Sidney Trying To Lowe(r) Expectations For Next Basketball Season

Sidney Lowe must be talking to former NC State football coach Lou Holtz, a man who was infamous for effusively praising even the lightest of opponents as being world-beaters while talking about his own team as though they were elementary school scrubs picked last in PE for a game of kickball. 

For example, in the July 1 online edition of Technician, Lowe stated that “You like to think they can come in right away and help you right away, but we know how tough it is in our conference. Very few guys come in and dominate as freshmen, so I don’t want to put that kind of pressure on these guys. They’re going to take some bumps, but they’re going to do more good things than bad and be great for our program for years to come.”

Lowe is referring, of course, to his incoming freshman class of players that are expected to greatly rejuvinate Wolfpack fortunes. Forward C.J. Leslie, point guard Ryan Harrow and guard Lorenzo Brown will join the core of a Wolfpack team that foundered in the early part of the season only to gather itself together late and reach the semifinals of the ACC Tournament.  They faltered and ended their season after the second round of the National Invitation Tournament, setting the stage for higher expectations for this year.

While Coach Lowe may try to ratchet down expectations, his optimism shone through when he said  “I’m excited about the possibilities, just [by] bringing in a few more players that we feel we can help us. We try to work hard every day. We definitely feel good about the possibilities.”

True enough, the possibilities are there for a great season, but the simple fact is that this year, State’s fans expect more from the Wolfpack – and by extension, from  Sidney Lowe.  Some even call it a make or break year for the coach, one where he has to take his team to the NCAA tournament as an at-large team if he plans to be around to coach the Pack in 2011-12. 

Some say that pressure to win is the same pressure that caused Herb Sendek to be “fired” (even though he was asked by university administrators and top donors to stay) and that State’s woes are due to the Royal Blues of Duke and Carolina.   That’s easy to say and on the surface it may make some sense, but it’s also quite thin on any analytical understanding of the ACC or of how basketball recruiting works.  While Duke and UNC are indeed formidable in-conference foes, other schools in the conference have managed to field solid teams that are competitive night in and night out, and also, basketball recruiting is an endeavor that’s national in scope and doesn’t rely completely on in-state recruiting as does football as a component of success.  Were it the latter, State, Carolina, Duke and Wake Forest would butt heads at each and every gym across the state, but  has happened very rarely for decades.   Further, top players are not going to shy away from playing Duke or Carolina, as good players tend to want to play against other good players.  All in all, that theory fails to hold much water at all.  As a charter ACC school with great facilities, traditions, fans and media coverage, there’s no reason whatsoever for NC State to not be able to compete with anyone in country, day in and day out.  Sure, building a solid program where an annual trip to the NCAA tournament will take time, but to imply it cannot happen because NC State is unfortunate enough to be located in the same metropolitan area as Duke and Carolina is quite frankly ridiculous.

No matter what Lowe says, this season is critical to him and he surely knows it.  As SFN founder BJD95 stated in a lively thread in our forums talking about NC State’s hoops prospects for the next season, “it’s a new era. It really doesn’t matter what Lowe says anymore, only what he does. This kind of expectations gaming played well when Lee Fowler was athletic director, but I am cautiously optimistic that we have entered a “culture of accountability” phase, and that Debbie Yow has a short list for football and basketball (and isn’t afraid to use it).”

In other words, anything resembling a repeat of the last few seasons might mean a change at the helm next spring.  That’s quite simply the most realistic scenario.

But that’s next year, and this year holds a lot of promise.  While Lowe may be correct in not trying to allow fans and media to apply undue pressure on his youthful new charges, he certainly has to realize that this year is going to be one that will be a referendum on his program and tenure at his alma mater.  That’s pressure, no matter how one looks at it.

Let’s hear your thoughts: what do you think will happen next year?

You can hear an interview with Sidney Lowe at  99.9FM here.

10-11 Basketball AD & Department Coaches

42 Responses to Sidney Trying To Lowe(r) Expectations For Next Basketball Season

  1. Sam92 07/02/2010 at 8:40 AM #

    Frankly, I haven’t posted much on basketball as I’ve considered it a lost cause, but am somehow moved to express my opinion here. aren’t blogs great.

    the bottom line is that sidney lowe is not a good coach. he was only hired because lee fowler completely botched finding a replacement for sendek and needed a hire everyone would applaud.

    lowe has not performed, and will never be a great coach, and frankly i hope our upcoming season is a disaster so that lowe can get fired sooner rather than later.

