Doeren on flight to Boston this week

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This topic contains 19 replies, has 6 voices, and was last updated by  McCallum 4 months, 2 weeks ago.

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  • #133768

    Greywolf
    Participant

    It’s a slow football news period so I decided to share this tidbit.

    A friend on a business trip saw Dave Doeren, along with Drinkwitz and Huxtable, on a flight to Boston. He asked him about it and Doeren said that they were going up to New England to watch a few practices. My friend said Doeren seemed like he didn’t want to talk about it so he dropped it.

    Later reflecting on the short conversation we decided he was going up to watch the Patriots practice. We thought back to Belichick’s visit to Raleigh. Pretty sure he didn’t come down here to coach a player he wasn’t going to be able to draft.

    What’s the relationship between Doeren and Belichick? These are closed practices. You can’t just walk up and watch. I’m thinking it’s all good. There has to be some mutual respect for these 2 events — Belichick in Raleigh and Doeren in New England — to occur. Is Belichick mentoring Doeren? Doeren could have a whole lot worse mentors.

    Probably making a mountain out of a mole hill, but like I said, it’s a slow football news time of year.

    #133769

    ryebread
    Participant

    My guess is recruiting. If it were just DD, then maybe the Patriots thing holds water. Given it was DD and his two top assistants, then I suspect it is just looking at players.

    #133772

    Fastback68
    Participant

    How to win championships by stealing opposing team’s playbooks, spying on and video tapping competition’s workouts, stealing signal calling and deflating footballs??? Fashion tips?? Is DD going to start wearing sleeveless sweatshirts or just a tarp like Rambo? How to respond to media questions with Neanderthal type grunts or unibrow facial expressions??

    #133773

    LifeLongWolf
    Participant

    I’ll bet Rye is right.

    My own similar anecdote: I saw DD in the Orlando airport one time. I got up the nerve and went over to shake his hand. I said something about how he was doing a great job. He just grunted “Thanks” and made it clear he didn’t want to talk. He looked tired so I let it go. Socializing with the fans doesn’t seem to be his cup ‘o tea. Can’t really say I blame him, though, 24/7/365 recruiting must take a toll.

    #133774

    Greywolf
    Participant

    Rye and LifeLongWolf,
    We recruit Orlando and other parts of Florida, we don’t recruit New England and high schools are not practicing right now. That’s a lot of coaching muscle to be looking at a HS player do what?

    It could be recruiting but the Patriot’s have OTAs May 30-31. If I was going to watch the Pats practice to see how they did it, I would take my 2 coordinators. Designing practices is HC & coordinator business.

    I went to a couple of Doeren’s practices the first year. I went with a Wolfpack Letterman who said it was the most organized practice he had ever seen. It won’t be one or 2 big things that keep us in the top 25 or vault us into the top 10, it will be attention to detail and a lot of small things that add up.

    Belichick is one of the brightest minds in football today and honestly I like Doeren using his connections. I don’t think I am going to overlook that important factor because of my dislike for the Patriots or Belichick.

    For fashion Doeren is going over to Holesville to check out the argyle and basketball player on the football unis. 😉

    #133775

    Fastback68
    Participant

    I hope part of the visit was a session on the benefit of a traditional TE. Could you imagine a Whitten, a Gonzales or a gronk 2.0 in this offense? How often does this team pass inside the hash marks 5,10,15 yards down the middle? It might have seriously burned ND’s constant blitzes straight up the middle. A 6’7 240 pound target should help in red zone scoring.

    #133776

    Greywolf
    Participant

    I hope part of the visit was a session on the benefit of a traditional TE. Could you imagine a Whitten, a Gonzales or a gronk 2.0 in this offense? How often does this team pass inside the hash marks 5,10,15 yards down the middle? It might have seriously burned ND’s constant blitzes straight up the middle. A 6’7 240 pound target should help in red zone scoring.

    ^Here’s a good thought. I wouldn’t be surprised if that was on the agenda.

    #133777

    ryebread
    Participant

    gray: As always, I hope you are right.

    While I get that the kids aren’t playing right now, the recruiting rules changed this year:
    https://247sports.com/college/football/recruiting/ContentGallery/Recruits-who-committed-to-Power-5-schools-this-week-118418443

    During the past week alone – beginning May 19 and ending May 25 – there were 28 players from the class of 2019 committed to Power Five college football program, including 27 high school prospects and one junior college prospects. Of the high school players who committed this week, three were rated as five-star prospects and six were rated as four-star prospects, according to the 247Sports Composite. The lone junior college commitment of the week came from one of the top overall JUCO prospects in the country, per the Composite.

    The list of Power Five schools that secured at least one commitment this week includes (in alphabetical order): Alabama, Arizona, Auburn, Baylor, Iowa State, Kansas State, Louisville, Maryland, Michigan State, NC State, Northwestern (2), Notre Dame, Oregon (2), Penn State (3), Purdue, South Carolina (2), Stanford, Tennessee, Texas, TCU, USC, Virginia and Washington.

