10/25/2014 at 9:31 AM #59882StateFansKeymaster
This has been an active bye week. Your head is probably spinning from trying to keep up with all the info churning out after the Wainstein Report show
[See the full post at: Bye Week Bonanza]10/25/2014 at 9:50 AM #59886HungwolfParticipant
Liberal Obervers, Raleigh and Charlotte, got an article on Roy. Looks like they trying to do damage control and protect the bball program. Amazing baseball coach caught lying and they all to willing to throw former football coaches under the bus, but lying for that basketball program is such a habit of history it will never change.
McCants says Roy knew, Walden might have told Roy but can’t remember, and Carolyn Cannon won’t talk at all! After the treatment McCants got, watching people get felony charges dropped when they admitted guilt, and seeing the way NC media outlets have acted no wonder Walden and Cannon scared to talk!10/25/2014 at 10:19 AM #59887
I’m gonna hit my knees and PRAY that Sharpton’s (correct for once) take on how out and out racist this whole scheme was takes root. Not to mention how many young black men were steered away from any sort of real benefit from a university education.
Soft bigotry of low/no expectations, indeed.10/25/2014 at 11:26 AM #59894HungwolfParticipant
Over 3000 unearned diplomas handed out, that not worth the paper they written on!10/25/2014 at 11:40 AM #59896GreywolfParticipant
Funny thing that DC’s boyfriend was never mentioned, never interviewed by Wainstein. My memory is just the pits these days but wasn’t his name Warren something and didn’t he play basketball at UNC? You’d think he would be a likely interviewee. I’d love to see Wainstein interviewed about his instructions and if he had a “hands-off” list.10/25/2014 at 12:00 PM #59898wufpup76Keymaster
^Warren Martin. Played under Dean in the ’80’s.
I believe the Wainstein report covers the AFAM prong only, and since Martin is only indirectly tied to AFAM through his relationship w/ Crowder then Martin wouldn’t be on the list of interviewees.
Amazingly, the report itself is limited in scope – though the supplemental report and list of e-mails contain info that sprout off in many directions. I’ve been lurking Pack Pride and they have several threads concerning the supplemental/e-mails. Once analyzed it really is astonishing how much info is there considering the narrow scope of the report.
I’d say this report is not the end. The level of collusion displayed in those e-mails is astounding.10/25/2014 at 12:12 PM #59901WolfanaticParticipant
At the risk of disagreeing with Al Sharpton, and sounding politically incorrect at the same time, I believe that: in reaching the conclusion that Sharpton is correct, and that the shenanigans that UNC engaged in spell out a case of racism, one must then reason the following: (A) that the student-athletes that enrolled in these no-show classes were simply incapable of remaining academically eligible had they enrolled in bona-fide classes, (and thus they should never have been allowed into the University in the first place), (B) that these student-athletes were incapable of making their own decisions regarding their opportunity to choose their own path to graduation, (C) that the University perhaps forced them to take no-show classes against their will, and (D) that these classes were not equally available to white student-athletes.
Like most, I find UNC’s actions to be reprehensible in so far as they violate the code of conduct regarding academic matriculation and its over-sight. However, accusing UNC of racism seems to be “piling on” at this point, in my opinion. The student-athletes in question likely did not have to meet the same academic requirements and qualifications as the non-student-athlete vying for a spot at UNC, and so if anything, they were given a special exemption into the University, and thus, an opportunity to obtain a degree in the field of their choice, if they so desired to work for it. How is that racist? It sounds more like a case of affirmative action than racism, unless of course, one wishes to argue that affirmative action is reverse racism, n’est pas?10/25/2014 at 12:28 PM #59905WufpackerParticipant
Is it racist if I miss the old James Brown/Jabba the Hutt lovechild Sharpton?10/25/2014 at 12:44 PM #59906WolfanaticParticipant
No, Tawana, it is not.10/25/2014 at 12:53 PM #59907
Wuf, nah. And LMAO at the description.
Here’s where I see racism. You set up your fraudulent curriculum, so you can discredit valid criticism as “racist.” Using race as a shield for fraud is extremely racist and evil. Devalues the suffering that millions of people have suffered for actual racist reasons.
One of the justifications (which I agree with) for academic exceptions is to create opportunity for high school kids who could otherwise slip through the cracks. But it’s only a good thing when they are exposed to a real education, and learn to sink or swim on their own merits. When your coaches and academic advisors disproportionately push you into a sham major to keep you eligible, there’s quite a bit of pressure to go along. And the vast majority of these pushed kids (especially given that the sham vehicle was AFAM) are black. Racist because they are assuming that black kids can’t learn, and racist in that they aren’t pushing at-risk kids to take advantage of a real educational opportunity.
It also devalues African/African American studies as a meaningful topic of study, which it most certainly can be (and is at places like UVA). Making AFAM into a punchline is racist in effect.
Of course, some white athletes were part of this sham system, too. But that doesn’t mean there was no racism involved (anymore than the fact that some non-athletes took classes made it “not an athletics issue” like the Holes claimed). It was a cynical use of black people and black issues as chattel for their own selfish interests. And deserves to be called out as such.10/25/2014 at 12:53 PM #5990810/25/2014 at 1:02 PM #59910WufpackerParticipant10/25/2014 at 1:59 PM #59922GreywolfParticipant
For those of you who don’t know Tawana:
Tyrone, spell dictate.