  2. MA Wolfpack 07/02/2010 at 8:40 AM #

    Nothing to see here as far as I’m concerned. I’d say the same things if I was Lowe…not sure what else he can say unless he wants to “no comment” every interview. Let’s just be excited about the possibilities and see what happens when we put real ACC talent on the floor this season.

  3. Derek Medlin 07/02/2010 at 8:43 AM #

    “I’d say the same things if I was Lowe…not sure what else he can say.”

    Exactly.

  4. MA Wolfpack 07/02/2010 at 8:47 AM #

    Sam92, what are your reasons for stating Lowe is not a good coach? Do you not like his offensive sets? His substitution pattern? Defensive assignments? If you are basing your opinion on Ws and Ls, then I think you need to wait for this season before making a judgment. NCSU has not been as talented as other ACC teams over the last 4 years and you cannot win in this league without talent.

    UNC had the most talent 2 years ago and won the national title. UNC became average at PG and far below average at SG last year and UNC did not even make the tournament. Regardless of the coach, UNC was not going to be very good last year because they did not have enough talent at the guard positions.

  5. Rick 07/02/2010 at 9:04 AM #

    “I’d say the same things if I was Lowe…not sure what else he can say.”

    I don’t know maybe he should try to drum up some excitement.

    “what are your reasons for stating Lowe is not a good coach? Do you not like his offensive sets? His substitution pattern? Defensive assignments? If you are basing your opinion on Ws and L”

    Why would anyone use “offensive sets? His substitution pattern? Defensive assignments” as a barometer for how good a coach is? Those are so subjective you or I could like them and he could still be a bad coach. The only way to tell if a coach is good or bad is wins and losses. The only reason to avoid them is because Lowe’s record has been beyond awful. Sam’s point of view is a valid one whether you like it or not. There is far more evidence that he is a lousy coach than there is that he is a good coach.
    Now hopefully Lowe proves this year that he IS in fact a good coach. He has plenty of talent and the only thing that will keep this team out of the top four is coaching.

  6. ncsu05mit10 07/02/2010 at 10:02 AM #

    Doc Rivers went from a 24-58 team to a 66-16 Championship team with the addition of KG and Ray Allen. He went from being a lousy coach to a very good one.

    Having better players makes being a good coach much easier.

    That being said, if Lowe can’t perform with these guys, we all know he should be gone.

  7. Sam92 07/02/2010 at 10:36 AM #

    MA, I wouldn’t be surprised if you also opposed the firing of Chuck Amato.

    Hiring alums is actually a bad idea, because when they can’t win, other alums want to hold on to them for sentimental reasons, and that’s what’s happening with sidney lowe.

    for sure, we want a coach who follows the rules, and doesn’t get us involved in recruiting scandals, point shaving, or financial violations, and it would be nice if most of the players graduate, but within those bounds the criterion that really matters is won-loss record, and Lowe’s is unsatisfacory.

    i’m pretty skeptical of the theory that lowe’s x’s and o’s are great and he’s just been missing talent (how long should we have to wait in an era where the really good players only stay two years anyway; it’s really not like football where players make great improvements over three or four years in the program)

    however, to save everyone from my critical voice, i won’t say another word against lowe until the end of this upcoming season. who knows, maybe i’ll be impressed.

  8. tann84 07/02/2010 at 10:51 AM #

    Yea Sam92 You never know. I agree though that his is a make or break year for lowe, we learn a lot about him after this year. Whether you believe it or not, talent makes a huge difference in the game of basketball. Contrary to football where you depend a lot on other person’s talents, basketball you have a lot of chances of being one on one with another player and all that matters is if you can beat your man. Doc Rivers was about to be fired before he got KG and Ray. Now we look at him as one of the best coaches in the league. Truth is without talent there is only so much a coach can do.

  9. MatSci94 07/02/2010 at 10:57 AM #

    Maybe we should just cut and paste one of the other threads in here, rather than rehash this again.

    The blog is archived permanently, the message forum not so much. Besides, the quote comes from Coach Lowe’s summer presser yesterday, which was after the forum thread was started. – AW

  10. newt 07/02/2010 at 10:58 AM #

    “That being said, if Lowe can’t perform with these guys, we all know he should be gone.”

    This is true, and I have great confidence that we will be a good team this year, and Lowe will have become a much better coach. Then, if we build on this and recruit some more All Americans, Lowe will somehow become a great coach.

    “Did more with less” are not words used to describe any great college basketball coach. Show me an example of when Wooden, Smith, K, Knight, R. Williams, Calhoun, Case, Sloan, or Valvano ever “did more with less.”

    The importance of having great players cannot be overstated in college basketball.

  11. Alpha Wolf 07/02/2010 at 11:38 AM #

    The importance of having great players cannot be overstated in college basketball.

