02/17/2017 at 10:30 AM #118126ryebreadParticipant
Just some quick thoughts:
– Yow had too much faith in Gott, but we’ve all been there.
– Performance at work is often linked to lifestyle outside of it. If things are going well at home, then performance is generally better at work. When there’s turmoil at home, the bare minimum will often be done at work. As a leader, it is important to understand the pulse of what is happening with one’s employees outside of their work.
– Both Sid and Gott have had personal life distractions that impacted the product they put on the court. There is no sense in rehashing either out of respect to all parties involved. No good will come of it. Both are now gone.
– Gott being gone has ZERO impact on DSJ. DSJ is going pro and has been after one year since before he ever signed with NC State. He’ll be a top 5 pick. He’d have been a top 5 pick out of high school and never attended college if not for the NBA’s rules. That’s not to say Dennis a bad kid, bad student, etc.. I have no reason to believe that. It’s just that he didn’t need college in any way to pursue professional employment in basketball. The only thing he needed to show the NBA was that his knee has recovered, and he’s clearly done that. DSJ being a one and done is at least part of the reason that Cat wasn’t here this year. There wasn’t enough “ball” for both of them.
– I personally think the one and done rule is awful. Let the kids go right out of high school if they want to. If the NBA is dumb enough to draft them and they bust out, then that’s on them. The college game is already trash compared to the NBA. Funneling kids through for one year isn’t improving the college game, though it does give the NBA a chance to “screen” some kids. Let the NBA screen kids in the DL, and let the kids focus on what they want to do (which for many has nothing to do with a degree).
– The timing is probably as good as it is going to get to get Arch. I personally thought it was better last year before he signed an extension at Dayton, but we decided to roll the dice and give Gott another go. I’d have loved to have seen what Arch could have done with this year’s roster. That could have spring boarded him to a monster recruiting class.
– If we don’t get Arch this time, we’re likely not getting Arch for the next 15 or so years. This is the window. We need to put forth an offer he can’t refuse. He’ll be in play at places like Ohio State, Indiana, Kentucky and Louisville very, very soon because there have already been rumblings with all four of those fan bases about him. He was already in play at Florida last year.
– If we don’t get Arch in this search, I’ll be sad but at peace with it because I’ll know that we tried. I’d have been done with NC State basketball if we’d have kept Gott another year and Arch ended up elsewhere this offseason.
– My read on Yow is that she cares a lot about her legacy. She wants a home run hire as badly as the fans do. She’ll go down swinging, even if it means a monster offer that might put us in a hole in the future.02/17/2017 at 10:32 AM #118128VaWolf82Keymaster
As expected, the land of trolls (ie CBS Sports) takes the first shot at State fans titled:
This should temper wild expectations for NC State: ‘I wouldn’t touch that job’02/17/2017 at 10:44 AM #118130BJD95Keymaster
Naturally, Parrish points out only a very selective couple of “facts” and leaves lots of stuff out. All of the off-court dramatics, the wheels falling completely off in years 5 and 6 (with players in near-mutiny and only 1 guy signed for next year).
Only a complete moe-ron wouldn’t fire someone in these circumstances. It’s as obvious as obvious can be.
Miami doesn’t have the same downward trend – and yes, has lower expectations because it’s kind of a crap job. What Larranaga has done there (with next to zero support) is outstanding work.
And OF COURSE he brings up HWSNBN again, conveniently leaving out the fact that he flopped in the desert and was fired soon after Sidney Lowe, having to sit out of coaching at least a full year (maybe two??) before getting a low/mid-major job.
The only thing he gets right is that the last search was a shitshow, and underlines how important it is not to screw up this go-round. We’uns plum out of mulligans.02/17/2017 at 11:03 AM #118132WataugaWolfParticipant
I predict your predictions are correct. A confirmation of the great oracle as it were.
I see this situation in a totally positive light…like the planets beginning to align for us.
We clean house of the Gottfried regime (something that should have been done earlier, but now is better than later)
We bring in (i.e. pay the man!) a star HC named Archie Miller; an alumni who is loved by the fan base; is a great recruiter; and is passionate about his Alma mater and players (i.e. does not insult them…at least publicly),
We give HC significant control of the AD selection process moving beyond 2020,
We maintain the talent level on the team by convincing some to stay or to recruit hard early and fill the gaps
Even if the above doesn’t fall into place exactly, we will now be in a better position next season than we would have with no change.02/17/2017 at 11:07 AM #118134VaWolf82Keymaster
Here’s another article with a few digs, but more balanced overall:
In truth, NC State isn’t a very good job. Sure, there’s a strong history, great facilities and a loyal fan base. But there’s an endless winter in the shadow of Duke and North Carolina. Plus, the Wolfpack also lead the ACC in unrealistic expectations, as Gottfried made four NCAA tournaments in six years and got fired two days after Valentine’s Day. (To be fair, his team played with all the poise and discipline of Marmaduke chasing his tail for most of the season).
The article also has a list of coaches, mostly pulled out of thin air….pretty much like we do here.