That’s good Tyrone. Now use dictate in a sentence.
Tawana, how do my ….10/25/2014 at 8:42 PM #59976YogiNCParticipant
Ummmm, that was awful grey, but funny in a 5th grader bathroom humor sort of way…LOL
Smarter than the average bear10/26/2014 at 5:34 AM #59979PackerInRussiaParticipant
I also agree on the race side of things (and not just because it’s UNC). I’m wary or calling out “racism” when it’s unnecessary and also try to avoid following whatever is the politically correct thing to say. The main reason is because I think there are times when it’s a valid charge and it diminishes the seriousness of it when so many things are called “racist.” You’d like to think that black and white (and other) players who may not otherwise get a college degree are taught and given the benefits of education while also playing a sport. In other words, that there is care and development of the whole person and they are given the opportunity to succeed in life beyond sports, since it’s a small minority of people who actually go pro and have a long, successful career compared to those who want to. At UNC, there was none of that. It was all about sports and their success and the “student”-athletes didn’t matter a bit. Because a majority are black and it’s an AFAM program, I think it’s fair to say that black athletes were the target and main victims (again, I usually hate that word). They continued to get fake degrees and UNC was able to tout their record of graduation success without actually giving a benefit to the athlete.
With that, I think it’s time for a new moniker: UNC-Plantation.10/26/2014 at 7:48 AM #59980YogiNCParticipant
The UNC Plantation, that fits on so many levels, with the arrogance being at the top of the list.
Smarter than the average bear10/26/2014 at 10:09 AM #59982MPParticipant
“Plantation” is the same word I found myself thinking this weekend. Not specifically in a ‘race’ kind of way, but this was a system to blatantly use people for the entertainment of others. It can be argued that the entire major college sports system does this, to different degrees at different places, but this case stands out on a micro level regardless of the macro level.
In other words, 50 years from now, if history books reflect on a shameful college sports system of the past that no longer exists, the unique and blatant shamefulness of the UNC case will still justify its own chapter.10/26/2014 at 10:18 AM #59983GAWolfKeymaster
Colin Cowherd said on his radio show that “UNC is taunting the NCAA with its actions.”
I see “taunting” as poking a grizzly bear with a sick.
Check out this website. There’s Deborah Stroman, a professor of exercise science (and once member of the UNC women’s basketball staff) who is named in emails as a provider of independent study/paper classes in a loving embrace with Roy Williams.
Yet Roy didn’t know about the paper classes? Come on, man.
Interesting about Stroman, this website appears to be advertising her for-profit business that makes money off professional athletes, many of which were likely the beneficiary of fake classes at UNC to remain eligible. She also has tight connections with Jan Boxill and Jan’s “Ethics” group per her UNC Faculty website.
You can’t make this stuff up.10/26/2014 at 11:01 AM #59986JohnGalt78Participant
Well, I wasn’t thinking Plantation. That’s really a good tag for the school as a whole. But I was thinking Pimps and Ho’s. Focusing in on Roy…because really, he’s asking us to focus by lying about knowing….and boiling it down to $$$$, Roy is a pimp and he’s been pimping out these kids that absolutely do not belong any college anywhere so he can hit his bonuses. Pimping for $$$$$$.10/26/2014 at 1:54 PM #59997PapaJohnParticipant
*Al Sharpton calls this worse for blacks than Donald Sterling”
I’ve always thought of Sharpton as a little too ‘out there’ for me. He always seems to take such an extreme position.
But welcome to the ‘piling on’ Reverend, we are glad to have you. LOL Hope something sticks on Teflon U.10/26/2014 at 2:15 PM #59999wufpup76Keymaster
^^^Yes, plantation mentality – very apt.
And Roy does have all the lies down, like a pimp who always avoids charges … though I still like the mafioso comparison for the Hole basketball program. Roy is the true Teflon Tarhole – all the underlings and other familia are to be burned to protect the Don and his program (Chapel Hill’s baby).10/27/2014 at 9:56 AM #60016Pack85EEParticipant
he’s been pimping out these kids that absolutely do not belong any college anywhere
When you say this about one school’s players, it is really about every school’s players. We are all going after the same guys, especially in football where you need 85 or more. I think Sharpton brings up a good point. We all have been in college under intense pressure to learn the material and get the work done. Some semesters, many have dropped classes when we saw we were in trouble. It’s worse for these kids who put incredible time into their sport. But I think (I hope) most schools keep pushing them along to complete the course work (at a slower pace in-season) and advance towards a degree. Every person I have ever talked to who took classes at State and UNC said the classes at State were harder. So if our boys and make progress, UNC’s kids could also. UNC was just making it easy for them to opt out of the heavy work load and cruize. It would be hard for any young man who thinks he can’t do the work equal to his peers to say no to an eazy A. He missed a very valuable leason that he could have pushed forward and suceeded in life and that is probably the greatest travesty of this cheating system. There are some kids that do not belong (Chris W. for instance who has learned sucess late in life) but many more are kids who have not been pushed to study and learn. They really could if they tried. It might require remedial courses and they may need to stay away from engineering courses. But they can do it. Or Else there are over 180 schools cheating like hell. And we would be included.10/27/2014 at 11:17 AM #60020VaWolf82Keymaster10/27/2014 at 8:05 PM #60051Wolfson59Participant
They do need to look beyond AFAM. I have heard right from the lips of some of Mike Fox’s own players that “all athletes take theater classes.”
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