Will it be Rick Barnes this time around?

 

Despite the warning by BJD95 in his “Tin Foil Hat” theory, and despite the fact that every indication suggests the wholly competent Debbie Yow is keeping the usual insiders out of the loop this time around, Saturday’s rumor mill is churning: SFN community member, ‘Strutter’ posted on the forums today that an offer has been made to Texas’ Rick Barnes.

Maybe it’s a smokescreen and there’s no merit to it whatsoever (which is what I happen to believe), but as a charter member of the Lunatic Fringe, I don’t see any harm in getting excited talking about our next coach, especially if it could be Rick Barnes.

The case for Barnes isn’t necessarily quantitative, and it may seem quite mysterious — at the very least, strange — that such a resounding folklore surrounds a guy that didn’t go to State, has never coached at State, and has, at best, only loose connections to State.

As a pragmatist, it bothers me that the numbers –- through today he has a career record of 524-256 (.672) and he’s coaching in his 16th consecutive NCAA Tournament and the 19th of his 23 years as a head coach –- are peripheral to the idea of Rick Barnes at N.C. State.

Our fascination with Barnes –- mine, anyway –- stretches back to his first season at Clemson, when he took over a program in shambles and immediately challenged the conference’s long-established paradigm. Duke and Carolina might always reign as the ACC’s elite and most-favored, but during his four seasons in the league, Barnes promoted aggressiveness over finesse with the explicit intent of making it hard on them both every time they played Clemson. This endeared him to State fans, so when he went to Texas in 1998, many of us expected his time in Austin would be short and that he’d be back in the ACC –-in Raleigh -– after the 2001 season. But those were the early days of Lee Fowler’s burgeoning ineptitude, so we waited for our next opportunity, which came during the rollercoaster, tail-number-tracking days of early April 2006. But, by then, Fowler’s utter incompetence reigned supreme, and Barnes remained at Texas.

Yet, somehow, the idea never died, which doesn’t really add up. Besides being a Hickory native, Barnes’ only solid connection to State is that he was an assistant at Davidson under former State star Eddie Biedenbach. So, yeah, it seems downright arrogant for the fans of this once proud, storied program to have built such folklore on the premise that being Head Basketball Coach at North Carolina State University has always been Barnes’ dream job.

Still, many of us know that we were thisclose in 2006, and appreciate that the main roadblock then won’t be a factor in 2011. But five long years have passed, and it’s entirely plausible that Barnes has no interest this time around; and even if he does, it’s not a done deal.

Considering Barnes is currently one of college basketball’s highest-paid coaches, with an annual salary of $2 million, and knowing it’s likely that Texas, with its rich coffers, would make a counteroffer to keep him, it could require a deal that exceeds our financial capabilities. However, according to the El Paso Times, Barnes doesn’t have a buyout penalty clause in his contract (link). Now, it would be purely speculative to suggest this was intentional during his re-negotiations in April 2006, but it does seem awfully convenient that the he left the door open for when new management took over at State. See what I did there?

Moreover, it’s not unreasonable to expect that, at 56 years old and nearing the end of his 23rd season, Barnes may no longer have the passion, or the energy, to rebuild a struggling program where the fan base expects, at the very least, to perennially make the NCAA Tournament and challenge for the ACC title. Barnes hinted as much in April 2007, when his name was mentioned for the Kentucky job, just one year after turning down State. John Feinstein wrote in the Washington Post (link):

“I think I have one of the five best jobs in the country,” Barnes said last week. “We can recruit in Texas and we can recruit nationally. We’re good enough to contend nationally. And if we lose in the second round of the tournament…the whole state isn’t crying for my head.”

That’s because they’re already focused on spring football.

Now, maybe you see a guy that’s become content, settled into his comfort zone, but all I heard was that Texas Basketball is all hat and no cattle. It’s arguable that taking over State towards the end of his career would be different than others because the infrastructure for success is already in place — rejuvenating even, perhaps.

Maybe the Texas job has become stale to Barnes? Just recently, as reported by the NY Times (link):

With his squad in a late-season tailspin, questions about Barnes’s shaky history of coaching in the N.C.A.A. tournament are being revived.

“I would have cared 10 years ago,” he said of critics questioning his 19-18 N.C.A.A. tournament record. “This is not the most important thing in my life. It’s what I do, but it’s not the most important thing in my life.”

By no means would Barnes avoid this type of criticism on Tobacco Road, but it’s not unreasonable to see in his comments a successful coach that may no longer feel appreciated.

“I don’t care,” Barnes said late Tuesday of the criticism. “I’ve been in this so long, I could care less about what other people think. I quit a long time ago worrying about that.”

