“It is like going to the dentist without any novocaine.” - Gary Hahn describing NC State Basketball
State shot 1 of 11 from the three point line in the first half and 5 of 7 in the second half
NC State takes the court today against a Presbyterian College team with a horrible record but who have been playing well of late. The “Hose” were tied at Wake Forest mid-way through the second half and lost at Georgia by only ten points. A full preview can be found here.
Despite a lot of speculation that Marques Johnson has supplanted Javi Gonzalez as the Wolfpack’s starting point guard, Coach Lowe says that Gonzalez will start today. Of course, it doesn’t matter who starts; it matters who plays the most and who is on the court when the game is on the line.
Gonzalez had 17 minutes of playing time in each of the last two games. He has hit 4 of 22 shots from the field this season (18.2 percent) and has nine assists and 14 turnovers.
Additionally, the N&O has featured Marques Johnson in an article today.
“My first game, I was extremely nervous,” Johnson said this week. “I hadn’t been in a competitive atmosphere like that in a year. Once the second half came along I started to feel better, and [against] Western Carolina I definitely felt a lot more comfortable.
“I think I bring a lot, with my size, at point guard. I know what type of team we have, so I don’t necessarily have to … score all the buckets. Whatever we need at the time, I’ll bring.”
Elsewhere, it is a big day for ACC Basketball as some of our mid-tier and lower tier teams have the opportunities to do well for themselves and the conference. For example, BC hosts Kansas and Maryland travels to UNC-Charlotte.
(Dear BC fans…in the ACC we pull FOR each other in these types of games.)
For open thread-like comments please use Friday’s Open Thread
Are they really the Hose? The Presbyterian Hose? Please clarify this for me. Its too good to be true.
Iirc, they are the Blue Hose of Presbyterian College.
In Lowe’s presser yesterday he kept saying he wanted finishers on this team and was not so interested in starters. He specifically mentioned how JJ was a finisher in the last game and in the prior 3-4 games he was on the bench in the final 3-4 minutes.
I think we see a good game start to finish tomorrow. I expect about a 18-20 pt win.
Yes, the Blue Hose… with the e!
are they nappy-headed?
Good article on Johnson, he knows his game and he seems extremely competitive and hates to be in 2nd place, something that he’s going to face all the time in ACC play. I see a lot of Atsur in him, except for a little bit more quickness and a couple of extra pounds. I think his size will help out a lot come ACC time. He says all the right things just like Sidney it seems.
Anyway, if this team buys into Lowe’s philosophy of “Start hard, finish hard” then it’s not out of the question that we could have our first blow out in a long time. This team outscored WCU by 21 in one half, they would have outscored them by the same in the first half because WCU would have never have a chance to throw up 10 bombs. We’ve seen flashes of what this team can do, now, lets see them do it for a whole 40 minutes.
Things to look for:
Javi/MJ shooting a little bit more, they don’t have to score 20 points (Although if they did it would ease our minds I bet), but if both of them hit a few jumpers I’d be pleased.
Continued rebounding excellence, especially against a midget team.
Less than 10 turnovers. It’s a lofty goal, but the hose don’t force a lot of turnovers and seems they turn it over all the time.
Force more than 20 turnovers. Another lofty goal, but as stated before and as sectionsix put it, if we don’t make this happen this game, it’s never going to happen.
Costner finding out where he left his shooting touch. Horner/Javi as well.
40 minutes of hard basketball. This shouldn’t be a foul fest as the Hose have a pretty low free throw rate allowed, so it’s going to be a good benchmark for our offensive/defense flow. However, since they have that low FTR, I can see Hickson just walking all over them because that means that they aren’t fouling bigger post men. Which leads to…
Another career night for Hickson. 25 pts/10 rbds. I’m going to call it.
Holding the hose to <30% FG. This isn’t a lofty goal considering we’re #1 in the nation for height (and probably length) and they’re #330 or something. Add in the Defense pep talk… and barring the whole team of Hose shooting like Reddick, and theres no reason we can’t do that.
I’m feeling good after the defense pep talk Sid gave, 82-56 NC state.
Oh, and I feel like I’m at a club or something but… Bring on those hose!
Oh, and in other ACC news… Boston College is currently getting DE-stroyed by Kansas. 59-40 with 12 minutes to play. They’re fighting hard to get back in the game though.
Well, sure sounds like the table is set for a major blowout, but I wouldn’t be too suprised if Coach Lowe doesn’t allow it to happen. I don’t think anyone really needs to see JJ with 40 points against PC to know that kid is going to play hard every game. Costner and McCauley, each need some work, but I wouldn’t expect to see them out there for a major portion of the game.
This should be the type of game to mix in Trevor Ferguson early on, just to see if he is showing signs of gaining confidence. I’d really like to see the bulk of the minutes going to Horner, Smith, Harris, Gonzales/Johnson, with Courtney Fells forced into shouldering the responsibilty of being the “go to guy” for the entire 40 minutes.
That’ll never happen, but I hope Lowe doesn’t hesitate to quickly pull anyone who is not playing hard.
in case anyone else is curious about the Hose:
http://www.presby.edu/bluehose/history.htm
GO PACK!!!
Audio: http://www.wifmradio.com/
Click on “listen live” in the top right corner.
Guys, we aren’t going to blow ANYBODY out without a point guard to push the tempo,; with the kind of defense we play; and with the set offense that we play.
