With Virginia’s 76-74 win over Georgia Tech last night, NC State is just one small step away from claiming the cellar in the ACC, along with the #12 seed in the ACCT. As long as the Wolfpack loses as expected at Wake Forest on Saturday (or Virginia and Boston College each wins 1 of its last 2 games), the quest will be complete. The Pack loses all tiebreakers, having won no games against Virginia, Georgia Tech, or Boston College.
I’m not quite as sure we’ll lose out as I was before the Duke game. We just might have a little something in store for Wake. They’ve never really faced our secret weapon before. T-Ferg!
How the mighty have fallen. I think I understand Gavin Grant’s four game loss prediction at the beginning of the season. He was misquoted. He must have actually said “I don’t think we will lose more than all but four conference games this season.”
Mighty?
We were mighty before the season began……mighty overly optimistic.
Howler,
I think you are right.. Grant was misquoted he said we would win four games not lose four and be in the final four.
We will win the play-in game.
Truthfully, other than Duke and UNC (maybe Clemson), this league is just VERY AVERAGE. I’m so sick of the blues, and how they seem to be at the top of ACC basketball each year - yeah I know ESPN loves it. I’m ready for us to get back into the mix. WTNY? I think we need to get the Wake win to get us ready for the tourney, but whether we’re an 11 seed or 12 seed makes very little difference.
There isn’t a play-in game anymore. Last place plays the #5 seed on Day One.
When was the last time we were actually last in the conference? Was it Les Robinson’s last year? Seems like Sendek’s first year we managed to make it to next-to-last and Guh. Tech finished dead last.
We could have been the 3rd best team in the conference this season. Only unc & duke have more talent IMO.
^^^I agree, Packgrad93!! Again, I’m going to chalk it up to a big learning curve, personnel issues, etc., and hope for better days. I’m really looking to see who we sign in ‘09 and ‘10.
If you did a graph, you could show a very damning trend line.
NC State basketball - “A race to the bottom!”
At this point, I mostly just want to see young guys getting time and, hopefully, getting better. I’d love to win something for Gavin, he’s been a trooper and really is the best interview in the conference.
However, most of all, I want the staff to enter the off-season with a sense of desperation. I want them to be in pain, to the point of fearing for their jobs (as if Lee would fire them, HA!). I want them to completely revisit their ideas on off-season workouts, motivation, defensive schemes, offensive pace and team-first philosophies. I want Sid to consider staff changes, if necessary. This lousy season will have been a total waste if Sid doesn’t take a lot of the trouble to heart. We’re now entering year 3, it’s no longer about what we were in 2006, it’s about what Sid has made and will make us for 2008-2010.
BJD: That’s a great paragraph right there. Couldn’t agree more.
The Spirit of the Les Robinson Classic is among us.
I reckon the positive is that next season we won’t have to worry about falling short of expectations.
haze, I’m with you. If we walk into next season with the same people around this program…well, shit, I don’t know what I’m going to do. But it’s going to be a very damning sign for Lowe.
If we finish last, we get another prize:
We dont get to participate in the ACC/Big 10 Challenge next season.
Ouch
That really hurts.
Like I said before, I do not like this team very much right now. There is no reason to be where we are.
If we were in a battle for first or even fourth and the last team to receive a first round ACC tourney bye, I could make a heck of a rant regarding the unbalanced schedules in the league. It hardly seems worth it for last place.
BJD: Being winless against the other competitors for last makes the argument less potent as well.
Haze - I think you need to remember - the players just aren’t executing, that’s the only problem here. Everything else is fine. If we can get the players to execute next year, we’ll be great.
Thank you football - the combined misery of the past few years killed the part of me that would have actually tuned in for games this year. Guess I didn’t miss much.
“Haze - I think you need to remember - the players just aren’t executing, that’s the only problem here. Everything else is fine. If we can get the players to execute next year, we’ll be great.”
My coffee must be late getting into the bloodstream…but…that’s snark, right? I hope?
BJD: I read as snark.
Maybe we could schedule a Memphis, Kentucky, Florida, or Texas instead of the ACC/Big 10 challenge.
First off, is it really a “challenge” anymore??? How about a Big East/ACC Challenge??? I think that would be more appropriate.