So maybe he wasn’t interested in Kentucky in 2007 because he still has sights on finishing his career where he always wanted to be: in his home state? Barnes has made comments over the years that suggest his fondness for coaching in the ACC, particularly on Tobacco Road. Before the 2009 NCAA Tournament Duke-Texas second round game in Greensboro, Ed Hardin of the Greensboro News & Record wrote the following (link):

Rick Barnes of Texas has watched it from various angles through the years, from his younger days in Hickory to his coaching days at Clemson and now with Texas. And if not for twists of fate here and there, Barnes might still be here. Unlike many coaches across the country who have, shall we say, mixed emotions about Tobacco Road basketball, Barnes has always looked at it with wonder.

His goal was to coach in the ACC, and probably one of the North Carolina schools, though he’s never quite said that.

“Obviously, where I grew up, that was my goal, to coach in the ACC,” he said Friday on the eve of the second-round game between Texas and Duke.

Now, it’s easy to read as much or as little into that comment as you’d like, but knowing his volatile history with both Duke and Carolina, it’s certainly plausible to believe that desire was limited — at least after his stint at Clemson — to either State or Wake. And with the right offer he likely could have gone to Wake Forest last spring, so it’s no stretch then to suggest he has probably long-considered the State job enticing. Hardin continues:

How his career path took him to Texas and not to Durham or Raleigh or Winston-Salem is a long story, but he’s destined to slip in and out of the state’s basketball lore until he retires.

That’s the appeal of basketball in North Carolina, something that becomes larger than life to some, requiring life-long allegiances and grudges that never go away.

For State fans, the idea of Rick Barnes itself has become “larger than life.” But it’s simply our response to all those folks –- [cough] Brando, Gminski, Patrick, Katz, Davis, Parrish [cough] -– who think we should just accept our rightful place in Tobacco Road’s hierarchy and leave those “occassional” Glory Days in the past, where they belong. Moreover, the idea itself is transcendent of our collective personality: Barnes wouldn’t back down to the ACC Royalty while at Clemson, so there’s no reason to suggest he would do so at lowly N.C. State.

Look, we can all agree that while he isn’t the best coach in the nation –- he’s certainly Top 10 of all active coaches –- he’s a proven winner, and he’s one of only a few coaches that can say yes and bring not only instant credibility to the program, but more importantly, immediately inspire and unify this weary fan base.

Why shouldn’t we have the same expectations as Duke and Carolina — or for that matter, Kentucky or UCLA or Michigan State? Just because we’ve suffered national irrelevance for two decades doesn’t mean we have to like it. That’s the attitude we project by going after Rick Barnes again. Maybe we missed our opportunity in 2006; maybe this job has never been anything more than our dream for him and he’s not interested this time around, either. That’s fine; I trust Debbie Yow has the search under control, and we’ll never hear much about it if so.

But what do we lose by going after one of the best?

The popular — albeit tired and ignorant — myth is that no one reputable will want the State job. But intelligent folks with an appreciation for not only ACC but college basketball history (like Al Featherston), and especially those of us that don’t need the NC in front of State, know that dog won’t hunt. We know this is a great job with all the resources — facilities, fan base support, TV exposure — to succeed. And surely Barnes knows that hanging that first banner in almost two-and-a-half decades would secure his place as the next N.C. State legend.

And then, who knows, in a few years turn it over to someone like, say, Sean Miller.

Remember that this coaching search, the NCAA Tournament, and other issues are being discussed on the SFN Forums.

About LRM

Charter member of the Lunatic Fringe and a fan, loyal to a fault.

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142 Responses to Will it be Rick Barnes this time around?

  1. ADVENTUROO 03/19/2011 at 9:42 PM #

    StateFans,

    Each of us have an opinion….and until the hand is played, all are equal. Dr. Yow, if you recall, made a comment about a “west coast coach” that most folks felt was directed at Mark Few. So, we will see.

    The interesting thing is that a certain coach was hired in 1980 and he had just turned 34…the same age as Brad Stevens. Now wouldn’t THAT be ironic.

    For some interesting reading, which all can do and then “discuss” into the wee hours or until the beer runs out….you might want to chomp down on this….

    http://acc.blogs.starnewsonline.com/21799/now-that-lowe-is-gone-whos-got-next-at-n-c-state/?pa=3&tc=pg

    Very easy reading and has some valid points.

  2. haze 03/19/2011 at 9:43 PM #

    To be honest, it’s just impossible not to LOVE Brad Stevens… that guy has Wooden like calm and his teams flat out work & work & work & never quit.

    Our guy, probably not… but he’s simply too good to be true.