Thank you tooyoungtoremember!
Living in the UK I don’t get an opportunity to hear them often but 100.9 is coming in loud and clear. I had hoped 101.5 would stream the audio for all the games, but they aren’t. I haven’t had much luck with the Pack Pass thing.
Now if we could only shoot …
“the Blue Hose are leading at the break????????????????????”
AAARRRGGGGHHHHH!
We are losing to Presbyterian College (1-17) by 3 at halftime…
What the hell is the mindset of this team?! They have lost to ECU and New Orleans. They CANNOT assume that they will win ANY game EVER.
I am in the arena. There were boos at the halftime horn. We have SEVENTEEN f-ing points at the half. We are actually defending pretty well, but the offense has gotten even worse. I didn’t think it was possible, but it is. Javi is showing why he usually never shoots, Costner has bricked two of those wing threes he sucks at.
The green team is dominating the halftime Special Olympics game.
uhm… this is retarted. what the heck is going on with this team? Im confident they will end up pulling off the win, but 17 in the first half againt PC? We are an ACC team right?
i hate our team right now
I’m usually the last one to crack on the team, but this is pitiful. With all their (supposed) talent - point guard or not - they should be able to put up 80 on the Hose without batting an eye. At this rate the ACC is going to eat them alive.
Why are we never prepared? It all falls upon the coaching staff!
At least Mike Glennon looks awesome and it seems we might have found a starting QB.
I also hate our team. im at the game and would rather be anywhere else. they deserve to be booed. we have herbs garbage offense and no defense. we walk the ball up the court every time and let them set up in their zone, which we can’t do anything against. a three year old could figure that when we push the tempo were getting better shots and yet clowe is not changing anything
i’ve only kept up with stats first half (thanks for the audio link; i’ll try to listen to the second half); it looked shave-your-dog’s-butt-and-teach-him-to-walk-backwards ugly. 17 points. Wow. A new low (no pun intended; seriously).
Run Forrest!
Yeah, taking it a lil’ bit too far with the Forrest Gump crap!
I don’t hate my team… ever.
Dissappointed at times, yes. Hate- no. I wouldn’t put this performance all on coaching either. Unless you are prepared to put every win square on the coaches shoulders. The players have to do their jobs as well.
The good thing is 20 minutes are left, and the cream usually will rise to the top. Let’s hope the cliche applies today. GO PACK!!
Well we’ll be well tested in close game situations…
We are more likely to sprout wings and fly than extend a lead. No sugarcoating things - we flat out suck.
Score?
3 point lead with 4:30 to go. Most embarrassing loss in school history is very possible.
OK, we reached our 10 turnover limit. Now let’s NOT reach the 4 loss limit!
OK Grant, time to take over. Put the team on your back like the senior leader you are.
By the way….have you guys done your duty and clicked on some of our Google ads today?
43-38, 1:38 to go
To paraphrase Apollo Creed’s trainer, in Rocky I: “They don’t know it’s a damn show - they think it’s a damn game!” This “play to the level of the competition” mentality has gotten way out of hand. The Hose shouldn’t even be able to stay on the court with State, and yet…
45-38, 52 seconds, Pack at FT line
Duke and Carolina in our back yards, nothing but lunatic fans with unrealistic goals, AND, last but not least, we don’t have a point guard. Are those all excuses, or what?
Seventeen points in an entire half of basketball, against a team with only one 6′7″ player. That is inexcusable in my book. What other point guard would you rather have WALKING THE BALL ACROSS THE TIMELINE anyway?
FIFTY POINTS! WOW!!! What a juggernaut.
Does this mean we are worse than Wake? (beat PC by 12 -but tied at the 10 min mark)
Final:
NCSU = 50
Hoses = 43
Did I miss something? This is the men’s team, not the women’s team, right?
Hey, I wonder if our men’s team could beat our women’s team? I guess the women would be at a disadvantage, what with being used to playing with the smaller ball & all (um … basketball, that is).
It’s the weekend… I’m going fishing…
“This “play to the level of the competition” mentality has gotten way out of hand.”
But shouldn’t every game be a cupcake so we can win out OOC and get in the tourney?
Feel free to delete SFN, I’m feeling frisky today… first day off after tossing in 3 chem papers
To be fair - Wake didn’t beat PC by much more and were tied late in the game. Georgia beat them by only 3 points more than NC State. Top 20 Clemson was leading them by only 3 points in the second half.
I still think that we have a LONG way to go and things are not looking very good…
In case anyone missed it:
Dennis Horner out with a high-ankle sprain. Will be out for NC Central as well.
I don’t know exactly why I have been graced with this special powers that I have, but I’d say go to the NC Central game if you can, I’m predicting a close game.
Don’t ask me how I know, it’s just a gift.
SFN: I am going to respectfully take the opposite view. I am going to predict our easiest win in a long time.
Glad I chose to spend the day cutting barbed wire off of my land, shredding my gloves, sweatshirt, and jeans in the process. Sounds like I had a MUCH more enjoyable day than anyone who watched/listened to this dud of a game.
The closer we get to 1/12, the more I dread playing uncch… this could be a “name your score” kind of game for them.
50 points?? I wish Lowe would take the shackles off those point guards. They have to look over their shoulder for Lowe to make a call on just about every play. They will never learn to read & react on their own.
