SEC Votes AGAINST Expansion (8pm Update)

ACC & Other31

Dennis Dodd offers up a little insight into what happened (CBSSports.com):

Note to Aggies everywhere: Before you borrow daddy’s Caddy and rent a tux, make sure you have a prom date.

It always seemed strange that A&M was fast-tracking this thing. In the end, SEC presidents didn’t want to be rushed. Why should they? With or without the Aggies, the SEC is still making $3 billion in a 20-year media rights deal finalized a couple of years ago.

The SEC is basically telling A&M: Get your house in order and then we’ll talk. There is an A&M regents conference call on Monday. A Texas state representative wants to hear testimony to a Higher Education committee on Tuesday.

In the end, those SEC presidents couldn’t find a 14th school to go along with A&M or didn’t want to risk a legal challenge from the Big 12 (by potentially breaking up the league). Possibly both.

Our Brett McMurphy reported that SEC presidents have a “gentleman’s agreement” not to expand within the league’s footprint. That would eliminate Clemson and Florida State.

ESPN probably has a lot to do with it too. The key to the deal is how the Worldwide Leader can maximize A&M, Oklahoma and Texas with conference realignment looming. A&M must extricate itself from the Big 12 so it doesn’t look like the SEC is interfering. OU must decide between the Big 12, Pac-12 and SEC. Texas has to be in a place where its increasingly burdensome and controversial network is the most profitable.

*****

4pm Update:
Well, all this discussion the past few days, while fun, has proved to be moot (at least for now). Most of the major news outlets are reporting that the SEC presidents voted against expanding right now, or at least against adding Texas A&M:

Statement from Dr. Bernie Machen, Chair, Southeastern Conference Presidents and Chancellors:

“The SEC Presidents and Chancellors met today and reaffirmed our satisfaction with the present 12 institutional alignment. We recognize, however, that future conditions may make it advantageous to expand the number of institutions in the league. We discussed criteria and process associated with expansion. No action was taken with respect to any institution including Texas A&M.”

However, it looks like the SEC hasn’t closed the door on either future expansion or Texas A&M (ESPN.com):

“We recognize, however, that future conditions may make it advantageous to expand the number of institutions in the league,” Machen said. “We discussed criteria and process associated with expansion. No action was taken with respect to any institution including Texas A&M.”

We know that Texas A&M initiated this, not the SEC, which seemed content remaining at 12 (at least for now). It seems plausible that Texas A&M has decided to secede, and offered the SEC first right of refusal; in all fairness, the SEC had to at least consider it. However, what Texas A&M might have done in the process is severely misplay its hand.

Most of us will be suprised if this is the end of it, and it’ll be interesting to see if there were other factors at play. Maybe this wasn’t in the timeframe the SEC preferred, or maybe the SEC wants to secure a 14th member before admitting Texas A&M. Perhaps, from a TV revenue standpoint, it would’ve taken Texas A&M with Missouri, but that after Missouri committed to the Big XII, then Texas A&M with Florida State and/or Clemson couldn’t get it done. Could Texas A&M and, say, NC State (adding two new markets), get it done?

Simply: who knows? We’ll learn more about this over the coming days, so stay tuned.

*****

Start your morning with 1.21 Jigawatts’ “Sunday Samplings.”

Nothing much new expansion-wise Sunday morning morning, just speculation. Texas A&M is still expected to join the SEC, possibly as early as tomorrow (Houston Chronicle). However, at least one source suggests they may not get enough votes from the SEC presidents to do so (ESPN.com):

All but one of the SEC’s school presidents will meet Sunday to discuss A&M’s admission to the league, The New York Times has reported, citing a high-ranking conference official with first-hand knowledge of the talks.

The SEC official said there was still a 30 percent to 40 percent chance the Aggies would not get enough votes for an invitation to the league, The Times reported. And the issue of needing to add a 14th team along with A&M remained, the newspaper reported.

“We realize if we do this, we have to have the 14th,” the SEC official said. “No name has been thrown out. This thing is much slower out of the chute than the media and blogs have made it.”

There is speculation that the Big XII is already working on a contingency plan to keep the conference solvent after Texas A&M leaves. Missouri has said it’s committed to the Big XII, and it seems the Big XII may look to remain a 10-team league, at least in the immediate future. Possible replacements for Texas A&M appear to be Air Force, Houston, Louisville, or maybe even TCU.

