“N.C. State’s fans are among the most patient and loyal in all of college athletics.” That hardly qualifies as breaking news, but it’s worth repeating in the wake of a couple of issues — fans leaving early and the coach’s frank comments.”
As we’ve said many times in the past…when Caulton Tudor gets something right, he usually REALLY gets it right. This morning’s column is a prime example.
As the previous quote suggests, Tudor’s article covers completely two separate issues under the single canopy of great Wolfpack fans – (1) faulty conclusions and criticisms of fans who left Saturday’s game early by some fans and (2) the honesty of Coach Tom O’Brien and the REAL condition of NC State’s football program.
We aren’t going to spend any time commenting on the football part of the column. Tudor (politely) nails the horrible condition that Chuck Amato left NC State’s roster at key positions, including the offensive line that we most recently highlighted with this fantastic piece.
Quickly, I’d like to add a little more to Tudor’s comments:
With their team helplessly behind and enduring heat every bit as unremitting as Clemson’s rushing attack, many State fans left at halftime or during the second half.
The exodus irked some of those who stayed around until the final series or two. There were shouts of “sit back down” and “real fans don’t quit.” Some departing fans were booed by their stadium neighbors.
Most of what happened obviously was the upshot of frustration, but the fans were being entirely too tough on each other in this case. That was particularly true of those seated on the east side of the stadium, where there was no shade from the afternoon sun and 90-degree temperature. A relatively high percentage of those in the east stands were students, who had been forced to wait in line until after the game started just to get through the gates.
Loyalty and devotion to the program, by necessity, became secondary to common sense and sound health for many of the evacuees.
First – I abhor fans who tell others how to think, behave , or “be a real fan”. I look at these folks as the ‘liberals’ of any fan base – they always seem to know better what I SHOULD do with my money, my time, my behavior, my family and my thoughts.
Of course, these are usually the folks who have never once tried to “walk a mile in another man’s shoes” to understand the plight of their fellow fans. Ususally, the people who criticize other fans are the ones that have the easiest life and make minimal sacrifice when compared to the fans that they criticize.
The characteristics are easy to spot – they live in Raleigh, if not very near Carter-Finley; they woke up about 3 hours before the game and rolled into the stadium with little problem; the will be home in 15 minutes with the long remainder of they day in front of them.
It is easy for them to SAY that they would REGULARLY wake in the wee hours of the morning or drive late on Friday night from Richmond, Wilmington, Charlotte, Asheville or further to spend hundreds of dollars on hotels and transportation to sacrifice their entire weekend…yet when given the similar opportunity to travel to College Park, Charlottesville, Atlanta or Clemson to watch the Wolfapck these critical folks always seem to be busy with other things.
(Note: the author of this piece attended approximately twenty NC State home and away football games in a four year period while living in Houston, TX. I chose not to account for all of the expenses that us crazys incur to have the right to make our own personal decisions without being criticized by others.)
Caulton Tudor and the people with whom he interacts regularly travel to watch football (and basketball) all over the country. With that experience, Tudor concludes and regularly states that NC State fans are some of the most loyal, passionate AND PATIENT in the country. I don’t need to think too deeply to realize that the critical yahoo’s to whom he is referring in his article fit the profile that I discussed in this piece last week perfectly.
I like to occassionaly take opportunities to educate and highlight items from athletics programs not named NC State because there are many fans out there who have no idea what athletic are like at other schools. If you haven’t been to many (basketball &/or football) games at a variety of other programs then it is hard to understand where NC State support is both good and bad. Most likely, however, a fan who hasn’t been to many other places would easily take for granted the strong support that both our basketball and football programs receive from Wolfpack fans when compared to other schools.
As Tudor wisely stated:
The more important fact was that the stadium was sold out and most seats filled for a noon game on a sweltering day. The same fans who left early had also made their way through the usual pregame traffic jams. Many were in those same seats throughout a 3-9 record last season and will be back next season even if 2007 ends with a similar record.
Post-Script – As a related comment to the football-side of Tudor’s column where he posits that State’s struggling relies in part on poor quarterback recruiting and development from the previous staff; I submit this quote from Tudor originally written in April of 2005 regarding the importance of a good quarterback to a football team.
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September 26th, 2007 at 9:41 am
Funny, I look at those folks as the ‘conservatives’ of any fan base – they always seem to know better what I SHOULD do with my money, my time, my behavior, my family and my thoughts.