THAT was painful.
No need to analyze, just pray you can forget it.
Lowe after the game:
“…our guys gave a good effort”.
Ugg.
Absolutely, completely inexcusable for JJ to only get 4 shots.
That’s the part of this season that’s disappointed me most about Sid’s coaching and game plan. How hard is it to just say “You damn well better not take a shot until JJ gets it down low!”?
This game was not difficult to dominate with the right game plan - I mean, if we’re not going to exploit our opponent’s weakness (in this case, size being a major one), what the hell is the coach for?
I don’t really care if we’re 10-3. I have a very bad feeling about where we are and our chances to have a solid season. There’s very little I’ve seen or heard that excites me or gives me any confidence about our ability to perform at a reasonably high level with any regularity.
I know he doesn’t want to hear it either, but is anyone going to tell me now that Gavin Grant, turnovers and all, cannot generate more offense/points, along with overall team intensity, by speeding the pace of the game and forcing the issue from the PG position?
Gary Hahn saying that PC at 1-19, “is still playing with heart and intensity”
I don’t know which team’s W/L record is more unfair.
there is no sense of urgency w/this team, Lowe is alway “tinkering with his lineup” and our guys “give good efforts”, it’s gonna be ugly when we hit conference. How can we only hang 50 on a 1st year D1 team that has won one game. You guys who were there, what happened with JJ, usually we can at least have him as a bright spot
“there is no sense of urgency w/this team”
Boy, does that bring back memories from days gone by. I said something similar to former Coach ” ” one time, and you’d have thought I was hitting on his wife or something.
I do not understand it at all, but that statement is just as true right now, and it’s very, very, disappointing.
The special olympics game at halftime was more entertaining than our game.
Gary Hahn said post game that the Pack “improved to 10-3.” I’m not sure “improved” is the operative word there.
redfred, it’s like you just keep waiting for the switch to be flipped, but instead it’s the same old, same old….. very frustrating
sorry if i missed this somewhere, any word on why Horner did not play and was in a black sweat suit the whole game? Also appeared to be limping (from the 300 section)
It’s a damned good thing that there aren’t any pictures in the standings. If there were, our team would look worse than Sandra Bernhard after a three day bender.
Wow, I didn’t think that my predicted score of the wolfpack would be the total amount of points in the game.
Before you guys throw the team away, Presby played outstanding, they didn’t take a play off, and their game plan was perfect against us. They played a packed in zone defense for a majority of the game and they executed it extremely well, basically closing up any hole for passing to Hickson.
There’s a reason the NBA banned zone defense for a while, because it’s BORING. It’s like watching paint dry, and that’s why todays game was not exciting at all.
Every possession whether on offense or defense used up the entire shot clock, Presby was exceptionally patient on offense, waiting for a good shot/lane to drive to appear as for the most part we played suffocating defense. A lot of their points came as the shot clock was winding down and they drove in with hopes of making a basket. It was basically NC State vs NC State as far as tempo goes, as both teams didn’t try to force turnovers or run the ball. It didn’t help that we couldn’t shoot a 3 to save our life in the first half, which only played into their defense. Thank whoever up in the sky that Javi/Fells hit some 3’s finally or we might be sulking after a loss.
That being said. Until we can consistently shoot 3’s, we’re going to suck it up every game unless an opponent graces us with man to man defense by forgetting to scout us.
Good games by:
Grant, Javi, Fells, Harris. Man, the more I see of Harris the more I like him. He plays with passion no matter how many minutes he gets and is a very good defensive player.
Everyone else just played average. Average will not win any ACC games.
“Guys, we aren’t going to blow ANYBODY out without a point guard to push the tempo,; with the kind of defense we play; and with the set offense that we play.”
Add to that:
We don’t have anyone, except Gavin Grant, who can take anyone toward the hole off the dribble.
We can’t shoot the ball from the outside. If Fells or Brandon doesn’t come out hot in a game, we are in big trouble. Lowe was so desperate today, he even brought in Tomato to see if he could loosen up the zone. Of course, Tomato couldn’t even move fast enough to get an open look against a zone.
We are a slow team, as most big man dominated teams are, and just lost our fastest player in Degand.
We can’t get any continuity in the lineups. You start a totally new point guard. Then, he gets hurt. Another guy becomes eligible, but he will take some time. Horner is one of the energy guys off the bench, and he’s out today, so your rotation gets changed around again.
We nearly got Hosed (someone had to say it).
ShootingGuard,
You’re right, I was thinking that while our point guards are not the best in the world, that they would be good enough to push tempo against basically a division 2 team. Johnson (Better half court offense guy IMO) didn’t get a lot of playing time, but that’s basically because the guy that he was defending was MAYBE 5′6 and he couldn’t stop penetration from that. Javi was needed because he’s just way more scrappy on defense than Johnson against such a small line up.
So, shoosting, what you’re basically saying is that we have a #2 guard that is an inconsistent, streaky shooter who cannot distribute the ball or score off of penetration.
