struggled to beat two mediocre teams.
You don’t have to love the Pirates but they are a great matchup which serves like a homecoming with friends and family decked out in both school colors tailgating together.
NCState no longer tops their schedule. They play the likes of West Virginia, Virginia Tech, Virginia, UNC, South Carolina, etc. etc. 3-4 teams deep every season. This year they play WVA, VTCH, NCState, UVA beyond their conference matchups with USM, UCF, Houston, Tulane and a likely undefeated Tulsa if they run to the conference title game….and oh yeah, despite losing to the Pack… still ranked #23 in the nation- which means someone around think country must think they are worthy of competing at this level.
SFN: GREAT! Then they won’t care about playing us and it isn’t a big deal!!!
Point is…. the talk of ‘doing a favor for program barely existing above D1-AA 20 years ago’ does not match that fact- anymore. It’s kind of like the old boy club in a town still calling a guy who is now 40 years old “kid” until they realize that 40 year old now is one of the biggest business players in town. It’s time to grow up on this one. ECU has established a place. I’d play this game every other year home and home. It’s good for the state of North Carolina and the game ‘always’ matters. And- it’s a reunion. I couldn’t care less about traveling to BC or Maryland. I’d trade a take a date with ECU any day and would expect the same from the light blue.
If Notre Dame counts, service acadmies
Doesn’t Wake and Duke play a service academy every year?
USF-UCF was one until this year.
We don’t need more big games. This year’s schedule was perfect IMO.
1. BCS mid-level program home (USF)
2. BCS mid-level program away (South Carolina)
3. Non-BCS division 1 program (ECU)
4. Div 1_AA, Service Academy, other guaranteed win (W&M).
Again, I don’t really see the issue people have with our schedule. We have a nice mix of games. Another reason I like the ECU game is because it is an easy road trip. Instead of having to get to Hattiesburg or Orlando, it is just an hour and 15 minutes from Raleigh.
Next year was supposed to be:
South Carolina home
Pitt home
ECU away
Gardner Webb(Isn’t this the 1-aa game?)
Another perfect OOC schedule for where our program is today. Now with ECU moved back, we are guaranteed to get another Div 1-AA game on the schedule. On Packpride, James Henderson reported he heard Morgan State.
Virginia/Virginia Tech has been played for a long, long time before Tech was a part of the major conference. Virginia Tech didn’t join the Big East until 1991.
They have played 89 times.
Governor gets involved to help schedule Marshall/W. Virginia.
Penn St./Pitt rivalry:
I’ll be honest, I’m more concerned about whether or not anyone in the WPC has the initiative to mow the Trinity Lot at some point this season. It’s like Vietnam out there trying to tailgate.
Colorado and Colorado St have played 80 times.
SFN- I’m about to leave the office so don’t have time to nicely post this as an entry… Some Nate Irving love in Dennis Dodd’s weekend watch list if you haven’t seen it yet…
http://www.sportsline.com/collegefootball/story/10996261
“WWL had one All-American written down for this season, N.C. State linebacker Nate Irving. The Wolfpack’s leading tackler is out indefinitely with a lower-leg injury suffered against East Carolina. Irving was easily the most active linebacker The List has seen this season.”
Lee just continues to step in big “piles of canine excrement” everytime he opens his freakin’ mouth! It amazes me that the WPC, the Alumni Association, the Board of Trustees, or anyone with any remaining brain cells could possibly want this moron to continue to embarrass the University! He is beyond being just an unintelligent person, he is an example of the worst type moron with a big mouth and a oversized ego!
That being the case, where does Obie fit into the scheme of things? How can we continue to have these two dolts at the helm of the ship?
Terry is just messin’ with Lee’s brain and is probably laughing at his stupidity!
Lee, you’re being jerked around and you’re too dumb to even get it!
Playing ECU in Raleigh every couple of years would be OK. Very good gate and maybe you can call it a reunion??? But State has nothing to gain by traveling to Greenville.
Only 2 schools in the ACC have smaller stadiums – Wake & Duke. All but Florida State is served by a larger TV market.
A trip to Greenville to help every 10 or 15 years or so would be something that most of us could live with.
But this game does not help State nearly as much as it helps ECU no matter how BS is said. And games in Greenville do not help State at all – period. And Fowler’s job is to maximize State’s opportunities – not ECU’s.
Texas has played Rice almost every year even after the SWC broke up. Alabama plays Southern Miss about as often as we play ECU, And Aubrun takes Southern Miss the years Bama doesn’t.
