Doeren Doing Things

One of the great mysteries of being a Wolfpacker is wrestling with the struggles that NC State’s football program has had with Wake Forest and Boston College – particularly IN Winston-Salem and Chestnut Hill.

In fact, Saturday’s win at Boston College was the Wolfpack’s first in Chestnut Hill since the Eagles joined the ACC (1-5) and the first at Boston College for NC State since 1937 (2-6).

So, this season has, at the very least, created a little natural order to the universe as I feel it should look!

While we aren’t even finished with his third season as of yet, Coach Doeren is on the way to delivering some nice production that is serving to solidify some solid numbers. A few more examples of Coach Doeren’s production

* Bowl eligible for 2 of the last 3 seasons.

* Tom O’Brien won seven league road games in six seasons; Doeren has already won four road games. In fact, State has won four of his last five ACC road games.

* State’s four total road wins this season are the most since Chuck Amato’s Wolfpack 13 years ago.

*

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This topic contains 69 replies, has 31 voices, and was last updated by  choppack1 3 years, 10 months ago.

Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 70 total)
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  • #91860

    StateFans
    Keymaster

    One of the great mysteries of being a Wolfpacker is wrestling with the struggles that NC State’s football program has had with Wake Forest and Boston
    [See the full post at: Doeren Doing Things]

    #91861

    Wufpacker
    Participant

    Gonna get a fifth this weekend.

    #91862

    TheCOWDOG
    Moderator

    Wuf, that’s a capital idea. While you’re there, would you check for a good Irish Whiskey sale?

    #91863

    Wufpacker
    Participant

    Dammit…you ruined my slow burn. Was waiting for folks to call me an idiot.

    Still, I do think we got a shot.

    Besides, I’ll be loading up with the 1.75L anywhoo.

    #91864

    ruffles31
    Keymaster

    I said before the season that we could be a lot better than we were last year and have the same record. Let’s hope that they win at least 2 of the last 3 to prove me wrong.

    Doeren has knocked down some depressing stats well.

    Win at Wake – check
    Win at BC – check

    Now, there are a few other items he needs to work on, which is happening.

    What did Bobby Bowden always say?

    First, you lose big.
    Then, you lose small.
    Next, you win small.
    Finally, you win big.

    Doeren is starting to move down the list there. I like the progress. Rome wasn’t built in a day. It may take a few more years, but I see the improvement happening.

    #91865

    Fastback68
    Participant

    Captain Obvious, winning the next 3 or 2/3 with a win over a quality bowl opponent will keep the majority of the fringe at bay but not everyone. Right here, right now, expect this “progress” topic to be ripped based on the list of the 6 teams conquered. Bowl eligible title needs a few more victory prongs.

    #91867

    ryebread
    Participant

    What did Bobby Bowden always say?

    First, you lose big.
    Then, you lose small.
    Next, you win small.
    Finally, you win big.

    Kind of how I see it as well. Amato was great at skipping the lose big phase, starting with the lose small and then going with the win small. He could never take it to the “win big” phase.

    TOB got blown out a lot. That was the thing that most bothered me about him. We lost more games in about a year by double digits than Amato lost his entire tenure. It wasn’t just that we lost, it was often how we lost.

    I have always thought really good teams took care of business on the road. They came into your house and take it from you. It’s easier at home because of the home fans.

    It’s part of why we were never going to break through with HWSNBN at basketball. Even when we had a good record, we were kind of a paper tiger. We were good at home, but we never won on the road, and more often than not would lose to any semi-good team on a neutral floor.

    I like that we’re winning on the road. WF and BC were huge steps. If we could win at FSU, it would be huge.

    #91868

    VaWolf82
    Keymaster

    I’m sorry, but wins over BC (3-7), WF (3-6), Troy, S. Alabama, ODU, and E. Kentucky don’t show me anything. I’m not screaming for anyone’s head, but you have to beat someone before I start pointing at “progress”.

    A comparison to Herb’s teams/records is right on point. He could wipe up the bottom of the conference, hold his own against the rest of the muddled middle, but had damned few wins against the top of the conference.

    In the end, good teams prove that they are good by beating other good teams. State hasn’t accomplished that yet.

    #91869

    wolf71
    Participant

    VAWolf82 well said! Could not agree more.

    #91870

    BullPack
    Participant

    Beating all six of the teams that we should beat IS progress.

    #91875

    Wulfpack
    Participant

    Only one of the teams we have beat has a win over a Power 5 school (Wake over BC, 3-0).

    It is still too early for me to judge this team. The Va Tech and Lville losses, though expected, were a bit disappointing. 4 easy wins over cupcakes, ok. Clemson did what they did. We fought hard but that should be a given. We’re kind of holding serve IMHO.

    #91876

    choppack1
    Participant

    Agreed wufpack – we what the bed vs. The ‘ville and Vatech… We take 1 of 2 and we’ve got a different perspective. However, I think we can get at least 1 back we can be making solid, undeniable progress.

    #91877

    1.21 Jigawatts
    Keymaster

    I’m sorry, but wins over BC (3-7), WF (3-6), Troy, S. Alabama, ODU, and E. Kentucky don’t show me anything. I’m not screaming for anyone’s head, but you have to beat someone before I start pointing at “progress”.