Funny, but he never draws one iotta of criticism around here.
just got back …
first, it was a win … THANK GOD
it could have been an L
today in the first half it wasn’t that we weren’t ready to play, more to the point WE PLAYED THEIR GAME …
- our team still has close to zero concept of how to attack a zone … no dribble penetration; no outlet valve posted at the free throw line … our offense was content to sit back, pass it around the perimeter and take some bad shots … no attacking at all in the first half … even still, we wouldn’t play full court man-to-man or press and most importantly we wouldn’t even try to push the ball … we clearly would have had advantages if we tried to start a fast paced game … this speaks volumes about our young inexperienced point guards - the offense will only go as far as they will take it
- give presbyterian credit, they stalled the game and their zone was very effective … of course, our offense has adopted the dreadful habit of making ANY zone defense very effective
second half - many more positives
- it was clear that the message was received to get the rebound and go when available … we actually started to draw fouls in the second half
- rebounding was ok, defensive effort was fairly good … of course a big reason for the low score was presbyterian held nearly every possesion to the 5 second mark on the shot clock … and their zone
- perhaps the most important thing that happened offensively today was that javi hit two wide open 3’s in a row early in the second half … javi also closed out today’s game and had his best game of the season to this point
also to note, don’t blame sidney too much for the lack of jj’s productivity today … we just couldn’t get the ball to him against that zone … this is more on our perimeter players not effectively attacking a zone that anything else
finally, to me i have been thinking that either wake forest or virginia tech (or perhaps maryland) were the weakest / worst teams in the league … IT IS ABUNDANTLY CLEAR THAT WE ARE THE WORSE TEAM IN THE LEAGUE WHEN OTHER TEAMS PLAY ZONE DEFENSE AGAINSST US … there’s no other way to put it
until we learn how to get teams out of a zone defense it is going to be a LONG season … it starts with the guards
Thank God for the win … go pack
Benniebolton, JJ only got 4 shots because the Hose had 5 men guarding him. They played a very packed in zone and prayed for State to shoot the 3 which was quite effective especially in the first half. I took away only one positive from this game and that was the fact that someone must have told our guys that it was legal to try to poke the ball away from the guy they are defending. Haven’t seen the stat sheet but my guess would be we had more steals in this game than we’ve had all year.
thanks werncstate, must’ve been a truly painful game to watch if they were packing it in that tight and we cannot move the ball against a zone like that to get good midrange looks (or couldn’t knock them down) I don’t know about ya’ll, but I have a hard time giving PC credit for anything, sounds like we just didn’t perform, which is what bothers me, not how a 1-19 team executes
Hey, I’m no 3 star point guard but I can run, chew chewing gum, and dribble at the same time. I can also pass the ball to someone who is in front of, beside, or trailing me on the basketball court. I can also make more lay ups than I miss. Just like ^Superstuff” said up there, I do not understand the restraints Lowe is putting on these kids or why he allows them to play soooo s l o w and deliberately.
If someone has figured how that deliberate style, that btw is clearly taking away the point guard’s ability to think on his feet, is going to help later or in pressure situations when everything isn’t scripted, please let know. There may be some strategy behind it, but I’d really love to hear a different opinion that could give me some hope right now.
It’s clear this team will play to the level of its opponent, no matter who it is. That’s all about leadership, both on the floor and from the coaches. I don’t think we have a leader and I don’t think we have a coach that has a “get after them” style. He’s a “fatherly” figure.
I understand that is his style. But tell that to Jim Calhoun, or coach K, or countless others who have won championships.
And I don’t care if he says they gave a “good effort”. I saw it with my very own eyes and they most certainly did not. That was inexcusable, just like ECU and New Orleans. We play like that in the ACC and we will be a doormat. That much we all know.
Get your asses in gear NOW or NIT here we come again.
9:34 left in the half, and the VCU Rams have matched our first half scoring output against the UNCW Seahawks.
what happened to the fire from late last year, Sid refuses to acknowledge the obvious problems this team has. I don’t get it and it’s getting old. There is too much talent on this team, didn’t Sid say before last season he was looking forward to letting them play, what the hell happened to that?
NIT???
Let’s not count our chickens just yet Wulfpack.
I remember watching the Sidney Lowe show after the ECU loss and my jaw dropping at how nonchalant he was about that loss. I wondered if it was just for tv, or hoped at least it was, but I want to see some intensity out of somebody
^54 and 57 — UNC’s second half output against Valpo and Nevada, respectively. Team’s we know that are better than the “Blue Hose”.
“I’m happy with the way the team’s playing,” Grant said.
Is this a nightmare? It almost feels like the twilight zone. Do they not understand that things are going to get ALOT tougher?
One week left… im scared, anyone else?
I played high school basketball at a small school. I bet 10 of us here could suit up and play this team close. I’ve never seen a team play down to the competition so badly.
I can’t dribble worth a damn with my left hand, I have no vertical whatsoever, I could maybe play 20 minutes before giving out and collapsing on the ground, but I can hit some 3’s… can I suit up for this SFN BB team?
I was there today, had good seats. We do play big ugly basketball and it is hard to watch against these small zone teams but big has an upside as well. Our defensive length makes it hard for them to get off good shots even though it looks like they’re moving better. We may not blow out anyone but I don’t see anyone else blowing us out either, not even Carolina. I was pumped when Javi hit 2 threes in a row, I think that loosened things up. If he and MJ can do just a little more of that we will look a lot different. We didn’t hit anything the first half and 1 foul was called. It was weird.
^Um, does the name Michigan State ring any bells?
