04/20/2015 at 2:24 AM #85344
The fundamental issue is that TOB changed the rules on Wilson.
TOB didn’t simply change the rules, he reneged on a promise. During his recruitment, RW was promised by NC State that he would be able to play both sports if he joined the Wolfpack. This was a MAJOR factor in his choosing NC State.
TOB agreed to honor that promise.
Though he never ruled out the possibility otherwise, playing both sports was never not his plan. The way he put it was that he was going to work hard and have faith in the Lord.
It was about TOB being TOB. Stubborn, and insisting on doing things his way, by his plan. And he was going to prove his way was right, dammit. In a way, RW was a nuisance that got in the way.04/20/2015 at 2:28 AM #85345
And it was RW’s plan all along to return to NC State for his final football season. He answered as he did at the time, publicly anyway, because he didn’t want to air dirty laundry of the brewing ‘issue’.
And the ‘Glennon 2 for 1 argument’ is bullish!t, ridiculously silly. It was wrong tactically, even if it was done in a vacuum. Problem for TOB, it wasn’t done in a vacuum. Then entire team, program, and recruit population was witness.04/20/2015 at 2:44 AM #85346
Apologies for the redundancy, as I realize I’ve posted The same thing numerous times over the course of the post 3 years.04/20/2015 at 8:48 AM #85347PackFamilyParticipant
I loved TOB as a person and at the time as a coach as well. This has got to be one of the worst coaching decisions in CFB’s modern era and it was obvious at the time. He started losing me from this point onward. Only at NCSU do we chase away what turns out to be a Super Bowl winning QB… and then try to rationalize why it was the right decision.
Wisky still laughs at us.04/20/2015 at 8:52 AM #85348PackFamilyParticipant
Russell was not tearing up the world at the time he departed the program. His most promising season was the tail-end of his freshman year, and a number of eggs were laid on the field during the next two years. It was obvious that missing spring practice while chasing some secondary dream was not in the football programs best interest. No way in hell did he appear to be on the track that has played out, and I don’t believe if he’d have stayed in the program, it would have played out the same, regardless.
And then he suddenly became a world beater at Wisky? I think your statement has more to do with our coach’s lack of ability to produce with his talent than anything else.04/20/2015 at 8:57 AM #85349ryebreadParticipant
I’m with Foose on this one. There are some other things in that timeline seemingly omitted.
In hindsight TOB was done with RW when he sent him out on Senior day. I was in the stands and couldn’t understand it. It made perfect since a few months later.
Keep in mind here that RW didn’t ask to be guaranteed to come back to be the starter. He asked to be allowed to come back and compete. I think he knew he’d beat anyone else out, that TOB knew it which is why he wouldn’t let him, that MG knew it, which is why he told the coaches he had to transfer if RW were back, and that the rest of the team knew it, which is why they were a fractured squad that never met expectations.
TOB was done the day he made that decision. Had it really been in the best interest of the program, he’d probably still be here. The second that was done, the expectations started getting raised (because I expect that’s what he promised to justify that decision) and in a very public way. It was sink or swim time for TOB and we know what happened.
As for the parties, it was a darn shame for Wilson’s NC State legacy. It was a good thing for Glennon. If it ridded us of TOB, then I am thankful. He was a terrible hire from day one.
More than anything I am glad that Yow/those in control timed things as they did. DD has things pointed in the right direction and seems to be a better overall fit. If that is the end result of all of this, even if unforeseen and in no way imagined, then we came out way ahead.04/20/2015 at 9:13 AM #85351
Here is the real nc state $&#+….flashback to tob’s 1st year and rw’s true freshman year. Nc state is in the bye week after a terrible start. Rw is given time with 1st team and a series of plays are being prepped just in case since Evans and beck have been struggling.
We go to Greenville and Evans starts off hot, the team wins the next 4 games. If the offense was like it had been the first half of the season – there’s a good chance we don’t have this discussion.
From what I have been able to gather, rw was shown the door by tob. I hate it for both rw and Glennon…and I hate it for the wolfpack nation…. That’s just how we roll.
But here’s another thought. If we hire Paul Johnson – does rw wish to be a tackle dummy is his basic scheme?04/20/2015 at 9:17 AM #85352ncsu_kappaParticipant
“But I didn’t think he would tell me not to come back,” Wilson said. “North Carolina State was an awesome experience for me. I graduated in three years and went to grad school. I wanted to finish my senior year [of football] there.”