    A comparison to Herb’s teams/records is right on point. He could wipe up the bottom of the conference, hold his own against the rest of the muddled middle, but had damned few wins against the top of the conference.

    In the end, good teams prove that they are good by beating other good teams. State hasn’t accomplished that yet.

    ^This 1000x.

    #91878

    13OT
    Participant

    HWSNBN’s similarity to our current football program is that yes, he could wipe up the bottom of the conference, but only if the Pack was playing at home. I honestly don’t remember HWSNBN’s teams ever winning a significant road game, at least not in the ACC, except when they won at Chapel Hill when Matt Doherty was coach. EVERYBODY, except Clemson, was beating the 8-20 Heels in Chapel Hill and just about everywhere else that season, though.

    At least football has now won two road games this season. Granted, the Wake and BC teams this season are among the worst ACC teams in memory, but Doeren got 2 Ws ON THE ROAD. Give him that.

    But with this team, one that I doubt would have had much if any more success with Holtz or Sheridan, the timing isn’t good. Doak Campbell on Homecoming against an angry FSU team, followed by a classic trap game vs an underrated Syracuse team, and a home finale vs UNC with the students home on Thanksgiving break may not set this team up to finish well.

    Whoever’s responsible for State-UNC on Thanksgiving weekend should have their asses kicked until their noses bleed.

    #91880

    TheCOWDOG
    Moderator

    So ya piss and moan about Winston-Salem. Ya piss and moan about Chestnut Hill.

    Ya piss and moan, piss and moan. Piss and moan.

    35-7

    #91881

    TheCOWDOG
    Moderator

    When and if they meet the wildest of expectations…

    Half of ya will have missed it.

    #91882

    tjfoose1
    Participant

    ..and then they’d complain it took too long and wasn’t loud enough.

    Reminds me of the Geico commercials. That’s what they do, CD.

    They would’ve fired Dabo years ago.

    #91883

    redisgood
    Participant

    Here is the difference to me – in the past we would play WF or BC and I wasn’t sure if we would win or lose, even in Raleigh. This year there was no doubt in my mind we would win those games. We competed and could have won any of the three games we lost. I see a lot more talent on the field on both sides of the ball. I’m seeing real progress in the caliber of play. Still lots of holes to be sure, but DD’s recruiting is gradually filling them in. Yes, I think we will get our butts kicked on Saturday, but that won’t diminish the confidence I have in the head coach going forward. I’m truly excited about where this program is headed.

    #91886

    TeufelWolf
    Participant

    BullPack, COWDOG, and tjfoose said it perfectly. I don’t understand the complaining about winning on the road against teams we have been losing to in recent history. It reminds me of The Rock (movie) when Nick Cage asks Sean Connery to do something about the dead guy’s leg twitching. Connery comes back, “what do you want me to do, kill him again?” Jeezus, people Wake and BC is that dead body, what more do you want from this team?

    #91889

    VaWolf82
    Keymaster

    Strange, but I didn’t see anyone complain about winning.

    #91890

    BJD95
    Keymaster

    Remember, this is YEAR THREE of an absolute gut job of a rebuild. You have absolutely no standing to bitch about the quality of conference road wins. A lesser coach wouldn’t be getting them.

    Football doesn’t get turned around on a dime, not unless one is left a heap of unmotivated talent. That was most assuredly NOT the case in West Raleigh.

    #91891

    tractor57
    Participant

    Anyone who cannot see progress is either blind or willfully ignoring. I get that for some the progress is not quick enough but even so there has been progress.

    #91893

    choppack1
    Participant

    Progress is being made I agree.
    However, context is very important and a couple of things need to be considered. While it is great to beat BC and Wake at their place – these 2 teams are a combined 1-12 this year.

    From a historical perspective – this is the worst BOTH of these teams have been since BC came in the conference – and it’s not even close. The previous years we played at Wake and BC (from 03 with wake and from 05 with BC to 2011) – their combined record during those years was 42-38 – which is very respectable. Now, in 2013 (dd’s 1st year) they were a combined 6-10 in conference play. This was the worst record of these 2 teams before this year. Basically, it’s the equivalent of sendek sweeping the tar heel teams that missed the tournament.

    Regarding Dabo – he went 6-2 (which tied Tommy Bowden’s best) his first full year and won the Atlantic division (Tommy never did that) He slipped his second full year, but went 6-2 again and won the division again the next year…so it’s not really fair to compare him with DD…two totally different situations and go figure, totally different results.

    #91894

    blpack
    Participant

    Moving forward, 3 big tests remain. This Saturday will not be easy. Hopefully FSU will be hung over after the Clemson game.

    #91895

    travelwolf
    Participant

    I’m convinced that it’s a personality type that fails to see progress. Just like it’s a personality type that believes in conspiracies (it’s proven – Google it) – I know this because my brother is this type.

    I just want to see progress year by year, and we are seeing that in abundance. Given that the team is so young, it’s progress just beating those whom we should beat – as this hasn’t been the case since Sheridan was coach. Don’t forget… we’ve also lost 2 all-conference running backs.

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