From gopack:
“The low-scoring, fast-played game was unusual, especially since the Wolfpack (10-3) wasn’t whistled for its first foul until just 12:50 remained on the clock. For the entire game, head coach Sidney Lowe’s team committed just five fouls against Presbyterian’s deliberate, ball-control offense.”
What the hell is that?
It’s like I said, and was disagreed with earlier in the season, fouls are part of the game, just like dribbling. But that’s only when you’re forcing the issue.
I didn’t see or listen to the game, but the fact that this game was close was about as surpising as Dan Morgan leaving a Panthers game w/ a concussion.
We appear to have gone from a coach who treated every equally - and thus came up short in a lot of big games 4 a coach who thinks some games are A LOT bigger than others.
He’s right, of course. However, it’s fairly bothersome when you can’t blow out a team that YTD has 1 win.
If we somehow make the NCAA tourney or if the guys Sidney brings in take each game a little more seriously, this game won’t really register in our memory. Unfortunately, there is no fire from this team against the “mid-majors” or “minors”. I guess that having fun thing is either taking place somewhere other than the b’ball court for these games or just isn’t happening. If I was wearing a State jersey, this performance and the ones against WCU, NO, and ECU would embarass me.
Finally, this staff brought in 6 players. You’d think that out of one of those 6, they’d look for a good shooter AND good ballhandler. While they don’t grow on trees, it’s probably easier to find a 2G w/ a decent handle and good outside shot than it is to find any other Division 1A b’ball player. Right now, the lack of a 2G to backup Fells and loosen up D’s is sorely evident. As someone else noted, we have exactly one player on the whole team who can create his own shot.
I won’t get too upset over this. Sadly, I expected a close game since we were playing the best 1 win team in America. This team has been turning up a notch against the teams from the big conferences…Hopefully, we can scratch out 8 or 9 wins vs. mediocre teams like FSU, Wake, GaTech, BC, UVa, VaTech, Miami, and UMd. But to do that, we’ll have to take those games a little more seriously than we took them year.
I guess the saddest thing is while at the game I find myself wishing half time would get here quickly in hopes there would be a scrimmage between teams from the Raleigh youth league, or in todays case, teams from the special olympics. The sad fact is these halftime scrimmages are more entertaining than the real game. I loved the chucker for the white team today, was glad to see him finally hit a three, and gave my loudest cheer when he finally passed the ball near the end of the scrimmage. Too bad the white team was so overmatched by the green team. No doubt it would have been a nail biter if State had to suit up against that green team. In fact I wish the Pack had played the green team today. With the green team’s running style it would have made for quite an exciting game I think.
“You’d think that out of one of those 6, they’d look for a good shooter AND good ballhandler.”
“…the lack of a 2G to backup Fells and loosen up D’s is sorely evident.”
I agree with those entire statements except for the “to backup Fells” part.
Is Fells a good ballhandler? Or a consistent shooter? The answer is NO, to both of those questions. I will not ever understand how a player who definitely can, but will not, gets the nod from the coach, but also receives a lovefest from the fans.
werncstate - Your statement brings back scary memories. I remember watching a halftime show during the Les Robinson era when dogs were jumping through hoops and making shots w/ their nose. Their execution was much more impressive than what took place before and after halftime.
^werncstate -
that was AWESOME when that guy FINALLY passed the ball !!!
every time he touched it the ball was getting launched from 3 … too funny!!!
choppack1,
Do any of those dogs have any college elligability left?
“Is Fells a good ballhandler? Or a consistent shooter? The answer is NO, to both of those questions. I will not ever understand how a player who definitely can, but will not, gets the nod from the coach, but also receives a lovefest from the fans.”
He gets the nod from the coach to play because he has no backup. (Fergy?) He gets the lovefest from the fans because he always makes one or 2 crazy dunks that make you wonder where that athletic ability was 2 minutes ago.
Case in point: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ichp7LX4mfA
If I was blessed with the ability to glide in the air for more than half a second, I’d damn well do that every time I could.
Personally I accept the fact that he’s either hit or miss on offense, but on defense, he’s generally always good chasing a player and running through screens. He’s one of our best defenders, which means he’ll get his time. If he’s missing assignments or not hustling on defense, by all means sit him down on the bench.
Trip - I’m w/ you. Fells has taken his role of defensive stopper to heart and I think it’s probably taken a toll on his offense. It doesn’t help that he’s a good “finisher” - and we rarely get the ball out on the break.
Redfred - For the most part, I don’t want to attack players - after all, they are not professionals. OTOH, the coach can take out the player.
I recall last year when you were ecstatic - as was I - about the way that we finished. However, I didn’t think that year qualified as an unmitigated success. The main reason was that all too often, it looked to me like the effort was lacking in some key games that could have made our ACC tournament run really mean something. I thought that the team and staff learned how hard you had to play during those last 2 tourneys…And to a certain extent - they have - we’ve beaten the type of non-conference team last year who gave us problems. However, our efforts against the stinkers of the world has really stunk.