Now, here are a couple comments that concisely explain why this is happening.

Associated Press (WRAL.com):

The SEC is interested in A&M because the move “brings us into the Texas market,” another person familiar with the situation told the AP on Saturday. But the person added that “it’s not about us wanting or needing 14 teams, Texas A&M came to us.”

The person said the conference could not ignore the Aggies.

“If A&M is dead set on getting away from Texas, whether it be because of the Longhorn Network or if they have had enough for whatever reason, you have to listen,” the person said. “If you don’t, someone else will.”

“It’s a business decision.”

Pat Forde (ESPN.com):

But as we wait for all this to play out (or not play out), the bigger picture of where college athletics stands has been shaken into focus.

Presidents can talk all they want about academic initiatives and student-athlete welfare, but it’s proving to be a sideshow conducted while the real business is done in back rooms. Television dollars and rampant egos are running the show in college sports, no matter how much the academic side of campus aspires to exert control.

As you discuss this, keep in mind that expansion isn’t related in any way to basketball prowess or “best fit.” College basketball revenue pales in comparison, and that’s not going to change; all that matters is college football TV revenues — simply, it’s a business decision.

With this in mind, be pragmatic: if the ACC really wants to enhance it TV footprint, it shouldn’t look solely to raid the Big East again. Instead, it should start by looking west to Oklahoma and TCU (before they officially make the move to the Big East in 2012). Everyone else wants that Texas footprint (which each of those delivers), so go get it. Geography, cultures and traditions don’t matter anymore, only TV, so make the right moves to have a seat at the college football decision-makers table. Syracuse and West Virginia don’t get that done (not for the ACC, anyway).

But that’s just my opinion. Go on over to the SFN Forums and join the discussion and make your opinion known.

If you’re trying to catch up, make sure you peruse the SFN main page here, here and here; if you’re one of the younger among us, you may not know that expansion isn’t a recent idea, and you can read a little about it here.

About LRM

Charter member of the Lunatic Fringe and a fan, loyal to a fault.

ACC & Other

31 Responses to SEC Votes AGAINST Expansion (8pm Update)

  1. packalum44 08/14/2011 at 11:31 AM #

    I wonder what the revenue numbers are for football compared to basketball. Some schools (e.g. UNC, Syracuse) bring in more for basketball than football. With a 20k person arena and lots more home games, there are a few schools (ahum) that could bring in decent revenue from basketball.

    Not disagreeing that f-ball is king but I’d like to see the numbers.

    Easily the most interesting quote:

    But the person added that “it’s not about us wanting or needing 14 teams, Texas A&M came to us.”

    The person said the conference could not ignore the Aggies.

    “If A&M is dead set on getting away from Texas, whether it be because of the Longhorn Network or if they have had enough for whatever reason, you have to listen,” the person said. “If you don’t, someone else will.”

    “It’s a business decision.”

    Now NC is no Texas, but its the most populous southern state outside Texas in which the SEC has no footprint. Just saying…Woodson/Yow get on the horn! Can’t hurt.

  2. packplantpath 08/14/2011 at 11:38 AM #

    With conference revenue sharing, I’d bet that even UNC gets more money from football operations than basketball.

    I may be wrong though. I too would love to see the numbers.

  3. Packfan28 08/14/2011 at 12:11 PM #

    Top revenue bball schools: Duke $27M, Louisville $26M, Carolina $21M. State #25 at $10M.

    Football revenue: Penn St $70M, Ohio State $63M, the average SEC revenue is $50M.

    Football is definitely king.

  4. LRM 08/14/2011 at 12:14 PM #

    “I wonder what the revenue numbers are for football compared to basketball. Some schools (e.g. UNC, Syracuse) bring in more for basketball than football. With a 20k person arena and lots more home games, there are a few schools (ahum) that could bring in decent revenue from basketball.”

    Schools don’t even cover their operating expenses from ticket sales. They make their money from TV revenue, more specifically, college football and BCS TV deals. I’ll have to track down the sourcing, but I recall seeing where Sports Business Daily had ACC revenues for 2009 at around 30% football TV, 20% BCS and 30% basketball TV. So football is at least around 50% of the ACC revenue, and it’s far more than that for others (SEC, Pac-12, Big Ten). The ACCT and NCAAT combined is something around 10%.