September 26th, 2007 at 9:44 am
^ I thought that would be the case. Just a personal point of view. We’d like to keep the conversation on the broader topic and are using this comment to inform folks that any political conversations will be deleted from this entry.
“Both sides” have now said the exact same thing about the other. There is no reason for any more conversation.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:07 am
I’m just glad Beck is still the starter. IMO, he is the only QB option that even remotely gives us a chance at winning 3 or more games.
I refuse to admit that we have a zero percent chance of winning 6 games, even though the evidence makes it seem like winning the lottery would be more likely.
I felt like we’d be doing well to win 6 or 7 games this year but I never imagined we would be this bad. As you can tell, I’m still highly frustrated from Saturday.
However, I’ll be there at 10:29 am with red on to cheer for the Pack. I’ll just have lower expectations.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:08 am
You know, it’s funny but I never really judged fans on whether they stayed all the way to the end. I figured they paid for the tickets so they could leave when they felt like it. Good play with the corresponding results seems to keep people in the seats. I did leave early during the Marshall game that we won in the last minute and have always regretted not seeing that comeback.
TOB didn’t say anything that should not have been said. He was professional about it but honest. Ask anyone who played for Dick SHeridan how much sugar-coating they got and a Sheridan interview was never very lively.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:18 am
Great article by Tudor. You know, I used to be one of those fans who couldn’t stand him…I thought he was antagonistic toward State. But these last several years he seems to really “get it” which is what I appreciate about the local journalists. He’s been working closely with Joe Giglio these last several years, who went to State (I actually worked with Giglio at The Technician). So I don’t know if working with Giglio has “softened” him up toward State or if I’ve just come to see his point of view, but I always look forward to his articles.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:24 am
I sat in the upper East side. I was wearing jeans (bad prep on my part) and sweating profusely. I felt bad early on due to the heat but stayed thru the third quarter. The game was over and I felt (physically) bad. I make no apologies. If it had been raining, I’d have probably done the same thing. Sometimes the weather just gets to you.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:29 am
Sorry RedTerror but STATEFANS has it correct. The “conservative” fan IS the one who says that it’s your money and your time and YOU should decide how best to use it.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:32 am
Those of us that grew up diehard State fans have always had a dogged loyalty-to-a-fault mentality; we’ve set standards for ourselves on what being a “good fan” means.
I pay $1,300 per year in WPC, LTRs, parking and tickets. That alone has earned me the right to walk out of a game whenever I feel like it the same way I turn a bad game off when I’m watching it on TV.
Bad fans like me built that stadium all the good fans are sitting in.
As for Tudor, I’ve always found his columns insightful.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:35 am
/\ I pay $1500 and agree.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:52 am
To be clear (and not to get off on a political tangent), there are subsets of all political stripes who are certain that they know how to tell you to live your life and should be entitled to do so. It’s really a lack of “real world” pragmatism and, as the author noted, lack of empathy.
Frankly, if you pay your hard-earned money to buy LTRs, support the Wolfpack Club, and still pay for somehat overpriced tickets (especially to see a bad product) – then you have the right to do whatever you see fit. We wouldn’t HAVE a major D-1 caliber athletics program for the “fair-weather fans” chanters if not for those very people they mock. Whether they come to every game, most games, sometimes leave early or not, or even if they wipe their rear ends with their tickets – it’s absolutely none of your damned business.
And anyone that would ever chant at me (although I almost always stay until the end), expect to hear some choice words in return – whether or not your kids are with you. If you don’t want to be called an asshole or worse, then don’t f-ing act like one.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:56 am
^^^ I thought any future political comments would be deleted. I have my own opinion, but I’ll refrain from posting, to follow the guidelines established.
And no one has yet mentioned the fact that there is real danger involved in keeping small children exposed to the kind of heat we saw Saturday. I was in attendance with my 5-year-old twin boys, and we left at halftime. I have not in any way regretted that decision, as another two hours in the sun may have been detrimental to their health. They were VERY uncomfortable, VERY hot, and bordering on dehydration, even though they were continually drinking bottled water, three bottles of which we thankfully thought to bring in the stadium with us.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:57 am
^^ Very well-said, BJD.
September 26th, 2007 at 10:59 am
noone has to explain anything to anyone, its your seat, your money, your time…. and the product sucks right now. who would want to sit thru a 4th quarter of that garbage.
i felt like rodney dangerfield on Saturday….” whoo, i tell ya, i shoulda stayed home and played with MYSELF!”