It does not take a 5 star point guard to thrash Presbyterian, WCU, ECU, UNO, NCCU and other bottom of the barrel D1 teams. It takes heart, determination and a killer instinct on the part of the players and the coaches. I have said this before–this team does not have the killer instinct. It plays to the level of the competition and is unable to rout opponents with much lesser talent. I played on a talented team like this many years ago, and it is frustrating for the players, the coaches and the fans. We snapped out of it and started challenging ourselves when the coach started over and opened up every position during Christmas break and benched several starters until they started giving everything they had to give for the good of the team on both ends of the court. The season turned around and we are all thankful for that coach. He taught us a life lesson that translates into all aspects of our lives today. This is exactly what TOB did during our off-week and it worked up to the Maryland disaster. I love Sid and I love State and I will always love State, but this group of guys is not going to excel and reach their potential until their world is rocked. Those are the harsh facts. They need a team leader to call a players-only meeting and question their committment, and they need the coaching staff to get in their grills and read them the riot act. The good news is that the hardest working players were recruited by Sid(JJ and Javi), and he should never settle for any recruit with a poor work ethic and a lazy attitude in the future. Roy and K rarely have problems with attitude and work ethic because the rare underachievers at these programs “decide” to transfer after one year of hell.
Whoa Chop, I’m not attacking any players, you do not hear me bad mouthing players. What I said is that there are players with less natural ability than Fells, who play harder than Fells does throughout entire game, and those players DO get “attacked”, and that seems to be fine around here. But Fells, if he misses his first shot, well then, he’s not expected to do anything and he gets a free pass for the night. He can run to the corner and hide and nobody says a word. But you let Grant turn it over, or watch Costner miss one time too many from the other corner, and they get blasted.
But never Fells, he’s teflon.
I’m down on Fells because he will not take the responsibility or work hard enough to make himself available on the offensive end when the team needs him the most. Sure, he’ll jump out and take just enough wide open shots to get the team depending on him, then he fades away. He doesn’t drive and he never forces the action more than an ocassional once, or maybe twice, in any game.
Then there’s a guy a named Giles, the 6′5″ guard from WCU, who lit us up for 25, and there’s Drew Neitzel from MSU, he had a pretty fair game against us too, I think. So where’s this big “defensive stopper”?
redfred - thanks for the clarification - I see where your coming from. (And it bothers me when folks slam Grant, Costner, Ferguson, etc…)
As far as defense - I do think our team is guilty of poor technique in both individual and team D. Fells is susceptible to screens - as much as anything else because his teammates aren’t helping out like they should often times. He does try on D.
I can’t speak to his work ethic. I’ve been out of school for over 15 years - so I can’t see how he practices, works out or even if he goes to class every day. It does seem like he should be able to do more offensively - but ballhandling for him could be like a good jumper for Julius Hodge - God’s way of making things fair for the rest of folks.
“It’s clear this team will play to the level of its opponent, no matter who it is. ”
Not quite up to our toughest opponent Mich St!!
Might be a very bad conference start. We can only hope the guys decide they need to play against Carolina.
chop, I don’t know Fells’ personal habits either, I’m speaking about DURING the ballgames. I get aggitated about Fells because, in my humble opinion, he could do so much more and he’s letting slip away.
I’m frustrated right now and the plodding, over calculated and reactive, not proactive, attitudes of the players and apparently coaches as well, are just too much like the NC State that I thought we were finally ridding ourselves of.
A record of 10-3 or playing hard with a record of 7-6 at this point, it wouldn’t matter to me, but this is not at all what I expected.
Let them play coach!
For those who were fortunate enough to have not attended today’s game, this sums it up quite well.
http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaab/recap;_ylt=Ap4MK.7SB.BFvaclKrggRRqc07YF?gid=200801050411&prov=ap
Can we please atleast score 70 points against NC Central? Please? We’ve taken a 3 point bombardment from Western and Eastern north carolina… heres hoping Central North Carolina lays down and takes the beating.
Anybody realize that we’re lowest scoring team against Blue Hose of their 19 games so far.
Grant made a ridiculous comment to the N&O in today’s paper:
“They were all over J.J.,” Grant said. “I guess they heard about the last game and came prepared.” Wow, now we’re relying on other teams not knowing about JJ?
Then Courtney Fells explained that they played poorly because they didn’t have energy. How could they not have energy? I don’t get that as an explanation - they had much more energy last year when most guys were playing nearly 40 minutes a game. If you read the article, it’s a little scary because they seem to be complacent with what is going on and Grant is even a little miffed that anyone would complain about yesterday’s game.
http://www.newsobserver.com/sports/story/862984.html
I really wish we had someone besides UNC for our ‘wake up and play like you’re in the ACC’ game. I’m afraid they’ll kill us and we’ll say, ‘oh yea, we need to play harder now.’
The only good news is Sid understands the importance of the UNC game. Hope he can do something about it.
UNC is going to beat the ever lovin’ sh!t out of us with this kind of effort. Might rival the 50-point thrashfest they put on us in ‘93.
no, it doesn’t take a 5-star point guard to beat these teams, but it does take either in-game or halftime adjustments to the way the game is being played … this starts with the coaching staff AND the point guards
for an entire half, we played EXACTLY the game they wanted us to play … they stalled on offense, and we DID NOT attack or apply pressure at all … end result was us trailing 20-17 @ half … i’m not sure if this goes on the staff or the guards running the show or both … my money’s on both
i have my thoughts that coach lowe wanted to see if we could do ANYTHING AT ALL against that zone before turning up the pressure - but that’s just a thought … i really wish we would have started forcing the break and applying full-court man-to-man around the 10:00 minute mark of the first half … but whatever
at any rate, the main thing is that this team can not or will not execute effectively against a well played zone … MUST BE FIXED NOW
Does anybody remember coming right out of the gate, up emotionally, prepared and executing with precision, looking like a machine, going up ten or fifteen while the other team looks like they’ve never played the game before? Then, once the other team settled in, started to adjust and match our intensity, having no other answers or in-game strategy to switch over to? Winding up looking as lost and incompetent as our opponent did at the start of the game, and eventually losing the ballgame.