  3. triadwolf 03/19/2011 at 9:44 PM #

    As impressive as the Zags looked Thursday, they certainly laid an egg today. I don’t think Few is leaving the NW anyway, maybe never leaving Gonzaga.

  4. LakistaMcCuller 03/19/2011 at 9:45 PM #

    Anyone just see the replay from the Butler locker room after the game? he ain’t going anywhere…

  5. LakistaMcCuller 03/19/2011 at 9:47 PM #

    Anyone just see the replay from the Butler locker room after the game? he ain’t going anywhere…

    As for Few – Agreed, he is not leaving, certainly not for NC. He’s had chances to leave for West coast schools before. Some coaches are happy where they are, which is how it should be.

  6. ncsukyle 03/19/2011 at 9:49 PM #

    Not only did that Butler win elevate Stevens’ status but lowered Jamie Dixon’s too (IMHO.) A lesser talented Butler team, that isn’t from the basketball juggernaut the Big East, made a Dixon coached Pitt team look silly. That last Pitt possession before the fouling started, they couldn’t even get a shot off. I hope Dr. Yow has better sense than looking to the Big East for our new coach. Sorry to those who like Dixon…

  7. triadwolf 03/19/2011 at 9:57 PM #

    It’s kind of a double edged sword. If a coach goes deep into the tourney, the emotion of the accomplishment can really make tough for him to leave. On the other hand, if a coach has an early, unexpected exit he is not as highly regarded by us.

  8. Old MacDonald 03/19/2011 at 10:01 PM #

    Roo: I am not sure that “most” thought the “west coast” comment was about Few. I know I didn’t. Could be a lot of people. Few’s background (lifelong Northwesterner who recently turned down his alma mater Oregon) makes him very unlikely IMO. Also, Yow mentioned East coast recruiting, which Few has literally done none of.

  9. drgreenhouse 03/19/2011 at 10:05 PM #

    As long as Brad Stevens stays at Butler; he is the big fish – If Butler keeps progressing year-by-year, then they will either go to a stronger league or they will continue to play a strong out-of-conference schedule. He is the real deal and would be an outstanding hire.

    As for Rick Barnes being leaked; is it possible that his name is the smoke screen?

  10. Tampa-Pack 03/19/2011 at 10:09 PM #

    Maybe “west coast” was Florida’s west coast. Gainesville could be considered as Florida’s west coast. I still don’t think its Donovan, but would be very happy if it was…

  11. Hamlet 03/19/2011 at 10:11 PM #

    Okay, since the rumors have begun to enter the “public” arena, I’ll offer what I have heard.

    Earlier in the week (Tuesday?), our interest was communicated to Barnes. It was very respectful, with the understanding that he had a job to do and nothing was to become an issue/distraction. Yow did not convey this directly to Barnes (third party). I do know that she LOVES Barnes and thinks he is the ideal candidate for the job. She is also not oblivious of the fans’ desires to have Barnes on the sidelines, but her interest goes well beyond that. She knows that this hire needs immediate acceptance from the Pack faithful, and she is fully aware of the need to get us back into the national spotlight (Thank God).

    In addition, I was told if anything becomes public then it is only because the deal is done (of course, the deal could already be done…not completely sure on that). To my knowledge, Barnes is receptive and interested, but that is as far as I would run with it. In other words, we did not get a “Thanks, but no thanks.”

    I was also told that Miller is not coming here, FWIW. I am only posting what I have heard from credible sources…but it doesn’t make it fact, so take it as you will.

  12. highstick 03/19/2011 at 10:14 PM #

    Sure hope my early comment on Few didn’t jinx them, but looks like they “laid an egg” based on the final score…

    I took the night off from basketball and let my wife watch “The Blind Side” on DVR…Between working in the yard all day with the pollen and the tear jerker movie, whew!

    My bold prediction for our new coach will be “Billy Bob Case Wooden” who is the grandchild of Bobby Knight’s illegitimate mother in law who was married to Adolph Rupp at one time…She later divorced and married Jerry Tarkanian…

  13. Tampa-Pack 03/19/2011 at 10:15 PM #

    And this from Wikipedia, although I’m sure it was just someone messing around….

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sean_Miller

    “Sean Miller (born November 17, 1968 in Ellwood City, Pennsylvania[1]) is an American college basketball coach, and currently the head men’s basketball coach at the University of Arizona and the future coach of North Carolina State University.”

  14. Old MacDonald 03/19/2011 at 10:16 PM #

    Interesting. Thanks Hamlet.

  15. codebrown 03/19/2011 at 10:34 PM #

    I just want us to hire somebody that will hold me and tell me that everything is going to be okay.

  16. Wulfpack 03/19/2011 at 10:40 PM #

    What is there not to like about Stevens or Few? Both would be outstanding hires.