The article does a pretty good job of including coaches that might be ready for a change. That supports the approach of hiring a search consultant to make it easy for someone to reach out with little fear of their current school finding out that they are looking.02/17/2017 at 11:13 AM #118135choppack1Participant
I am going to go out on a limb here and guess what caused Yow’s meltdown in the coaching search was the outright hostility from the press specifically reserved for Wolfpack basketball. It’s something she probably didn’t encounter at UMD and something she didn’t and hasn’t encountered in her other searches which of course have been much smoother and effective.
I imagine this time she is prepared…And what could be sweeter than getting an A lister and/or solid second tier candidate and having excellent results.
I think she has been preparing for this for a while and hopefully is mentally prepared for the search.02/17/2017 at 11:34 AM #118136ryebreadParticipant
It’s sad to see the media trolling us, but so be it. I think there’s perception, but then there is also education that needs to happen for a candidate. It’s not miss twice and you are gone. It is predicted start versus where we ended up, which most years was far lower and the last two was flat out awful. Mix in a whole lot of off court issues, and then it becomes pretty clear.02/17/2017 at 11:38 AM #118137BJD95Keymaster
God, that “Blue shadow” thing is SO STUPID. In a sport where 68 teams make the post-season tourney – and you can’t be bracketed against either until the S16, and usually not until the Regional Final…WHO CARES??
It’s an opportunity because you will get exposure for your program because college basketball is #1 here. The most important sport pretty much year-round. Institutional support. A vibrant, growing city environment that’s friendly to young players of all races.
You only find the area’s spotlight a negative if you want to hide away from being evaluated. There are plenty of places to be mediocre in front of 2500 fans per night, who are content with just not being God-awful.
This isn’t one of them. The right coach will understand that. The wrong one would fail anyway.02/17/2017 at 11:51 AM #118138Fastback68Participant
I hope Yow can block out the noise and conduct a methodical search. Incorporate offensive and defensive stats. Chopping wood/Princeton, NBA double screen and UCLA stand around should not count as valid offensive schemes.
I have to give props to VaWolf82 who called out Gott for what he was very early in his tenure. There were others but my memory is lacking. Can’t believe six years have passed.
State poured a lot of money into the current staff. I believe management wants to get it right.02/17/2017 at 12:02 PM #118139AdventurooParticipant
I admit to being OD’ed on Political Events and also having no interest in the “stuff” that the Networks are hawking. SO, I rarely watch any MSM crap.
I do mindlessly (a condition that is getting worse) watch a LOT of ESPN and the like’s basketball. Some of it is for insomnia and others are for entertainment.
I, like you, are constantly amazed at the attendance. If you watched the AZ last night, it was like a Reynolds Ladies game. Same for our “sister” ACC schools. YES, Cameron and the Nose Dome and a few other ACC venues are having good attendance, but if you look at the TOTAL numbers, the PNC (sold, not scanned….but that should change as it did when Gott was winning) is like a shining beacon.
I am optimistic that AD Yow, like most of us (Hopefully) DO learn from our mistakes and will not repeat them again. YES, there is the trolling press. Gottfried has a great personality….if it were little less “Charming”, we might not be having this discussion. He does interview well and appreciates the need for the competitive (Twitter, Social Media, Cable, Network, Internet, talk Radio, ad infinitum…) guys to “get in a comment from him”.
He also seems to have taken the high road….which leads me to believe that we will honor, without exclusion, his contract. Money is STILL a motivator.
I am pulling for Debbie Yow….as I always have. She is a tough cookie and a very professional individual….
We, the WPN need to let bygones be bygones….with regard to her ability and also Gott’s past issues. BOTH need to be focused on their future…..and you are correct, her legacy has two positive and striking accolades….OUR Director’s Cup rating and Reynolds. She is working on a third with the WBB program and getting the MBB program back on track would qualify her for sainthood…
GO PACK….02/17/2017 at 12:31 PM #11814002/17/2017 at 12:39 PM #118141StateRed44Participant
Those dumbarse trolling articles are good for yuk yuks with the blues but won’t scare any potential coaches in the least. Anyone in basketball can clearly see that Gott failed miserably in his job this past season due to gross mismanagement.02/17/2017 at 1:03 PM #118143WolfWiz11Participant
Bobby Lutz on his thoughts about State and the Job.
That’s awesome, can really hear the passion in Lutz’s voice. Definitely agree with him on the qualities a coach needs to win at State. It’s not an undesirable job unless you don’t want to compete. If you want to coach and play with a chip on your shoulder, then this is basketball Mecca.02/17/2017 at 1:06 PM #118144HamletParticipant
Not much Pack stuff in the Lutz interview, but what interested me was his recollection of a conversation he had with Sean Miller some years ago regarding the “difficulty” and challenges of coaching in Raleigh, and he believes the perception is real. The false narrative that has circulated since Sendek’s time…that has been fostered and nurtured by our general ineptness and hiring of substandard coaches, is probably still out there to some extent. It will take a solid hire to once-and-for-all put an end to that BS, a hire that is made more challenging by our past incompetence.02/17/2017 at 1:47 PM #118146StateRed44Participant
Well, Lutz was honest about it but he had relatively decent success at Charlotte, so he thinks it can be done. Just need the right guy, we all know that much.