To add to RickJ’s comments, I agree. If we were 9-6 at this point with 2 losses each to UNC, Duke, and Clemson, we could argue that — but with losses to the 9, 10, and 11th place teams, it ain’t worth it. You gotta beat the teams that you should beat. Note: when harping on the value of guard play and the need for experience (which I agree with to an extent - just no need to continually use it as an excuse), Va Tech is in 4th place when they lost two senior starting guards - Seth Greenberg IMO is the front-runner for COY.
SFN will list its winners for POY, COY, and ROY early next week. POY is easy, ROY is between Singler and Johnson (lean Singler), COY is between Purnell, Greenburg, and Haith (lean Greenburg).
no worries - getting to the finals of the ACC Tournament will be even sweeter!
honestly, though, i’d rather for them to lose by 20 in the play-in game than to get to the finals, playing their asses off, only to validate that they’ve been lolly-gagging all year, and then in the finals, meet one of the blues and have the game decided by a bunch of incompetent referees.
lastly, for our collective sanity (and for mine if you don’t care about your’s), we should also be circumspect when it comes to football this year as well.
Noah and BJD - definitely a snark.
The high of our good effort Saturday has worn off - and our futility is there in black and white for everyone to see. Really, this season can’t be defended on any level. We’ve gone from 2nd or 3rd place to last place in 2 years.
So far, Sidney Lowe’s tenure as a head coach at NC State is off to a very rocky start. (To put it in perspective, he’s done worse than Les Robinson.) This doesn’t mean that he can’t be a good or an effective coach for us in the future, but our men’s basketball team’s performance has been so bad that there is no rational reason for optimism. We are paying the price for a botched hiring process and hiring someone w/ no college coaching experience.
Lee Fowler - the rest of the ACC called and they want to offer you thanks for doing job slowly AND badly - nice combo!
E89 -Excellent point on the guards.
Noah, I think Grundy was being factitious about the “play in game” We win it by default. We should be playing the 13th team in the league for a tourney slot.
^^^We should be playing the 13th team in the league for a tourney slot.
Would that be ECU??? Oh &^%$#!!!
Anyone experiencing a “high” off a good effort in the loss against Duke really needs to try something a little stronger for a more potent high. Like cough medicine, for instance.
^ “I picked the wrong season to stop sniffing glue”
I agree Beowolf. the effort against Duke didn’t give me a high but pissed me off even more but it shows what our team can do if the effort is there. granted I think Duke is overrated this year and if they don’t hit 3’s they’re toast, but still, as Pete Gillen said, Duke is Duke.
The 11th seed plays into the 2/3 side of the bracket so it’s much better to be 11th than 12th. To get to 11th we need to beat Wake and have either UVa or BC lose out. I figure we have about a 50/50 chance to make 11th (but I’m not putting any money on it).
I’d never pull for the Wolfpack to lose and if we can run the table, in four games, and win the ACC, I don’t care how botched the season has been or win three games and get to the finals, even if we come up short.
We’ve underachieved badly, but in the end - for fans anyway - is to wait and see who leaves early and how many scholarships open up for 2009.
Two good recruiting classes for 2009 and 2010 can turn this program around in a heartbeat. We have some talented players, but the longer I look at this team the more I realize the talent is so unevenly distributed - the PF / C spot is deep, though Costner and McCauley underperformed, the ability to be better is there, while SF and SG were just Gavin and Courtney for most of the year, and PG was manned by reaching for transfers and a diamond-in-the-rough in Javi - I guess hoping the talent laden positions could perform to offset the deficincies in other areas, might’ve been hoping for too much.
Things to be happy about for next year: the improvement of Ferguson, gives us some depth at SG, which we lacked all year. The recruitment of Mays will give us some depth at guard. The return of Farnold Degand, combined with the improvement of Javi this year (even if he has peaked), gives us a competent (not spectacular) set of PG’s, so we don’t have to cringe when one of them has to go out of the game and the back up takes the floor. Basically the backcourt’s looking better, than what we had at the start of this year.
Hopefully Hickson comes back, Smith improves, and Horner gets his shooting touch back.
Personnel wise we are better off than we were at the start of this year and hopefully no one gets replaced by their Bizarro-world double next year, like Costner and McCauley seemed to be this year.
Losing a SF isn’t as tough to overcome as bad guard play, in my opinion and even if our SF isn’t scoring, as long as he’s rebounding and defending, we should be O.K.
For all the frustration I’ve had this year, that crazy hope-thingy is creeping back in and hopefully next year won’t be so bad.