Well, compare that to a time where no matter the caliber of the opponent, or having far superior athletic ability and size, there doesn’t ever seem to be much precision or urgency involved at all. We can sort of reverse that scenario I talked about above, but just sort of. Somehow we are not doing much of anything right during the ballgames, but eventually we’re barely squeaking by at the very end. We just do not ever look good over any extended periods of time, certainly almost never until our backs are pressed against the wall, and this is against inferior, even 1-19 type, competition.
I’m not going to say which one, but I’m afraid one of those above scenarios, might be a little more easily remedied than the other.
I say put Johnson/Javi at PG, if the opposition has a true scoring threat at one of the guard spots, let 6′5″ Johnson try his hand at being the stopper. If Johnson gets picked, then they run into a taller GG. Put Grant at the 2 spot so that there is a constant inside/outside threat, then rotate the frontline in and out while making sure everyone is playing hard. Substitute the front line and decide early who’s getting PT according to the effort shown at the very start of the game.
Play Davis, Smith, and bring Fells in off of the bench in spots, see if he wants to play and contribute on every possession, if not, place him back down on the bench.
I do not know what’s happening during practices, but I would really like to see Lowe send a message to this group during a ballgame and not back down. If they come out flat AGAIN, play the subs and sit the starters. Let the players do the dirty work and make them get on each other’s backs until they ALL decide to start playing harder. Let them sit and watch until there is just barely enough time for them to come in and play their asses off long to squeak out a win against NC Central.
Okay i just got my name today cause i have been reading this blog for a while now and it gets frustrating reading some of this stuff. Yes people are quick to attack Costner and Grant but thats what happens when you assert yourself as one of the elite players on a team with a very active fan base. Now about Fells yes his offense is not always there but before you say anything about him remember the carolina game when he put up 20 and shut down key players for them. He is the best defender we have. I dont care if he doesnt have a great offensive night if he hits one or two threes and gets one dunk a night that is enough get the crowd back into a game. He doesn’t even need to score that much just a play to get the crowd into would be good enough for me. Yes giles put up 25 but fells did not guard him the whole time and when they set up triple screens and you dont get much help from your bigs jumping out they are going to hit some threes.
Now enough about that back to this game. Yea the Blue Hose are not a good team and yes we should have blown them out but if anyone thought we would you must not watch this team enough. These games are tune up games so you practice the way you want to run you offense in conference play. People are on here saying lets post up with MJ lets use our height that way. Now for this game thats a good idea but what good does that do us for conference play very little cause the only two guards i can think of we could do that against Rice from BC and lawson form UNC. In the ACC that wont work with Grant or Fells controlling the ball at the top trying to run the offense while MJ posts up. Okay run the ball and press we didnt do that last year in ACC play and i dont expect us to start this year. So do that during a tune up game would kinda take away the meaning of a tune up game. Yea Lowe might be guilty of not getting this team up for lesser opponents but everyone saying carolina is going to kick our butts is crazy. These guys didnt have a chance last year right but we beat them at home with in one at half at carolina until lowe had to leave. So i wouldnt be worried about that game its the lower ACC teams that everyone feels we should beat.
Now something i noticed in this game Javi no longer had a brace on his hand and i was yelling all game let him shoot take as many shots as you want. He started to get his shot back hitting two big threes and you could tell a lot of weight come off his shoulders after those shots went in.
snestar,
You said what I meant to say earlier. That is that people around here get on those players who are willing to put themselves on the line, force the issue and take the big shots, and who are not afraid to challenge or make a mistake. That is what bothers me.
As far defense goes, I do watch when I can, and I concentrate on positioning mainly. There is alot that a defensive player can do by just standing still in the right position, versus expending unneccessary energy by running around and looking busy as hell, but not ever cutting off any angles. That’s what happens with not only with Fells, but Grant is just as guilty of it to. Just watch closely next game, they may both have their chests pressed tightly to their man, which gives them no time to react to a change of direction, and they are generally playing D at the wrong angle. They’re exerting effort for sure, but it is ineffective and uneccessary effort, and they’re still giving away passing angles and lanes to the basket.
I was at the game. It was the classic Princeton Offense. Slow, deliberate, and no shooting at the basket unitl the clock reached 5 seconds. They had some nice threes early on and it was a chess game. There was only 1 foul in the whole first half. The refs realided in the second half that their whistles had peas and called a few more but still not a lot until the deliberate fouling by Presby at the end. I had to keep looking at the Presby bench to make sure that HWSNBN was not guest coaching.
As far as getting picked being a reason for other player’s ability to score easily on us, if the defender is in position, at the right angle and allowing himself enough space to react, it’s much easier to get around a pick, or call for help. You can’t do that if you’re only concentrating on being pasted tightly to the other players chest and not watching what’s going on around you. You may think it’s good defense because they’re always close to their man and they look busy as hell, but good defense is actually playing smarter with less wasted effort.
These young men are trying very hard to improve, maybe to the point of pressing a little.