    I wouldn’t be opposed to recruiting more in the northeast. We’re trying to build a mid-west Big 10 styled team. There are some kids in the northeast that Penn State, Michigan, ND, BC, Syracuse, etc. have gotten for years that fit that mold and have been good football players.

    Dare to dream. Maybe it’s both?

    #133779

    Greywolf
    Participant

    gray: As always, I hope you are right.

    Rye, As usual, I am. 😉

    About recruiting in New England… I expect as we continue to excel a few HS players from New England will contact us. IMO to be effective in recruiting an area you have to have assistant coaches who are known in the area and have relationships with HS coaches. George McDonald was already established in Florida as is Dan Patrick. Roof is well known and respected in Georgia. Faulkner is dominant in the Charlotte area. And so it goes.

    We have staked our claim in New Jersey and are doing the same in Tidewater Va. We have point men in position recruiting as well as geographically. There are no clear cut lines but each coach has recruiting responsibilities.

    In addition to coaches we have recruiting staff as well. Clemson has probably twice as many staff devoted to recruiting as we do. Spreading our staff and coaches too thin could be detrimental to the overall effort. In order to recruit successfully you have to identify and be “on” elite players as sophomores and even freshmen sometimes. I would guess the Quality Control coaches are looking at sophomore film during the off=season helping to identify beneath the radar talent.

    The perennial top teams such as Alabama, Ohio State, Michigan, USCal and others can come in late to offer after a player blows up during his junior year but teams on the rise like NC State must already have our foot in the door.

    Doeren says we will not be out worked. All this work behind the scenes by staff and coaches is already paying off with our being on some top 5, 8 and 10 lists with some very good company. When we have another good, winning season this year it will only get better.

    I kind of drifted off a little but I just don’t think we have the recruiting staff to do an effective job of recruiting if we try to cover more territory than we already do.

    #133780

    ryebread
    Participant

    Glad you are right on this one grey. Hopefully they pick up some things from what clearly is the best run NFL franchise.

    I tend to agree that we should pick some critical recruiting areas and hit them hard. I’d probably target:
    – As much of NC as possible but really focusing on Durham and east
    – Charlotte Metro
    – Tidewater area
    – S. Georgia/N. Florida
    – Atlanta metro
    – Miami
    – DC Metro

    There’s enough talent from this segment alone to win big. I feel the same way about basketball as well.

    #133781

    Greywolf
    Participant

    Rye, We seem to be on the same page regarding Doeren’s trip to New England and our recruiting philosophy and practices.

    Recruiting is a team game. The staff does the heavy lifting searching for talent. Coaches are in contact with HS coaches and pick up some info on potential recruits. This coach/HS coach relationship cannot be emphasized enough. If a boys HS coach says, “You might want to take a look at NC State. I think you would fit in there personally as well as football wise.” you know the boy is going to take a look. How many schools can a young man look at? If you are recommended by the HS coach, you are ahead of the game.

    But you know all this. I’m just talking football. It’s so much better talking to someone like you, Rye, than talking to myself. The mind is a dangerous place to go by oneself. 😉
    Perhaps last year’s “haul” or ranking may not be a valid gauge of the condition of the overall program. Seeing who your team is in competition with may be a more accurate assessment of your status in the recruiting world.

    NC State is fishing in the right ponds these days. We may not land all the “big ones” we want this year or even next year. Regardless, you have to be fishing for the big ones to catch the big ones. I have wondered why we haven’t seen more 5-stars on our recruiting board. Trying to see from Doeren’s point of view, we are not over-reaching for talent we haven’t won “the right” to recruit yet. Our day will be here soon.

    If we are in the area of top 25 recruiting classes, we will do better than top 25 results. Thunder Dan is outstanding in the area of strength and conditioning. Our receivers coach, George McDonald has one of the best group of receivers in the country. Dwayne Ledford is a top-notch OL coach. Faulkner didn’t do too bad with Cole Cook and JaySam and we have a JUCO TE transfer who is 6-7 and very athletic, so TE wise I’d say we are in good shape.

    We are after 5-star Quavious(sp) Couch from Charlotte who is Rivals number 1 ranked recruit in the country. I don’t know where we stand with him but we are in the picture. That alone to me is amazing. For what it’s worth, his brother is an incoming freshman. I’m not holding my breath on this one but I’ve got my fingers crossed. Almost everyone is recruiting him as a running back but a few are recruiting him as a LB. Me? I’d say come on down to Raleigh and play any-darn-where you want to play. 😉

    #133782

    Greywolf
    Participant

    Drake Thomas just committed to NC State over Clemson, TN, VT. L’ville. Also had offers and considered Alabama and Ole Miss and 14 offers he had low or no interest in including no interest in EweNC.

    #133783

    Pack78
    Participant

    Big pickup-great news!

    #133784

    Fastback68
    Participant

    And a wr. Trifecta???

    #133785

    Fastback68
    Participant

    Keyon Lesane

    #133786

    Greywolf
    Participant

    Drake says he will be bringing in some more defensive recruits with him. If he does that will be huge as well.