    True, with one caveat: they play as a team. UNC had some great players last year. It didn’t exactly work out well for them.

  12. MatSci94 07/02/2010 at 12:21 PM #

    Alpha, my ‘cut and paste’ comment was in response to

    “what are your reasons for stating Lowe is not a good coach? Do you not like his offensive sets? His substitution pattern? Defensive assignments?”

    Sorry, for not making that more clear.

  13. choppack1 07/02/2010 at 12:55 PM #

    OK – I end up nitpicking Lowe alot – but here’s another statement that annoys me:

    “We try to work hard every day”

    There is no “try” when it comes to working hard. You either work hard or you don’t.

    I have never doubted Lowe’s basketball knowledge or his ability to charm recruits. My doubts about Lowe surround his motivational skills for an entire season and his organizational abilities.

    To his credit – Lowe has recruited so much talent this year that these perceived shortcomings wont’ stop us from being a decent team this year. We’ll ultimately see how well he is these areas after this year – because of most of these guys stay – it will be his responsibility to have them motivated for 2011-2012. OTOH, if a few leave, his organizational abilities will be put to test.

  14. 61Packer 07/02/2010 at 1:29 PM #

    I think Lowe is safe next year as long as the team wins 6 or more league games. With this level of talent, we should win 8 to 10 ACC games, maybe a dozen.

    Good coach or not, I think Lowe will be with us for awhile. I don’t see him going anywhere because his predecessor gave us ten years of mediocrity before leaving on his own decision. I think the current Wolfpack administration probably has had enough firings for now and will be loathe to do it again anytime soon.

    Personally, I’d like to see a coaching change, but it ain’t gonna happen anytime soon. So, I just hope we don’t have a disaster next season like Sam92 does.

  15. Conrad 07/02/2010 at 3:25 PM #

    Sam92, I think you are a Iost cause because you dont even undestand what makes a good coach. And we havent had one every since that day that they decided to fired V without a game pIan to repIace him a equaI or better coach. So i am damn gIad that we dont have CaIipari here right now. As for the other coaches that was offer the job, pIs teII me what has any of them won besides CaIipria winning his conference titIrs ? NOTHING AT AII !

    So if you was expecting Sidney to waIk right in & start winning without any coIIege coaching experience nor any kind of reIationships with high schooI coaches & the pIayers then you dont know about coaching at aII. And he was not on Iist of coaches either. But i think that he is going to get the baII roIIing now since these Iast 2 recruiting cIasses. So you best to get on this train right now before you wiII be hating on him for the 2 yrs.

  16. Rick 07/02/2010 at 3:41 PM #

    “Sam92, I think you are a lost cause because you dont even undestand what makes a good coach.”

    A good coach wins a bad coach does not.
    It is pretty friggin’ simple and the only reason to complicate it is to try to polish the proverbial turd.

    “I think Lowe is safe next year as long as the team wins 6 or more league games”

    If Lowe only wins six with this amount of talent his office should be cleaned out by the time he arrives home from the ACC tournament.

    “Doc Rivers was about to be fired before he got KG and Ray. ”
    This seems to be the new rallying cry but there is one KEY difference. Rivers does not control who he gets. Lowe is responsible for who he recruits. If there is no talent that is on him. So can we please stop with this extremely flawed comparison?

  17. Conrad 07/02/2010 at 4:03 PM #

    Rick, you are just as crazy as Sam92 is about Sideny. And i am wonder if you was saying the same exact things about Sendek 1st 6 yrs ? You probabIy didnt. In book him nor Robinsons had no business ever coaching at State or in the ACC. But State had no other choices in Ianding a coach going into the middIe of June instead of Sidney. PIus atIeast he did wanted to be here where as aII the coaches was afraid to go up against K & Roy. So does that count for anything with you ? Again it doesnt. I guess that you just enjoy compIaining without any knowIedge about coaching & winning.

  18. bradleyb123 07/02/2010 at 4:09 PM #

    The only way to tell if a coach is good or bad is wins and losses. The only reason to avoid them is because Lowe’s record has been beyond awful. Sam’s point of view is a valid one whether you like it or not. There is far more evidence that he is a lousy coach than there is that he is a good coach.

    I guess Coach K was a bad coach in his first 3-4 years at Duke. It’s a good thing Duke fired him and went out and found a great coach to replace him with, one that could bring in great players.

  19. Rick 07/02/2010 at 4:14 PM #

    Conrad,
    I am going to do my best to answer your post as it does not make a lot of sense.