    The money is overwhelmingly football-related.

  5. packalum44 08/14/2011 at 12:21 PM #

    http://www.newsobserver.com/2011/08/14/1411778/acc-shake-up-unlikely.html

    If you want to kill brain cells Ken’s article can help. If Ken wanted to write a good opinion piece he should have made the case that State should go after the SEC’s 14 spot. The more things play out the more I feel that State would be considered if we asked nicely. There are similarities between us and the Aggies and business sense to open up a new market.

    “As for the idea that the North Carolina schools might leave, you can forget it. UNC’s rivalry with Duke in basketball is far too important for the Tar Heels to leave for the SEC. (The SEC would not be interested in Duke as a package deal).”

    ^ I actually agree with that.

    “N.C. State’s culture and tradition as the first home of the ACC tournament, and rivalries with UNC, Duke and Wake Forest would make it difficult to leave.”

    ^ This is where Ken’s attempt at critical thinking breaks down. State has taken a backseat to the Duke/UNC rivalry. We don’t have any allegiance to playing in the same conference – that’s beyond absurd. If UNC has the nads we’d still play them in football during rivalry week…oh wait they aren’t our rival. NC is the only southern state not in the SEC.

  6. IamGumbyDammit 08/14/2011 at 12:26 PM #

    NC’s not the only southern state not in the SEC – you left out Virginia…

  7. Packfan28 08/14/2011 at 12:52 PM #

    Here is a great article on the 50 most profitable football and basketball programs. It shows revenue, expenses, and profit. Again, football is way ahead. Texas football $69M profit!!! You need to go down to #21 to find a basketball school. Louisville at $17M. Duke and Carolina basketball are 29 and 31 respectively. NCSU football is #36.

    http://businessofcollegesports.com/2011/06/20/which-football-and-basketball-programs-produce-the-largest-profits/

  8. packalum44 08/14/2011 at 2:50 PM #

    Sorry breadsticks but VA ain’t southern. At least not NoVA. When you can’t order sweet tea at restaurants you give up the right to be called southern. When half your state is southern, that means you ain’t southern. Kind of like Russia having partial democracy. You’re either a democracy or you’re not.

    Signed,

    Someone who used to live in VA and thinks it sucks.

  9. JEOH2 08/14/2011 at 3:41 PM #

    what a fun little distraction…like I said in another thread…Cuban Missile Crisis…

    http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/6861385/sec-extend-invitation-texas-leaves-options-open

    Clarification: Did they actually vote? Or did they just “reaffirm” their commitment?

  10. primacyone 08/14/2011 at 3:45 PM #

    Tex A&M to the ACC?

  11. mook21 08/14/2011 at 3:53 PM #

    Packalum44, being a native on NC, NCSU graduate and now a resident of the northern Shenandoah valley in Virgina (yes, northern Virginia, what are you smoking??? Virginia not southern? Where was the capital of the CSA? Where are more Civil War battlefields than anywhere else in the country? Where is the home of Lee & Jackson (before WV succession from Va)? Virginia not southern is crazy. No offense intended, just a perspective and question. And yes, I can get sweet tea 15 minutes from the border with WV on interstate 81 and still be in Pa in 45 minutes across the Mason Dixon line 🙂 I even found a store that is now carrying Cheerwine! No Livermush or Sundrop yet though.

  12. FluffyMcNutter 08/14/2011 at 4:20 PM #

    I don’t think this means A&M won’t be in the SEC next year. I think this means the SEC wants to find their 14th member before offering A&M.

  13. sequoyah 08/14/2011 at 4:23 PM #

    Packfan28 – there are some head-scratchers on that website — they say FSU’s football revenue only exceeds Duke, MD, & Wake in the ACC! And that’s revenue, not ‘profit’. It wouldn’t be hard to believe that FSU makes more in one or two games than Duke makes all year.

    scroll down to the bottom of:
    http://businessofcollegesports.com/category/conference-finance-series/

  14. LRM 08/14/2011 at 4:34 PM #

    “I don’t think this means A&M won’t be in the SEC next year. I think this means the SEC wants to find their 14th member before offering A&M.”

    I agree completely. I think this moved on a quicker timeframe than the SEC probably preferred.