^^concur, but my point is that I don’t see much difference between the 2/3 side of the bracket and the 1/4 side. I haven’t studied it that close, but it’s still up in the air as to who gets the #1 seed — it will be decided on Saturday night, I guess.
Beo - I was using that term somewhat tongue and cheek, but I wasn’t displeased w/ our effort. I was disgusted, but only because it proved just how badly we’d been mailing it in for the majority of our conference games this year. This is opposed to being disgusted w/ our effort in general.
Sorry, but I cant allow the effort in the Duke game overcome the disgusting season we have had so far. Wake Forest is a bubble team, we are a CBI classic bubble team. If they show up Saturday I’ll be glad because I want us to do well, but based on this season I cant expect anything like that.
^^^^will Degand be able to return next season at 100%?
If we win the play-in from 11th I see us playing Clemson, Duke, UNC-CH. If we win the play-in from 12th I see us playing UMd, UNC-CH, Duke. I like our chances better from 11th.
I experienced a brief high off the effort from the Duke game, that quickly transitioned into the dual hangover of a loss and another reminder that we should have a MUCH better record than we do.
i watched some of the duke game again - and was impressed with how gonzo threw off his defenders by changing directions and positioning his body. he still had some slip-ups, though. he may not be the faster guard, but he must be a quick learner. Lowe has done an amazing job with him this season. i just hope he’s learning quick enough to be effective in the Acc Tournament.
To poster who contributed:
“However, most of all, I want the staff to enter the off-season with a sense of desperation. I want them to be in pain, to the point of fearing for their jobs (as if Lee would fire them, HA!). I want them to completely revisit their ideas on off-season workouts, motivation, defensive schemes, offensive pace and team-first philosophies. I want Sid to consider staff changes, if necessary. This lousy season will have been a total waste if Sid doesn’t take a lot of the trouble to heart. We’re now entering year 3, it’s no longer about what we were in 2006, it’s about what Sid has made and will make us for 2008-2010.”
BJD: That’s a great paragraph right there. Couldn’t agree more.
I know that to not mix business with personnel issues was your intent, so this is in no one to point the finger at you for being off base.
It’s just reading the words “I want them to be in pain, to the point of fearing for their jobs.” and rationalizing that with the serious pain our HC has had to endure the past year makes me a little sick to my stomach.
Sorry, probably just me..
Does anybody know who we play in conference next year? I know we always play UNC and Wake home and home every year.
They set the matchups years in advance, I think. I looked for a link but couldn’t find it.
“..well, shit, I don’t know what I’m going to do. But it’s going to be a very damning sign for Lowe.”
Noah, I enjoy reading your comments on most everything on this site. They’re errr… provocative. Seriously, $h!tty or not, we all know the just of what your going (to do) and how you will communicate it.
Your post about the disdain you feel for HC Lowe are beggining to read like Jack Nicholson’s charater in “The Shinning” book drafts.
im with noah on that, there needs to be a shake up with the asst coaches. With Towe and Strickland at the front of the line. He needs to get a strength and conditioning coach, and some new blood on the bench. or it prob will cost him his job
This team should have done better than it did, but this team did NOT have the talent to finish 3rd in the conference this year.
This was a team composed mostly of players who had one great run at the end of last year led by a 4-year starting point guard LEADER.
Without that leader, this team pulled a “Wake Forest without Chris Paul” tumble. That Wake Forest team, btw, had a lot of talent, including a dagger shooting guard, and an experienced college coach.
So, do the math. Subtract your LEADER and POINT GUARD. Subtract OUTSIDE SHOOTING Add in a potential superstar but inexperienced freshman center. Add in cockiness over one short run to end last year culminating in a 4 loss prediction. Add in overhype and overblown expectations from the media keeping the players reading their press clippings all summer rather than working to get better. Add in a couple key injuries. Add in 2 players recruited for their supposed “character quotients” not welcoming a center who could truly help the team win more than 5 ACC games as was done on “character quotient” kids’ watch the year before. Sounds like a train wreck to me…
(Again, this team should have done WAY better than it did, but let’s don’t fool ourselves AGAIN into thinking that adding a center who can’t pass to himself somehow makes up for the lack of experience and leadership at the point. That’s fuzzy math…)
The only bright side would be if ALL of the returning players spend the offseason thinking about their last place finish and reading press clippings about how terrible they were and come back with a vengeance next year.