    Too bad it looks like it probably will not be Miller. He’s my #1, though Donovan sure is intriguing. I like Barnes, I really do. But every time I go to study his resume I come away with a little feeling of under achieving at Texas.

  17. Mike 03/19/2011 at 11:00 PM #

    Stevens has been on every list since last year when he took Butler to the championship and almost handed Duck the loss. Stevens is extremely happy in Indiana, and is not coming here. I think he signed a 300 year contract extension last year after the season.

  18. TOBtime 03/19/2011 at 11:17 PM #

    highstick, that score was alot closer than it looked. Fredette put on an absolute offensive display that NO ONE could have stopped – at least with the athletes Gonzaga has. I would love to see Few be able to compete with better athletes. His teams play with precision and don’t get rattled.
    I wish I could say the same for Barnes. It’s not often you see a team with the talent Barnes has blow a 21 pt lead. His underachivements make me wonder more about him than his achievements. Sort of similiar to someone else we remember all too well.
    I also don’t see Mr. Stevens leaving Butler. Who knows.

  19. cWOhLFrPAiCKs 03/19/2011 at 11:25 PM #

    I’m starting to get the feeling that Rick Barnes is the smoke screen for one of the other big names. Not that Barnes doesn’t have any interest, just that it may be too late.

  20. LRM 03/19/2011 at 11:25 PM #

    “Mr. Stevens’ stock has just had trading halted in the after hours markets due to an unprecendent victory over a number 1 seed.”

    Adventuroo, you do realize that an eight seed beating a one is by no means “unprecedented,” right? An eight or nine seed has beaten a one seed 13 times since the NCAAT expanded to 64.

    Stevens is a great coach, but he signed a 10-year contract last April with an undisclosed, but supposedly hefty, buyout clause. If I was betting on it, I’d say the Indianapolis native probably has an exception to that buyout clause that allows him to leave for Indiana, which very well may be open after next season. And I think most folks think Yow’s “west coast” comment was about Miller, Kruger or even Montgomery, who have all won everywhere they’ve been, which she also said; not Few.

  21. ncsujuri 03/19/2011 at 11:28 PM #

    That would be quite the extension for Stevens (I think it was 10 but not sure) and I do agree with many of you that think isn’t leaving Butler anytime soon and when he does its likely to be for somewhere in the Big Ten. The only problem is the good Big Ten jobs aren’t going to be open anytime soon with MSU, IU, Purdue, Wisconsin, Ohio State and U of M all set at this point so he may have to reconsider that position and strike while the iron is hot. Mack and Howard are likely gone after this year and I have no idea what the rest of the roster looks like or what his recruiting class coming in next year looks like. Would have to imagine though that his recent success in the Big Dance would speak volumes on the recruiting trail if he was at State, along with being able to sell playing against Dook and Carolina every year etc. He would be an absolute homerun IMHO but I am not getting my hopes up. My more realistic favorite for the job is Chris Mooney from Richmond as the up and coming type but he has a pretty long extension too from what the announcers said during their game today.

  22. newt 03/19/2011 at 11:29 PM #

    You don’t ask anybody else until Barnes says no, and the reason isn’t some legend created out of thin air; it’s because he’s one of the best recruiters in college basketball. The probability is great that Barnes would succeed at NC State.

    So you throw your best pitch to Barnes (Fowlup mistake #1) and if he says no, then you look to the lower ranks for the next Billy Donovan (Fowlup mistake #2).

    I don’t see why Sean Miller is more appealing than say Gregg Marshall.

  23. cWOhLFrPAiCKs 03/19/2011 at 11:32 PM #

    ^Wow…really??? Sean Miller who is in the Sweet 16 vs. Gregg Marshall who isn’t in the tournament and hasn’t been in since he got to Witchita State? Oh yeah, I totally see your point.

  24. ncsukyle 03/19/2011 at 11:38 PM #

    I think you go after Stevens first, has a good up side and the most longevity out of anyone else out there…all he can do is say no. Then Barnes is my next choice. After that Miller and then everyone else is all right there together.

  25. drgreenhouse 03/19/2011 at 11:39 PM #

    Ben Howland also meets the Debbie Yow “he’s won everywhere” and “west coast” threads. He’s taken 3 different teams (Northern Arizona, Pittsburgh and UCLA) to the dance.

    Plus, check out how people are screwing with his Wikipedia page:

    Ben Howland (born May 28, 1957) is a Men’s college Basketball Head Coach

    He has been the head coach of the University of Arkansas since 2011, and recently signed a contract extension through 2021. Aggressive man-to-man defense is the trademark of Ben Howland-coached teams.

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