September 26th, 2007 at 11:01 am
If an engineer on here could explain how/why Carter-Finley is so much hotter now then it used to be I would appreciate it. I have been to nearly every home game since 1987, and that is by far the hottest it has ever been inside the stadium for a game, even though it may not have been the hottest day in terms of temperature outside the stadium.
With all the building we have done it seems like we have created a gigantic convection oven.
September 26th, 2007 at 11:06 am
^global warming, obviously
September 26th, 2007 at 11:14 am
I’m an engineer, I’ll take this one. The team just sucks all the fresh air out of you, that’s all.
September 26th, 2007 at 11:16 am
GF in a C — That would be an interesting sunject for some of our Engineers and Architectural students at State to study. As a Liberal Arts major — it makes sense to “presume” that the larger building at the South end impedes air flow, that more concrete in the Southern (end zone) stands absorbs and thus radiates more heat. Throw in the structures to the north end impeding airflow and absorbing heat and we could be in a “shake and bake” stadium.
September 26th, 2007 at 11:17 am
I’m paying now for staying through the end. I got a farmer’s tan like nobody’s business.
I’m not going to harass someone over leaving a blowout on either side early, but it’s foolish to cut out of a game like the BC game last year. I don’t really get people driving 3 hours for the game leaving early either. I make that crappy drive and like to soak in as much tailgating and football as possible. But it’s their ticket.
I was highly amused at a couple who looked like they were in their 70’s yelling at a middle-aged couple for leaving the NIT game in Reynolds early. I can’t for the life of me imagine why anyone who have wanted to leave that game early the atmosphere was so electric.
Conservatives or liberals, leavers or stayers, standers or sitters, somebody is always up in your business.
September 26th, 2007 at 11:17 am
The word should be “subject” but somehow sunject seems oddly appropos.
September 26th, 2007 at 11:18 am
I, like many others spend a good bit on my set of LTR’s. I don’t really care what others do as far as staying or leaving early, especilly in a game such as this past one, given the weather and the lopsidedness.
I for one never leave a game early, regardless of the weather, or score (unless someone became ill as some of the folks and kids around us). I stayed untill the end Saturday. I stayed until the end many years ago in a cold rain when Virginia was kicking our but in a game. That is my own choice and others can do as they want. I go out early and make a day of it. For me, I don’t understand making the effort of doing all of the usual game stuff and then leaving early. I want to get my “money’s worth” of money and time spent there.
I enjoy the college football game day traditions and one of my families traditions is always staying to the end of the game!
September 26th, 2007 at 11:19 am
(Hopefully this is only *mildly* political)
As a libertarian, I can see both sides. I feel like I’m told to do things with my life and money by the religious conservatives and the PC liberals. As a libertarian, I’m a bit disappointed when people leave before I do (because *I’m* right, dadnabbit!!) and a bit annoyed when I leave before others, but I usually don’t try to impose my own opinions too harshly.
September 26th, 2007 at 11:23 am
Global warming! Now is that the fault of the conservatives or libs?
I’ve sat through many games in different stadiums and I don’t think it can get any hotter than most opening games in late August or early September in Williams Brice in Columbia. “Girlfriend” has a very astute observation and is probably right. The more the stadium gets “closed in”, the less airflow that you get and it can get miserable. Plus more “body heat”. I hate to see any fan leave at half time, but I can sympathize under the circumstances.
“It’s gonna get worse before it get’s better” and “yes, Noah, it’s pretty bad right now! We just gotta hang in there and keep this team motivated so there’s a glimmer of hope in beating Carolina this year. This losing streak has got to stop!
September 26th, 2007 at 11:25 am
Just for comparison, how did this rate next to the Akron game last year. I was sitting right beside the band at that one, and it was miserable. I can guarantee if we were getting blown out like this year I would have left. It was hard enough to convince my wife to stay when we were still in it. I did spend a fortune on lemonades to keep her with me.
September 26th, 2007 at 11:28 am
The global warming Blog can be found over on Al.Gore.com. This has been a hot year. August was the hottest since 1957 (hotter than 57) in the Triangle and we are in a drought. That stadium and those bricks have absorbed a lot of heat. The solution should be to go to later games early in the season — but the folks who might think that through are prrobably the same ones who have created all the other problems we gripe about.
September 26th, 2007 at 11:35 am
TV determines game times. It’s that simple.