I agree that Gonzales is starting to develop a signature move with his change of direction and change of speed. Just like in the old days with Corchiani, it shows that the best point guard is not always the fastest guy on the court. I always enjoyed what I considered to be Corchiani’s signature move, getting a defender behind him and then stopping on a dime with the dribble and making the defender crawl all over his back, drawing the foul. Seemed like he did that 2 or 3 times a game. I would like to see Gonzales shaking himself loose for a layup 2 or 3 times a game.
^^^^im with noah on that, there needs to be a shake up with the asst coaches. With Towe and Strickland at the front of the line. He needs to get a strength and conditioning coach, and some new blood on the bench. or it prob will cost him his job
Count me as one that totally DISAGREES. You can’t lay this on the Assistants…Towe and Strickland both have alot of experience. My friend went to a practice and mentioned that Strickland was the most vocal/active coach on the court during practice. Lowe knows what he’s doing, and he should make personnel changes as he sees fit, but how do most people feel about a CEO that fires his managers while he still collects his bonus paycheck at the end - thus putting the blame on those under him. Ultimately, it’s Sid’s team, and unless there are other circumstances, Coach Lowe should evaluate each member of the Staff, and if he deems it necessary, make changes.
For any of us to try to speculate on who should/shouldn’t be fired is quite over-the-top IMO. Trying to be nice, but it’s a bunch of ^&(%$. Look at the development of Javi — do you think that’s ALL Coach Lowe — the Head Coach. Two other former PG’s are on this Staff, Towe and Strickland, both of which have worked individually with Gonzalez, I’m sure. Until we have concrete evidence that ANY of our coaches isn’t up to par, we should not be calling for any dismissals, etc. That being said, I don’t think there is such a thing as being “too in-shape or too strong.”
VT,
The personal stuff for Sidney has been wrenching. I feel for him. However, I don’t feel that it’s appropriate to read those issues into the topic of basketball performance b/c there is absolutely no way to know the degree of the impact.
In commenting on “pain”, I’m being mildly hyperbolic and reactionary. There is a hypothesis in my mind (and others I’m sure) that part of our issue this year stemmed from a staff that was over-confident during the off-season following last year’s red-jacket charge. Signs include the apparent lack of physical prep for the team as well as the rumors that some staff were asking about raises after a single season pass at the NIT. Anyway, that hypothesis may not be valid but, as a bit of a test, I do want this coming off-season to be diametrically opposed. I want to see the product that comes from a staff that is fighting for respectability, if not for their livelihoods. I don’t think that’s particularly cruel on my part (nor important as I clearly have no influence on the situation). Still, I think it might be the only way to find out what we really have working for us on the bench.
“Your post about the disdain you feel for HC Lowe are beggining to read like Jack Nicholson’s charater in “The Shinning” book drafts.”
Don’t you mean “The Shining?”
Shhh! You wanna get sued?
No beer and no tv make noah go insane!!
But seriously folks. I’ve said my thing. I think I’ve gotten pretty good saturation with my message. I’ll say no more about what I think ought to be done with Lowe’s body. I mean I mean, what should be done with his employment situation.
ShootingGuard - Right on the money! Everyone watches us play well in a few games last year and thinks we are loaded with talent. We have SOME good athletic talent, but very few have good basketball talent. Look at our overall ball handling and shooting ability. And the shooters we do have completelydisappear for long periods.
Some of our young guys appear to be better basketball players and have better basketball IQ and that should pay off once they get the needed experience and PT.
No doubt we should have played much better this year and won more games. But don’t confuse that with having the same or better talent as even the top 6 or 7 teams. And we are probably last in the league in overall guard talent (though Javi may be bringing us up a notch).
On other topics…
Shooting Guard, I agree that this team was never going to be #3 in the ACC and that Degand’s injury hurt in a meaningful way. Ditto for your character comments and desire for a hungry off-season.
E89, I don’t necessarily feel that the staff needs a shake-up. I do feel that Sid is responsible and needs to do whatever he deems necessary to get things straight and that right now. If he has any concerns about his staff, he should know their importance to on-court performance and he should be willing to take action. the objective concern over the staff comes from the more objective point that, aside from Harris’ recruiting, this is not a very accomplished group. It doesn’t mean they suck (e.g. Duke’s has a staff of yes men who have no meaningful experience outside of Cameron and is hasn’t killed the goose yet) but it may mean that they aren’t the perfect staff for a college newby like Sid.