    #133787

    ryebread
    Participant

    Grey: I’m with you regarding football recruiting. Win and 5 stars will come. It is important for the program to ride a Senior Finley into the rankings all season. That is the nex step, even if it is 15-25 all year. That’s really where Sheridan had us year in and year out, and that is the high water line for our program in my lifetime. It would be nice to get back there, but first we have to do it once.

    Like you I really like McDonald. There was a reason Syracuse was so
    Mad when he left. I saw an immediate improvement in our route running the next year, and I think we’ve seen the bump in recruiting.

    Ironically I feel better about the position coaches on offense than defense. Our DL haul (particularly with all the playing time we’ll be offering) will be telling.

    I also agree about Thunder Dan. I hope we can keep it up because S&C kind of seems to cycle. We started really strong with Stroud but I think he left and we weren’t the same in the final years of Amato. TOB’s S&C was awful. Then we picked up with the Arkansas hire, but it fell off before Thunder. Let’s hope Thunder can sustain it.

    I also think football recruiting is less exact than basketball. Yes there are clearly 5 stars that are flops in basketball but they are much rarer. The kids are so much better vetted, thus the ability to put a predicted value on a player by the shoe companies. Football evaluation is much tougher, more distributed and the players are only playing at certain times of the year. I trust what my eyes tell me and that is that the talent level in many positions is going up.

    #133788

    Greywolf
    Participant

    Ironically I feel better about the position coaches on offense than defense. Our DL haul (particularly with all the playing time we’ll be offering) will be telling.

    As you well know I look under the surface for answers. Our defensive coaching is no different. Doeren’s replacement at NI was his DC who probably kept the staff under him. At least the better coaches. This probably caught Doeren off guard a little. The offer by NC State probably was a bit of a surprise although I’m sure the negotiations were going on with his agent before we made the off.

    Regardless, he had to scramble for defensive position coaches. While DD isn’t the most personable guy in the world with fans, he is well known and well liked by coaches. While Chuck seemed to have relationships with the Norm Chow’s of the profession, DD seems more related to coaches who fit with his family culture but are either good up and comers or or like McDonald and Barlow — good coaches who didn’t have the greatest relationship with their previous bosses.

    Fans have been down on Huxtable since he got here. The more I see of Hux the better I like him. Not for his DC abilities but for his personality and how well liked he is amongst the players — recruits in particular. Hux truly is a good man and is the “father image” in this family atmosphere. He isn’t driven by ego either, otherwise Roof could not have come to coach with him.

    Barlow doesn’t get much love because of the seemingly poor performance of our corners. You can’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear. Barlow hasn’t had as much to work with as, say, McDonald. (He was one of Franklin’s staff at Vanderbilt so we know he’s not a pure dog.) He made a decent corner out of Alston in short order. You know Alston has been invited for a tryout by one of the NFL teams, right? Now he’s doing a ‘wonder’ job with Trowell. Barlow has done the best job he could with what he has had to work with. I’m OK with him until he proves he hasn’t got it.

    Bringing in Roof may be a real difference maker. I heard many complaints last year about our safeties being out of position and looking confused. That will stop with Ted Roof coaching them. I see Aaron Henry as “red-shirting.” Funny thing to say about a coach but think about it. He coached safeties last year and this year he only has responsibility for nickels. And you know that Roof being a co-DC he’s training Henry.

    While there is some overlap at LB, with Hux DC-ing the DL and the LB’s and Roof DC-ing the Safties, nickels and corners, we have a very nice division of responsibilities. I also suspect Henry is getting some training in coaching corners by Barlow. The nickel back does some receiver coverage and needs some of the same coveerage skills as corners.

    That stuff is all in my mind an I may be totally off. What we do know is DD has some attention on the defense other than the DL. Our LB and CB recruiting is several degrees above where we have been. IMO DD can let go of any defensive coaching he may think he has to do with Hux and Roof here. We really miss Clayton White but are now recovering from his loss.

    DD has improved remarkably as a HC in my opinion. Thinking about it OC’s are involved in game decisions far more than DC’s. Dave was a DC and it showed his first few years here. Behind the scenes DD insists on his coaches and himself have on-going training. Great attitude for a HC. And how the heck did he hook up with Belichick?

    Speaking of the Pats I wonder if Drinkwitz was getting some coaching on using his tight end? I hope Hux was getting some coverage training and some blitz training on the trip. If we don’t use our TE for some receiving, we will not be able to recruit the good TE’s. We can teach blocking technique if the players are willing to learn and get their noses smacked around by DT’s. But you can’t teach soft hands. speed and running ability to the OT playing TE.

    Rye, I’m through for the morning. Let’s get another beer and a sandwich and then you tell what tell what you think about the defense and defensive coaches? I’m not married to any of my thoughts. Let ‘er rip.

    #133789

    Fastback68
    Participant

    Trifecta is in the barn.

    #133790

    McCallum
    Participant

    Recruit Hwy 74 from Shelby to Wilmington,30 miles north and south.

    You’ll get everything you want and need except a QB.

    McCallum

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