Washington actually plays Idaho (a I-AA team) on a fairly regular basis.
“…where does Obie fit into the scheme of things?”
All I figure is that Status quOblinger must be so detached and gullible that a used car salesman like Lee Fowler could smooze him into believing that NC State’s cash cow will dry up without Fowler’s so-called “connections”.
One thing we do know for certain, is that winning at athletics for The NC State Athletics Director, is no where near the top of Oblinger’s list of job requirements.
SFN: (1) Their stadium is not 50k seats. They do not pack it for anyone other than the top programs. They do not travel in a manner consistent with this comment. What ‘top level’ teams do they consistently compete against? West Virginia is currently 1-2. VPI is 2-1 and struggled to beat two mediocre teams.
The ECU-Houston game this weekend in Greenville is reported to be sold out. All season tickets were sold early. A second upper deck is in the contract stage, which will raise the seating by 10-15 K. And when ECU played VT and WVA they were highly ranked (apparently wrongly). And back to allegations from last week, I have read no reports of specific incidents with eCU fans in Raleigh other than second hand accounts, and I have read on this site several positive comments. I will add my own here–my wife and I walked around outside the stadium quite a bit (our daughter is an ECU student) and encountered no problems with Pirate fans. I think we have quite enough to worry about with our own football and AD problems to fret so much about ECU.
I’m (and have been for quite a while) fed up with Foulup, the inept and ridiculous performance of his department administration, Oblinger for allowing it to continue, and the BOT for accepting mediocrity at NCSU in anything!
Old, I think, you, Fred, and a few others keep saying the same thing, beating our heads against the wall, and nothing ever seems to happen! Guess that shows how much they respect our opinions!
Apologies for the repetitive posts highstick. I’d love to just stop, and concentrate only on the games, but our great leadership won’t quite allow that.
Exactly, highstick! That’s why I will not fund anything NCSU until attitudes (and respect for contributors’ money) change there!
sorry for off topic post…
but if anybody wants 2 tickets to the USF game. 45 yard line, 2nd tier about 8 rows back on the east side drop me an e-mail at
waspinks@ncsu.edu
Per my post above- and your (SFN) inserted thoughts (below after my comments). A few tidbits to help:
****THE RECORD FOR ATTENDANCE AT ECU(home)- 50,092 (ECU v. NCSU 1999)
****TRAVEL ATTENDENCE: NCSU ‘BEGAN’ SCHEDULING ECU TO CREATE SELL-OUT CROWDS AND PAY FOR CARTER-FINLEY. TOP 10 ATTENDED GAMES AT UNC, NCSU, DUKE AND WAKE ALL INCLUDE GAMES WITH ECU.
****THE TOP 20 WINNINGEST TEAMS IN COLLEGE FOOTBALL OVER THE PAST 20 YEARS:
1. Oklahoma 90-17,
2. Boise State 86-16,
3. Texas 85-17,
4. LSU 82-22
5. Ohio State 81-20,
6. USC 81-21,
7. Georgia 80-23,
8. VA Tech 79-25
9. Miami 76-23,
10. Auburn 75-27,
11. Louisville 74-26,
12. Florida 74-28
13. Michigan 73-27,
14. TCU 72-26,
15. Boston Coll. 71-30,
16. Tennessee 71-31
17. Wisconsin 69-34,
18. Florida State 69-34,
19. West VA 68-31,
20. Oregon 67-32
ECU HAS COMPETED AGAINST 8 OF 20 (Boise, VTech, Miami, Lvl, TCU, TN, FSU, WVa). 6 on multiple occasions during that period. Wins against 5. (NCSU HAS COMPETED AGAINST 6 OF 20 (TX, VTech, Miami, Lvl, BC, FSU). 4 on multiple ocasions. Wins against 4.
**** HOPE THIS HELPS.
——————————————————————-
Posturing aside, The Pirates have grown. ECU is an established program which packs a 50,000 stadium, their fans travel and they compete against top level teams.
SFN: (1) Their stadium is not 50k seats. They do not pack it for anyone other than the top programs. They do not travel in a manner consistent with this comment. What ‘top level’ teams do they consistently compete against? West Virginia is currently 1-2. VPI is 2-1 and struggled to beat two mediocre teams.
You don’t have to love the Pirates but they are a great matchup which serves like a homecoming with friends and family decked out in both school colors tailgating together.