Much as it might have cost us 11th place, I have to admit I was pulling for UVA last night. Singletary earned that victory through shear guts and determination. A good roll model for our point guards to emulate.
“Subtract OUTSIDE SHOOTING ”
we have 3 players shooting over 42% from 3 in ACC play.
DO NOT GET ME WRONG. I am not for firing Sid. He has only been here 2 yrs, as everyone knows. This season’s results come from bad coaching. The things that they struggled with are things coachs are suppose to fix, BOTTOM LINE. I just hope he can learn from this, and maybe he will be a better coach next year.
vtpackfan - I think you’re reading something into his statement that isn’t there. No one would wish the pain that Lowe has had to endure to anyone. I think he’s talking about the pain that comes from exhaustion of running, lifting and playing the game to a point of exhaustion.
E89 - I don’t know enough about any of the staff to finger point. I do know that all 3 of the coaches of our staff had losing records before coming NC State. I do know that what I’ve seen this year represents a breakdown on so many levels, that something significant needs to change in the off-season if we’re to expect something different.
Shooting guard - I think some of us were expecting more this year because we thought that there’d be some improvement of the 5 returning guys this year. We figured that w/ a staff including 3 former PGs, we’d be bringing in guards good enough to have a good season.
Some of us weren’t happy w/ the effort for most of last year, and stupidly figured we’d see that kind of effort most games this year. (I fall in that category.)
I don’t buy the agrument that what we’ve seen is a direct result of a lack of a great PG. We’d definitely be better, but in those 9 conference games where we lost by double digits…I’m just not sure that 1 PG would have resulted in us winning any of those 9 games.
I still don’t see any signs that Sidney believes he’s done anything wrong this year - and that’s what worries me most.
Once again, Virginia never was that bad. If you’d seen some of their close games, you would know they were due for some wins sooner or later. Who knew we were due for a 0-for in the last 7-8 games, though? Still holding out h@pe that we can beat Wake. Also would like to win the ACCT and STILL have the sense of desperation going into next year, as talked about above.
As a proponent of the “it’s mostly our guard play” argument, I’ve been glad to see Javi develop, too, but he still has yet to hold his own against the elite of the league, i.e. Singletary, Rice, etc. If we make it to an ACCT game where he will face one of these guys, it will be interesting to see if he’s finally up to the challenge.
Fully understood. I agree, also.
As far as all the “shake up” talk goes, the only person who needs to be replaced right now is LEE FOWLER. If you don’t like the coaching staff in year 2, fire the guy who totally blew the coaching search first. Then, the guys HE hired all by himself will get the message from the new AD that they will be next if there is not improvement.
BJD: I like that idea very much.
Packgrad93,
Good numbers. Unfortunately, we stunk for most of the non-conf schedule, and, while we seem to have improved our shooting mostly at home down the stretch, the results don’t really show up so much due in part to the competition we have faced at home even while having better shooting from JG, etc.
“Shooting guard - I think some of us were expecting more this year because we thought that there’d be some improvement of the 5 returning guys this year. We figured that w/ a staff including 3 former PGs, we’d be bringing in guards good enough to have a good season.”
Agreed. Unfortunately, as far as the guard situation goes, the staff did not really have the timeframe window to bring in anyone great, thanks to Chris Wright. Degand was brought in as insurance and backup for Chris Wright. Chris Wright’s second reversal right at signing day really set us back, especially since it screwed us up with the Ole Miss kid. Johnson was brought in to be another athlete and potential point guard option (for those Herb lovers trashing this move, keep in mind that Herb recruited Johnson to the bitter end only to see Pearl pull him away). Gonzalez was brought in late as insurance as it became pretty clear that Johnson was not likely to be an answer at point. Jai Lucas was never going to come here. Degand’s injury was not the difference between being great or good, but it definitely hurt badly—how much we will never know. November will tell us whether the Sid regime will only be able to struggle and fight to be mid-tier good with little margin for error keeping us out of the cellar OR whether we can be really good. It is not about getting one potentially stellar player like John Wall (just like Wilkins, Hodge, JJ, or anyone else can’t carry it all)—it is about getting multiple talents at the same time such as a Wall + Brown backcourt with a strong front court and enough lead talent to allow a role playing shooter like SW being able to do what he does best, rather than asking too much of your role players (like the Evtimov’s, JG’s, etc. of the world).