    “And i am wonder if you was saying the same exact things about 1st 6 yrs ”
    Who’s 1st 6 years? If you are talking about Herb then yes I was saying the same thing about him. Do a search on this forum to get my opinions about Herb. For some reason anyone that is unhappy with Lowe is called a Herb lover. If I thought Herb was doing a bad job why would I think Lowe is doing a good job when he is sucking a lot worse than Herb did?

    “In book him nor Robinsons had any business ever coaching at State or in the ACC”
    I honestly have no idea what you are trying to say. Your typing goes way past fat fingers and into the illiterate realm.

    “I guess that you just enjoy compIainting without any knowIedge about coaching & winning”
    Please explain what there is know about “winning”. You either win or you do not. Again, it is an easy thing to quantify. And I do not “enjoy complaining”. I would much prefer for us to win games and championships.

  20. bradleyb123 07/02/2010 at 4:19 PM #

    Lowe is responsible for who he recruits. If there is no talent that is on him. So can we please stop with this extremely flawed comparison?

    Lowe IS responsible for who he recruits. But we couldn’t expect him to being in great players from day one. Coaches recruit players from the time they’re freshmen in high school. In Sid’s first year, he had ZERO recruits that he had recruited as freshmen. That’s because he was in the NBA the years before that. He was LUCKY to get Hickson and Tracy Smith, honestly. His recruits after that first year are more on par with what any reasonable person would EXPECT from him.

    Now that Sid has had a few years to recruit players as freshmen and sophomores, he’s bringing in better and better recruiting classes. Last year was a solid class. And we all know about THIS incoming class. It took TIME for Sid to get the ball rolling on recruiting, and he has clearly done that.

    Bottom line, you don’t judge a coach in his first few years on wins and losses alone. You HAVE to consider other metrics. But Sid’s early years are done. He doesn’t get a perpetual pass. But after he has recruited such a great class, the LEAST we can do is see what he can do with them.

    You might have a point if we brought in a college coach that was able to bring previous recruits with him. Sid couldn’t exactly bring NBA players with him. I’m pretty sure there are NCAA rules against that.

  21. 61Packer 07/02/2010 at 4:20 PM #

    Everybody keeps wanting to make K a bad coach in his first 3 years at Duke. I saw those games then and those Duke teams, compared to Lowe’s first 3 years at State, were superior in about every way except perhaps talent. K got more out of those teams than Lowe got out of his first 3 State teams. They were disciplined, they played solid team defense, they didn’t keep making stupid turnovers, and the players were sound fundamentally. Good players will gravitate to those programs, and they certainly did from 1985 onward.

    I haven’t seen any signs that State is building anything under Lowe that resembles a solid bball program. Not yet anyway. Yes, they’ve got good talent coming in this season, and I believe it’ll be good enough to get enough wins to keep Lowe here for some time. But will these guys mesh into an ACC competitor or be a team of talented individuals who underachieve and keep NCSU basketball mired in the mediocrity we’ve endured now for twenty years?

  22. Conrad 07/02/2010 at 4:37 PM #

    Aipha WoIf, Roy Iast yrs team had more than Sidney has had in 1st 4 yrs beIieve it or not. But if you dont have a soiId to good PG it reaIIy does matter how great the other pIayers is. So the PG is the key to any good to great teams. Sidney has finaIIy found a set of guards that can be his fIoor coach just Iike him & Towe was for they coaches.

  23. Rick 07/02/2010 at 4:44 PM #

    “He was LUCKY to get Hickson and Tracy Smith, honestly. His recruits after that first year are more on par with what any reasonable person would EXPECT from him.”

    So when he does well it is luck but when he does poorly it is expected?
    That is not the most ringing endorsement I ever heard for him.

    Nonetheless, I agree that he should get this year to see what he does “with talent”. But I do tire of people telling those that are skeptical of Lowe that “they do not know basketball”. That was what I was arguing about. It does not take some mystical basketball knowledge to see we have been awful so far.
    Also, IMO we have underperformed for the talent we have but I also realize that is completely subjective so there is no use arguing about it.

  24. choppack1 07/02/2010 at 4:55 PM #

    BradleyB – Basicaly, we have been told – and I think it’s somewhat accurate…that the reason we struggled in 2007, 2008, 2009 and 2010 was because we didn’t have adequate guard play.

    I’m just wondering why it takes a staff 5 season to get a quality guard or two in school? What does that say about the staff and its ability to execute?

  25. bradleyb123 07/02/2010 at 5:08 PM #

    It says it took us four years to get a top-notch point guard.

    But no one ever said that was our only problem. I’ll go to my grave knowing Herb’s leftovers did more harm than good in Sidney’s first three years. I think they’re more to blame than anyone is willing to give them credit for.

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