Look, you don’t get recruited by any D 1 schools, and not many D II, at the guard position if you can’t make a wide open outside shot occasionally. The higher the level the more complicated and fautiging it gets because you have to play more intense defense and expend vastly more amounts of energy.
That said, these young men are biting the bit right now. It’s not coaching or scheming, it’s a case of the defense taunting us to take WIDE OPEN shots from the outside because they know we are a fragile perimenter team.
We are so bad in this key area that I feel bad for any member of the ‘83 national championship to have it’s 25 th anniversary tarnished by any association with this team.
Bo, the Blue Hose are a young program that seems to be able to hang around until very late in the games. Now, all they need is to do is learn how to type the letters, W,T,N, and Y, and they’ll be ahead of the curve.
I really would like to see some more emotion out of our squad, esp. Sid — I’m not saying go Bob Knight on anyone, but get fired up. I’d rather see him closer to Coach Knight than closer to his predecessor.
Off topic, but all the analysts I’ve heard this morning are putting the Chargers chances of winning on Philip proving he can be consistent and lead them in and through the playoffs — let’s hope he can, we gotta pull hard for our guy
I make no predictions about this team. I hope and pray we aren’t embarrased next Saturday against Carolina.
^Embarrassed? Against Carolina? In the season opener? And in their building?
That’s not unexpected, it’s a regular occurrence. And, it happens to teams that are much more focused and better than we are.
It’s the next NO, the next ECU, or the even the next Blue Hosers, that I’m worried about. Those are the embarrassments for us and the competition level that we’re playing at. The heels are in a totally different league right now.
Even if this team should show up from the onset, playing hard at UNC, and somehow makes a game of it, I’ll just be more confused, and probably more frustrated than I am right now.
UConn’s women’s team, with 42 points at the 3:00 minute mark of the first half.
Update, make that 53 at the half, for the LADY Huskies.
Off-topic, but more reason for frustration, although a boost for our RPI.
No. 17 Villanova 64, No. 13 Pittsburgh 63 (Yes, that team that beat Duke)
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=280060222
Yep, we CAN play good. Just against ranked teams.
Sorry to change the subject, but did anyone else find it strange how Lowe said in the pre-game interview that there were “two different stories” about what happened to Horner’s ankle? Anyone have any other info on that? It almost sounded to me like Horner thought he was intentionally tripped (which, of course, would not be a good sign for team solidarity). I hope I interpreted that the wrong way…
The official story was that Horner went for a layup and Ben tried to block it and came down on Horner’s ankle.
Chemistry isn’t an issue between Horner and Mccauley, they’ve always gotten along well.
“It almost sounded to me like Horner thought he was intentionally tripped (which, of course, would not be a good sign for team solidarity). ”
I heard it too and was curious. Nothing in what Lowe said envoked me to believe it was “intentional”, or that fista-cuffs were revealed.
It almost sounded like Ben was going too hard in a situation that didn’t warrant it. Yes, hustling and scrapping on D in practice is beneficial in many ways. But practicing hard fouls when your beat one on one is just plain stupid IMO.
So far McAuley has been playing alot like what we expected at the beggining of last year. Regressing individual athletes, and untimely injuries, does this just spell out Wolfpack basketball?
“Off-topic, but more reason for frustration, although a boost for our RPI.
No. 17 Villanova 64, No. 13 Pittsburgh 63 (Yes, that team that beat Duke)
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=280060222
Yep, we CAN play good. Just against ranked teams.”
Trip, you may or may not have been aware that Pitt lost their starting power forward for the season in the Duke game and lost their starting point guard (and best player) against Dayton last week … so, yes it does help our RPI some - but this is definitely not the same Pitt team that beat Duke … some good and bad there
Also, i love our players, especially the point guards who are doing their best and IMPROVING with each game played … i’m merely pointing out some problems with our zone offense (in my opinion) … This is not aimed at you, Trip - I just don’t want anyone thinking I hate ANY of our players as there have been some comments concerning attacking individual players
go pack
GT beat Presbyterian 77-64
It is always difficult to make comparisons of who beat who and by how many. Trip, we did beat ‘Nova and Duke did lose to Pitt. Pitt has now lost 2 key players from their team, so that is a different team.
I have said all year we are playing to the level of competition, and go back and red my posts - I said these 3 games were not guaranteed blow-outs (but they should be). I said we will probably win all three, but they will be surprisingly close.
I also said come Conf time, we will be OK. Sid will have the guys ready for UNC, but I am still preplexed how we can score 17 in a half against this team.
I’m just shocked and terribly disappointed in how we’ve played vs. the “give me” games on our schedule. We’ve been consistently horrid…I mean Les Robinson bad vs. these teams. UNO, ECU, WCU, Presbyterian.
I was OK w/ our effort vs. USC and Rider, but not thrilled. Cincy, Davidson, Nova and Seton Hall, pretty good. Let’s not talk about Michigan State.
Aside from Bill and Mary - who am I missing?
South Carolina was the other team…
SC State… actually… not SC….
Wufpup - I didn’t know about the star point guard, I knew they lost their PF though. So yeah, that isn’t as impressive anymore, but thankfully it still helps out our RPI which has taken a massive drop because of WCU and Presby.
We do have problems attacking a zone defense, but really the EASIEST way to defeat the zone is to hit your 3’s. There are other ways to defeat it