Shooting Guard - Good post. I agree w/ you 100% on LAF. As a matter of fact, I think you’d find universal agreement on this board and most on that [Lee Fowler]confounded[/Lee Fowler] internet. Unfortunately, I don’t think our egghead Chancellor shares in this opinion.
BJD: You’re exactly right on that front. There is zero proactiveness re athletics coming from the Chancellor.
FWIW - I don’t really hold this staff’s feet too much to the fire for missing on Warren or Wright. I have been critical (and will continue to do so) of their apparent refusal to bring in a good combo guard. I also think that the staff hasn’t been creative enough w/ our line-up structure - like playing Grant at the 4 spot or going super big w/ a zone D.
I also haven’t written off Marques Johnson yet (as a matter of fact, I said this in another post yesterday)- I think we’re using him in a position he’s ill-suited for right now - . Maybe next year we’ll see him at the 2 or 3 spot. He also is OK in my book because he apologized to the fans.
I may end up with egg on my face but I’m predicting a loss to WF Saturday and a loss in 1st round of the ACCT. This season just needs to be put out of it’s misery. At this point, I’m trying to keep my expectations low and my acceptance high.
Crazy talk= MJ out of position? yes if he sees the court he is out of position!
Great Talk= Fire Fowler yes for sure! But any AD worth their salt would not come aboard with this current BBall Staff in the house.
The first thing a new and competent AD would do is clean house.
an aside not being involved in the big 10/acc challenge I can’t wait to see who we schedule instead? perhaps NJIT?
good to see shootinguard around. i always enjoy his insight.
Perhaps you are right about Sid not needing to fire any of his assistants. But it is just really frustrating to see the poor fundamental and how out of shape these guys have been all year. it has to be someones fault.
also, are you saying that we should know by next novemeber whether or not Sid can right this ship? b/c i dont see much changing between now and then. nothing of imprt is coming in next year that would make me think we will be exponentially better. I dont think Degand is the answer, and i dont think Javi is it either. WE NEED A PG! I think Sid needs to bring in a good PG and now.
And for a final question to shootinguard. do you have any knowledge of or have any inclinations that we will have any defections this yr? is JJ for going pro? is Costner destined for Euro Ball? Does marques johnson realize he cant dribble with his left hand and transfer to Presbyterian? are Tracy smith or Johnny Thomas disenfranchised with the program and thinking of transferrring? any word on anybodysd future not being with NCSU next yr?
speaking of, noone on here has mentioned how terrible JJ’s hands are. he bobbles more passes that need to be caught cleanly so he can go straight up with the rock for the jam. And they all appear to be good passes, he just cant get the handle on it. IMO, he is a long way from playing in the NBA. and as has been discussed here, that doesnt really mean much. as getting a payday from the NBA and PLAYING in the NBA are 2 totally seperate beasts
Last is probably the better chance at a tourney run, because Duke is gonna bet UNC Saturday and end up in first. We finish last and we likely see VT and Md in some order on Thursday and Friday, and then Duke Saturday. Hope Clemson beats UNC, and hope we have another miracle run in us.
I for one would like this miserable season to extend, so that we can have much needed extra practices and something of a cherry on top of this crap-sundae they served up this year.
I don’t think our team, or media and us as fans for that matter, would duplicate the unrealistic expectations going into next year. I’m certain I wouldn’t.
Do any of you HC Lynchers need extra rope or perhaps some tar and feathers? This is PATHETIC. I was at the Coaches show last night. Sid is feeling the pain. He does NOT need all the Monday Morning PG’s telling him that we lost and that he is going to be castigated (perhaps castrated)…
He, off the air and record, was furious about the officiating and has taken steps, within the ACC, to protest and express his concerns.
Perhaps all of you want the mealy mouthed Calipara of Steve “greaseball” Lavin to come in. You will NOT get a HC like you want with Lee “I THINK I know BB - it is the game where they use the ROUND ball, not the funny one with points on each end” Fowler.
The demise of WP Sports, for those of you in diapers or on “recreational chemicals” during the mid 80’s started with a hatchet job by a maverick author, a “Dan Rather” piece(s) by the N&O and finally the capitulation to the Admin and Faculty (Brother Monteith, whereforth art thou?). After that, it was over. It will take a NEW Chancellor and a NEW AD and a NEW “Faculty Oversight” committee to restore (put Humpty back together again” what was there.