Pretty good interview, does not poor mouth at all.02/17/2017 at 2:10 PM #118148Whiteshoes67Participant
TOS reporting sources indicate a budget of 3-4 million per year. That’s not upstart money. That’s you-better-win now money.
I think it’s less than 50% he’s interested, but Marshall, who’s a young 53, and hungry, has to get major consideration. I realize Miller is the sentimental pick, and I think he’s a great coach, but…
Being of his generation, I’m afraid his pacing of the sideline might harken up old memories of the great wood chopper, and I’m not sure I can stomach it. It took many years to purge those memories.02/17/2017 at 2:20 PM #118149MrPlywoodParticipant
IMO Parrish et al are just outing themselves as ill-informed, surface-level gadflies. Hell, if they would give xphoenix87’s Defensive Breakdown series a read they might be able to figure out that there are real coaching shortcomings here. That said, you can lead a troll to facts, but you can’t make him think.02/17/2017 at 2:27 PM #118150AdventurooParticipant
Good interview with Bobby Lutz. He is honest and down to earth and truthful. Says a lot about folks. I would concur, based on what has been said, that he was popular with the players as he treated them with respect and also equality.
NOW, on another subject, here is a tidbit from BobLeeSays comment about the “COACHING SEARCH”….
According to my sources there has been a Wendell Murphy sighting in Wilmington with Kevin Keatts (UNC-W coach). Keatts is a Rick Pitno protege. He has done a great job at UNC-W as they lead their conference and should be in the tournament this year. Would be a great catch for State.
From a long time AAU Coach and Contributor.
02/17/2017 at 2:33 PM #118151blpackParticipant
Glad Debbie pulled the trigger. I have no problem with Gottfried finishing out the season. The players should be looser, the staff not as uptight and maybe we will see a better brand of ball. I’m not expecting another win so no need for an interim. Let’s chill for a few weeks while the season plays out and go from there. Ignore the Bilas’s, Goodmans, Doyels Brandos and Parrish’s of the world as well.02/17/2017 at 2:40 PM #118152PackerInRussiaParticipant
Here’s a list of past Xavier coaches: Skip Prosser, Thad Matta, Sean Miller, and Chris Mack (current). Which one has the most wins as head coach at Xavier?
Why don’t we just ask Xavier who they would hire if Chris Mack were gone and then hire that person. They always have a good coach. They’re like the farm team of coaches for major programs.02/17/2017 at 2:41 PM #118153tractor57Participant
Time to move on – either firing now or at the end of the season – I see pros and cons with either. I agree the coming AD change is also a factor but if a good coach is treated well (pay and the other crap from the Admin) that all works. My big concern is the Admin – for decades they have shown little interest in having a quality MBB program. I don’t mean letting a coach run roughshod over the rules I simply mean identifying a reasonable candidate for coach and then supporting that coach. Gott in some ways leaves a program better than he inherited but in other way the opposite. I really enjoyed the Lutz audio – back to his Charlotte days I always thought he was a straight shooter but not vindictive. Our admin could do worse than heed his counsel.02/17/2017 at 3:02 PM #118155TheAliasTrollParticipant
My big concern is the Admin – for decades they have shown little interest in having a quality MBB program.
I think it can’t be denied the current administration wants a quality MBB program far more than any other time in decades. She easily could have rested on Gott’s laurels of 66% NCAA tourney appearances and 33% sweet 16 appearances. But she didn’t. She’s clearly tuned in and understands the direction of the program was headed towards the side of a mountain.02/17/2017 at 3:03 PM #118156GoldenChainParticipant
I hope our young men don’t “lay down” the rest of the season!02/17/2017 at 3:14 PM #118159GowolvesParticipant
So Chop are you saying he could be leaving our program in worse shape than just the roster?
There’s some negative chatter out in the websphere in that regard.
We will probably know in a few weeks if it is anything to be concerned about. Instinctively, I hear this stuff and I get concerned. Again, at this point, I am glad we have a stickler for the rules (by everything I can tell) in Deb Yow…I think she will / has done the needful if there’s needful to be done.
The rumblings aren’t encouraging – but hopefully it’s just dreamcasting by those who would wish ill will upon us and general hysteria.
Chops. Check all timelines, and quit the fretting.
They would have already been here, and gone. You would have known months ago.
Is the program being investigated by the NCAA?
Sage advice Cowdog – saw timelines and charges and had done those deductions….But I would be more worried if we actually had something to lose this year.
I started with the question if we were being investigated based on the comments above on the other thread. Reasonable question given the vague references in the comments.02/17/2017 at 3:14 PM #118160MrPlywoodParticipant
Please, no letters, no updates, no public displays of frustration… just surprise me with a hire as soon as the chosen coach is available.
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