“I tried to do everything right. I love NC State. It was just one of those things. Coach O’Brien wanted to move on. So I had to move on, too.”
I remember reading another article maybe on GoPack where Wilson was like, name Glennon the starter and plan as if not going to be at NC State. Just give me an opportunity to compete for the job. We all know how that convo ended. One man’s trash is another man’s treasure.04/20/2015 at 10:40 AM #85355budfox88Participant
OP may be right with some of the facts, but disagree with his point. Shelf-life in this business is microseconds, so when the moons line up and you finally have a shot you take it, and you don’t run off (yes, run off) your best asset…next season be damned. Again, microseconds! TOB was a disaster. You can see what he was by what he left behind…nothing! That alone should reinforce the belief that TOB was an idiot in the way he botched the RW situation. And FWIW, I don’t think Glennon would have gone ANYWHERE even if RW came back for several reasons we don’t have time to dive into here. And this debate should probably go away, if for no other reason than we don’t want to continue to remind recruits of what could happen to them here if they turn out to be exceptional!04/20/2015 at 10:43 AM #85356
I think your statement has more to do with our coach’s lack of ability to produce with his talent than anything else.
While I think Bible and TOB deserve kudos for their role in developing Wilson, they sometimes couldn’t get out of their own way when it came to game planning with the talent in their QB (which isn’t unrelated to TOB eventually ‘releasing’ RW, the ‘my way’ thing…). VT is probably the best example, the game at CF when the Wolfpack jumped out to a huge lead (if only that end-around isn’t fumbled!) but RW threw a few picks to aid in VT’s comeback.
It drove me nuts during the game to see RW just loft long passes up for grabs. I was thinking, “wtf is he doing”. Hello?… score, clock, situation… Then in the post game, TOB revealed that was the game plan, and they stuck with it even after big lead. That is, the game plan called for RW to loft up the passes and rely on Stat’s big receivers to outjump the Tech DB’s.
Really? I good tactic to employ, but a game plan centered on it. “Brilliant”.
As an aside, I also acknowledge the irony that the challenges Bible/TOB had fitting RW into their system, and their system to RW, played a significant role in RW’s development and his success at Wisconsin and the NFL. In fact, without it, I don’t think RW goes to Wisconsin. And without that season as a Badger, where is RW today?04/20/2015 at 10:52 AM #85357OutWestWolfParticipant
Wilson is the most overrated QB in the NFL.
Hard to know where to start with this one… First I’ll admit the hype around the NFL version of Wilson at times gets a little much but that, quite simply, is what the ever present media does.
Please simply check out RW 3 down stats while playing in the strongest division in the NFL (let me emphasize NFL) and in big games in the NFL. Let’s throw in all while making less than 800K/year from the SHs.
44 you have a singular and special view on things!04/20/2015 at 11:11 AM #85359Alpha WolfKeymaster
It must be summer, relatively speaking.04/20/2015 at 11:34 AM #85360BJD95Keymaster
It was a difficult situation for all concerned. I really, really wish Wilson would stop talking about it. Not really fair to Glennon, who kept his mouth shut and relied on certain assurances made to him.04/20/2015 at 12:23 PM #85361
I saw that horse move04/20/2015 at 2:37 PM #85373Pack MentalityParticipant
One thing that I remember clearly was that TOB tried to force Wilson to be a pocket passer, and did not utilize his strengths. When Wilson did scramble and try to make plays on his own (in his last year here) was usually when we were down in the second half and he’d help with a comeback or we would still lose the game after he did everything he could. At the time and to this day I believed that the way in which TOB forced Wilson to play into TOB’s system and not changing the game plan to accommodate his star qb’s strengths was a severely limiting factor for Wilson. Within TOB’s system Glennon was just as good as Wilson. If TOB wasn’t so stubborn and used Wilson properly then we could have had more wins in each season Wilson was here as well as probably had him stay the last year.
I always thought that TOB wanted to be old school and just didn’t want a “running quarterback.”04/20/2015 at 3:20 PM #85375
Wilson is the most overrated QB in the NFL.
I have to hand it to you. Every time I think you’ve peaked, you outdo yourself.04/20/2015 at 8:50 PM #85399Alpha WolfKeymaster
To be fair, Wilson only ranked 12th in QBR last year. At the same time, he gets the job done and is one of the most effective QB’s in the League, stats or no stats.04/20/2015 at 9:35 PM #85405
Wilson’s qb ratings haven’t been that high because his completion % isn’t usually above average (but I think it was pretty high @ Wisconsin) – his greatest strength isn’t his accuracy – he’s a very good decision maker and a great scrambler.