  15. Packfan28 08/14/2011 at 4:50 PM #

    sequoyah, here is from an FSU site:

    Football Revenue
    Virginia Tech $31,155,870.00
    Clemson Univ. $30,994,503.00
    Georgia Tech $24,870,064.00
    Univ. of Miami $24,631,029.00
    North Carolina $22,077,550.00
    NC State $22,018,738.00
    Boston College $19,184,902.00
    Univ. of Virginia $19,004,653.00
    Florida State $18,958,861.00
    Duke Univ. $16,109,324.00
    Maryland $11,540,368.00
    Wake Forest $10,227,922.00

    http://www.tomahawknation.com/2011/2/25/2015123/acc-football-not-cash-cow-like-sec-and-big-ten

  16. choppack1 08/14/2011 at 5:09 PM #

    Hey – we’re third most profitable program in ACC football…not bad. Packfan 28 – great info – thanks for linking.

    Does anyone else here wonder if the NCAA begged the SEC to back off for a bit? This could set into motion a series of dominoes that effectively ended college athletics as we know it.

  17. JEOH2 08/14/2011 at 5:22 PM #

    https://twitter.com/#!/McMurphyCBS/status/102842485038006272

    so its all about the 14th team…and UK, UF, USC, and UGA appear to have chosen to block any member from the same state…which means who is left for 14? If Mizzou were really a possibility as stated before, this would already be happening…

    To me, this implies one of two things: 1) the SEC does not want whomever may be left on the table at this current juncture or 2) the other schools left on the table have already implied that, no, they wouldn’t be interested in jumping (ex: Vtech has pretty much ruled out moving)

  18. waxhaw 08/14/2011 at 6:04 PM #

    I wonder if those revenue figures are accurate. The ACC shares revenue equally. Bowl revenue is split after expenses (virtually none). Ticket sales obvviously would differentiate some.

  19. Plz2BStateFan 08/14/2011 at 6:19 PM #

    nuts I say, nuts.

    One cant undervalue the fear of going to such a large conference. You will essentially create 2 mini conferences tied together because they play each other a little. One team from one division wouldnt play certain teams in the other division but once in ~5-8 years depending on how its setup

  20. Kingfish1976 08/14/2011 at 6:22 PM #

    The SEC made that statement for legal reasons. As soon as Texas A&M officially leaves the Big 12, the dominoes will start falling.

  21. Ashman87 08/14/2011 at 6:49 PM #

    This is probably the best, because at least all chaos is pushed back at least a couple months.

  22. tobaccordshow 08/14/2011 at 7:31 PM #

    If I’m Swofford (and thank God I’m not), then I immediately extend an invite to A&M.

  23. Plz2BStateFan 08/14/2011 at 7:33 PM #

    The ACC needs time to make a better name for itself in football. Hopefully that will happen

  24. 61Packer 08/14/2011 at 9:01 PM #

    So football revenue is almost 3 times that of basketball, but doesn’t football cost a lot more than basketball? Does football revenue offset the difference in cost between the two sports? You need about ten times the players for football, and facilities are more expensive.

    Not sayin’ that football isn’t the big money maker, but the ACC needs to get a grip on reality and stick with who they originally brought to the dance- basketball. This league has never been very good in football; Florida State is the team that gave the league national prominence, but the cost was a total beatdown of the entire league by the Seminoles until a few years ago. We’ve lost our way when we declare a 6-6 football finish to be successful.

    Expansion hurt the ACCs overall image nationally because of the FSU dominance, and now VT is doing the same thing. Basically everyone outside of those two and maybe Clemson starts the season at 0-1 or 0-2 if they have to play both FSU and VT.

    Expansion did more than just hurt our image in basketball. And now we want MORE teams in the league? We need to jettison 4 of them instead of adding new ones. Whoever said that FSU isn’t in the SEC footprint confuses me here; Tallahassee is geographically in the heart of SEC country. Get ’em outta here, and if we can’t send 3 more with ’em, bring in West Virginia in their place.

  25. highstick 08/14/2011 at 10:01 PM #

    Hloy crap, Virginia is not southern? Robert E. Lee just rolled over in his grave as well as several thousand Confederate troops buried in Gettysburg…

    And Stonewall Jackson just said “WTF”???

    I can remember when I moved from NC to Beaufort, SC in 1978 and one of my co-workers tried to tell me that the Mason-Dixon line was somewhere very close to the Cooper River!

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