The Jimmy V ‘83 run was probably a lucky streak…and I know that…but we STILL have it to talk about. I have NOT heard the UNX or DOOK folks talk about their runs…they are forgotten. CBS keeps the memory alive. I suspect that, 25 years from now (and I HOPE I’m around to see if my predictition comes true) they will STILL rank the ‘83 team’s accomplishments as one of the greatest sports stories of all time.
OK…Let’s all take a deep breath. Maybe the Nay Sayers will go away or get a virus…
I will be pulling for the pack at WF and will be in Charlotte cheering them on. I have NOT made arrangements to sell my tickets to the Dookies or the UNX’ers…as a matter of fact, the bookies are betting that BOTH UNX and DOOK are NOT in the final game…
Who know…we may be there again..and if so, I will dwell on the positives…not be whining and crying about what could have been…
GO PACK
The only cleaning out that needs to be done is to get rid of the negative jerks who don’t know squat about basketball or our program other than perhaps watching a few games on tv. Coming into the season there were posters on other boards who warned of being over optimistic…wait until you see how the team reacts to having a green PG trying to replace Atsur who was mature and had four years of experience in Raleigh as well as several years of international experience. Just when we appeared to be starting to gel a bit, down goes Farnold and a really green PG now has to take over.
Without an experienced, good PG how could anyone expect us to beat teams like unc-ch, dook, Md, etc. Only the foolhardy expected it. Most of us wanted it.
On top of inexperience, we had a crop of players left over from a previous regime that ran a different offense from what Sidney intended to install. Certainly there would be problems from the change but it had to be attempted.
It will have to be done next year also as we will have pretty much the same crop of players other than GG and probably JJ plus the addition of the two new recruits. The PG position will have to improve at least to the adequate level but hopefully to the good level. Once there is a floor leader who intills confidence then the team will have a chance to improve and start the trip to where most of us want them to reach.
If anyone wants our program to improve and return to the top three of the ACC then join in and support the program; otherwise, leave. This ignorant sniping does no one any good unless it helps some feel like they are important…sorry but you are not. Most of us contribute what we can and support as we can…that is all we can do unless we are named the same as the heavy rollers and belong to their family trees.
^b,
Agreed. Even if we won the ACCT, most of us fans should’ve learned our lessons about inflated expectations. It would be nice to end with a good run, just so GG gets to leave on a positive note.
“Coming into the season there were posters on other boards who warned of being over optimistic”
…
“If anyone wants our program to improve and return to the top three of the ACC then join in and support the program; otherwise, leave.”
So the problem with the NCSU basketball team this year…according to you…was the tone of the people posting on the message board?
legacy - I can only speak for myself. The reason why I was so disappointed this year had nothing to do w/ our talent - or lack thereof.
If I believed our guys were well-prepared and are giving maximum effort, I’d feel really good about the future. If I see that early next year, I’ll probably start to feel good about our future again.
Finally, I’m waiting for someone on our staff to take accountability for where we are now. Things often get worse before they get better - hopefully, that’s all we’re going through right now is some growing pains.
The Positive : Starting next season we have no where to go but up. I think the mix might actually be better next year depending on who leaves and who stays. I was very encouraged by the play of this team saturday. My hope is that coach Lowe had something to do with what happened on saturday. My fear is that he did not.
One thing about NC State fans and graduates. We support NC State athletic through thick and thin.
“If anyone wants our program to improve and return to the top three of the ACC then join in and support the program; otherwise, leave”
so youre saying that dissent is not welcome? what is this nazi germany? i love NCSU sports, but i, along with many others, are just extremely troubled by what weve have seen this yr.
I’m certainly glad to see ShootingGuard back in the mix aswell. He has his own agenda of why he hasn’t been popping up more, but my suspecion is that he saw the writing on the wall forever ago that the commentary here on issues basketball would sink in quality in equal proportion to the actual play on the court.
I feel that way reading this thread. I’ve read stuff like “So far I’ve haven’t seen any signs that Lowe gets that things aren’t well”, and JJ Hickson is an uncordinated bafoon.
Come on folks, playing (posting) to the competition (team results) just shouldn’t cut it. Even the worst of the HerbHate days were never as gloom and doom as people are making this out to be, IMO.
Oh, and in case I missed a post above, there is a tribute on WRAL @ 7:30 honoring the Cardiac Pack of ‘83. Maybe after watching it some of you will think twice about putting HC Lowes head in a vice grip if he doesn’t say/do what we want.