When forced to be a traditional qb – he’s not as strong. But, if I could pick a qb to lead a team in the 4th quarter, he’d be one of the top 5.
That said, this probably wasn’t the best year for him to pursue baseball. He had a mediocre championship game and threw the game-ending pick in the super bowl. I don’t think baseball will/did cause him to not be as good, it just is a lightning rod when things don’t go well.
Ironically, it’s the same kind of stubborn streak that tob demonstrates: “I don’t care if it doesn’t make sense, I am going to do what I want to do.”04/20/2015 at 9:50 PM #85406mak4dpakParticipant
TOB is gone, RW, is gone, MG is gone, history! Can’t go back in time. DD is the coach, and JB is our QB. Go Pack! Time to move on!04/20/2015 at 9:55 PM #85407BassPackerParticipant
I’ll probably get blasted for saying this BUT….”cry me a river Russell”. He just needs to shut up…he made his decision to play professional baseball and TOB did not owe him anything. I was at senior day, Wilson went thru ceremonies and basically did what he told TOB, he told everyone in Carter he was playing baseball. If Wilson really was honest, his paultry stats on the diamond was more the factor in his decision to come back. I don’t fault TOB with his decision to stick by Glennon. You can’t have your cake and eat it too….Wilson announced he was gone, went thru the motions, and then decided to come back and cries about being kicked off? If I decide to leave my wife for some young blonde because everyone told me its where I should be and better move then decide to come back to my wife like nothing happened only to find the locks have changed and she’s moved on…well…you wouldn’t hear me saying “I was kicked out”. Life is full of hard choices, Wilson made his that senior day. TOB did the right thing, Glennon was the only one who should not have had the rules changed and they were not.04/20/2015 at 10:22 PM #85411
Wilson was #10 in passer rating and total offense in 2014. He was #6 in yards per completion and #7 in yards per attempt. He was #4 in interception percentage. He tied for the league lead with 5 game winning drives. He led the league in yards per carry.
He actually had better passing numbers in 2013, but Seattle let Tate walk last offseason, Sidney Rice retired, starting TE Zach Miller missed most of last season, and the team traded Harvin early in the season. So he was working with a pretty weak set of targets.
Consider a few impressive facts from his career to date:
1. Wilson’s career NFL record is 42-14 (regular and postseason). In the 2 seasons under Carroll before Wilson was drafted, Seattle was 14-18.
2. Seattle has only lost one game by more than 7 points with Wilson at QB — they lost 21-30 @SD earlier in 2014, with SD kicking a FG with 20 seconds remaining to get to that final margin. So the Seahawks have won 75% of their games with Wilson at QB, and they have been in every single game.
3. Wilson has already led 15 game winning drives in his career. So he has led a game winning drive more often than his team has lost with him at QB.
Obviously, Wilson is not the only reason for these facts. In particular, the defense has had a lot to do with #1 and #2. But this is still extremely impressive.04/20/2015 at 10:26 PM #8541204/20/2015 at 10:52 PM #85413BassPackerParticipant
My comments are more toward those who argue TOB handled the situation wrong like he ran Wilson off. Those were not just passing references with a casual answer to a reporter from Wilson stating he was run off. No need to post a link on Wilsons announcement, it was highly reported and stated by Wilson he was gonna play professional baseball. Anyone who followed Wilson knew his first choice was the diamond. Anyone who was at the last home game Wilson played knew had decided to take the Rocky road and head to the mountains. Don’t get me wrong, I loved seeing RW in Wolfpack red and white another year, it would have made those LTR seats bills easier. Facts are facts, Wilson was overated on the diamond and perhaps alittle misguided with which sport he would have a better chance to succeed. I think Wilson reference was more a jab at NCState because he had success at Wisky and now NFL, why he needs to be careful what he says about his departure with State/TOB. Maybe even alittle bitter because TOB chose Glennon instead of jumping when Wilson decided to come back in the fall. Like someone said….time to move on just like Wilson did…. or said he was.04/20/2015 at 10:54 PM #85414
Bass – according to those who support Wilson in these version of events, Wilson was basically told to do this on Senior day by tob. If you look around, you’ll certainly see posters who probably had access to this info and that’s what they say. Tob doesn’t have the same online support. Given the lack of a contrary position, I am tempted to side with the “he was encouraged to walk with the seniors” version of events.04/20/2015 at 11:10 PM #85415
^Agree with Chop here.
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