NCState no longer tops their schedule. They play the likes of West Virginia, Virginia Tech, Virginia, UNC, South Carolina, etc. etc. 3-4 teams deep every season. This year they play WVA, VTCH, NCState, UVA beyond their conference matchups with USM, UCF, Houston, Tulane and a likely undefeated Tulsa if they run to the conference title game….and oh yeah, despite losing to the Pack… still ranked #23 in the nation- which means someone around think country must think they are worthy of competing at this level.
SFN: GREAT! Then they won’t care about playing us and it isn’t a big deal!!!
Point is…. the talk of ‘doing a favor for program barely existing above D1-AA 20 years ago’ does not match that fact- anymore. It’s kind of like the old boy club in a town still calling a guy who is now 40 years old “kid” until they realize that 40 year old now is one of the biggest business players in town. It’s time to grow up on this one. ECU has established a place. I’d play this game every other year home and home. It’s good for the state of North Carolina and the game ‘always’ matters. And- it’s a reunion. I couldn’t care less about traveling to BC or Maryland. I’d trade a take a date with ECU any day and would expect the same from the light blue.
Press Release of the Future:
GREENVILLE, NC September 20, 2156 – Talking head (literally; a la Futurama) Terry Holland refutes Lee Fowler’s head’s claim that the Wolfpack 3000 will, indeed, not be traveling to Dowdy-Ficklen Stadium 13 times over the next 30 years, but, rather, only 10. This is just one in a long line of conflicts that Fowler and Holland have been involved in. After SpacePirate fans melted down NC Region University’s (formerly known as NC State University before the World was United under a genetically composed “child” of all the greatest leaders in the world) platinum goal posts with hidden micro-lasers implanted in their eyes after their first upset of the Wolfpack 3000 in 149 years, there were calls from many to end the series all-together. Fowler’s head was quick to forgive and forget, but the outrage of Wolfpack 3000 fans was too much to overcome. Although Fowler’s head has been quick to dismiss fan complaints in the past, he can no longer afford to. In an effort to bring in extra revenue after losing all of his money in the infamous “Pig Dung Fuel” failed stock, Fowler began to auction off his decisions to the highest bidder. This, surprisingly, has not darkened Fowler’s outlook on life. His only stipulation–that he be allowed to teleport-in to talk-video shows at his leisure–has kept Fowler’s head quite content. The latest money-savvy decision by Fowler’s head has some fans finally talking about a possible end to Fowler’s reign. After talking then-NC State’s chancellor James Oblinger in the early 2000′s to putting all of his time into getting a Fowler an eternal contract, fans have suffered few highs and many lows. After 75 years of sport-irrelevance in the last part of last century–referred to many fans simply as “The Dark Ages” or “The Great Depression”–NC Region fans finally found renewed hope in their football program when Philip Rivers cryogenic body was unfrozen and given 5 more years of eligibility due to new NCAA rules that give players 9 years to play due to the long period of time students need to complete college while working 60 hour per week jobs to help offset astronomic tuition rises. This was a big break for a program that was hit hard with sanctions after the NCAA decided to enforce every single, possible hint of infraction. NCAA President and heir to Satan’s throne, Dean Smith’s head claims that all sanctions are justified and completely legal. Interestingly, his former school, the recently renamed, University of All That’s Good and Holy, has just signed 3 more future basketball stars from prison and all are expected to be released in time to enroll. Fowler’s head’s lessened role has certainly reduced him from just a head to a mere figurehead. Some have recently speculated that Fowler’s head is not, in fact, real, but only machine. This is based on Fowler’s head’s constant blank expression and sometimes seemingly meaningless statements. Historians, however, point out that even when Fowler was a complete body, this was his normal practice. All of this talk may be irrelevant in five days when European scientists attempt to “reignite” the sun with knowledge gained from the failed Particle Collider that was built in former Switzerland region, the area now known as “the uninhabitable zone” after numerous black holes began to reduce the area to nothing until the world’s first “force field” was invented. Although many scientists claim that the sun is in no need of reignition, others claim that cold temperatures around the world indicate a dying sun and that the sun continue to decline if nothing is done. The downside, of course, is that scientists accidentally explode the sun thus destroying all of humanity. Fowler’s head was unable to be reached for comment. Asteroid fields made communication impossible from Fowler’s vacation home on Jupiter’s Europa moon.
NC State played Ohio St twice in ’03 and ’04, Florida in the ’92 Gator Bowl, and Michigan in the ’94 Hall of Fame bowl for 9 of 20. They of course lost to all three.