Live blogging was good mojo for last year’s ACC/Big Ten Challenge game with the Pack as an underdog. So, I’m game to try again. The odds aren’t as long tonight, and hopefully we won’t lose our PG before the 2nd commercial break again. Still, this looks like one of two “firewall” games designed to make absolutely sure the Big Ten doesn’t get whitewashed (GT at Indiana was the other). It sure would be nice to break through said firewall and give the ACC a decisive 6th win (we tip 15 minutes ahead of BC).
ESPN.com has a nice “Jimmy V Week” section featured prominently on its website. Give it a look before tip-off. We are always quick to point out the media when it gives us the shaft - we should also give credit where it is due. They also gave us a nice “Big Boy ESPN” slot for the first time in challenge history. Donating to the V Foundation is also a nice thing to consider at Christmas time. Cancer sucks.
I also remember from the Sendek-era first round NCAAT matchup that Spartan fans are generally a civil lot. Michigan State has alot in common with NC State culturally, and this is a natural “friendly” rivalry, if we could ever set it up on a more permanent basis, IMHO.
7:12 - OK, Jimmy V - I am two-thirds of the way to a perfect day now. Now, let’s have something to make me laugh.
7:16 - Poor defensive rebounding on the very first miss. 6-2 Spartans.
7:42 - what you are witnessing is a good, old-fashioned ass whipping. Nothing good to say about this whatsoever.
7:45 - They’ve tripled us up.
7:52 - There are only so mamy ways to say “Wow, this sucks” - so not sure there will be much substance to this live blog. If we cut it to 12 by halftime, I’ll be happy. I don’t expect to be happy.
7:56 - 37-15. Wow. Just wow.
Halftime - The Bosnian and the skinhead could beat us on their own tonight. Easily. Your halftime score: Michigan State 41, NC State 19. Thank God for the late Degand 3, huh?
8:19 - Earth to Lavin - the TV timeouts come every FOUR minutes now. Been that way for almost 20 years, IIRC.
8:23 - Don’t we have to be able to at least play defense OR rebound? You almost have to try to do neither.
8:27 - Keystone Kops is an apt description. This has moved into the embarrassing realm, since we didn’t even show a burst of pride coming out of the half. I don’t know what makes more sense - to put in the scrubs since the starters clearly won’t play hard and/or smart, or punish the starters by leaving them out there.
8:37 - Look at that, we played hard for almost 40 consecutive seconds! Back to lackadasical sucking. Spartans by 31.
8:50 - Tracy Smith can’t shoot FTs either, apparently.
8:55 - Smith’s tattoos don’t match his face. But he has scored now. Huzzah.
8:57 - The Hansbrough face in the promo looks like he’s being touched somewhere “special” - there’s that laugh V wanted us to have.
9:00 - Maybe it will look semi-respectable in the paper. But don’t expect a back-door cover, if you were dumb enough to bet on us.
9:02 - Forget that respectable score. Fells fouled out. I guess he did make it to the arena tonight after all.
9:09 - Kudos to BC (I can’t hate Al Skinner) for clinching the challenge. At least UNC won’t do it.
9:11 - Simon Harris time. Maybe he’ll hit somebody.
9:13 - What could make this night better? Javi turning his ankle in garbage time! Sparty only wins the second half by one. Your final score: Michigan State 81, NC State 58.
does anyone know what time they do the jimmy v speech tonight? is it before the game or is at halftime?
Everything I’ve heard said the speech was being played before, but don’t take that as a fact.
It looks like all of the ESPN channels are playing the speech at 7PM. At least according to DirectTV’s guide.
Yeah, game starts at 7:15, so that would make sense.
Speaking of the media shaft, did everyone see this particular version from Seth Davis?
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/seth_davis/11/28/hoop.thoughts/index.html
The Jimmy V speech will be shown on ESPN and ESPN2 @ 7:00.
Maybe we get some magic from the Jimmy V speech.
Go Pack
Vawolf82: I was just about to post that link. Man, this keeps getting better and better:
“Cristman blew the call, plain and simple. Not only did Cunningham make bare-minimal contact with Grant, it was not Cristman’s call to make. Since Cristman was the lead official on the play (meaning he was in front of the action on the baseline), he was not even supposed to be looking at the ball on that play.”
^^^The Villanova chain of command goes higher than I believed. Is the president of ESPN dating Villanova’s Chancellor’s daughter, or something?
Anyone surprised the spread is 10.5? Seems like a lot to me, so that probably means everyone should take MSU.
“Since Cristman was the lead official on the play (meaning he was in front of the action on the baseline), he was not even supposed to be looking at the ball on that play.”
If he wasn’t supposed to make the call, who the hell was, the ref in the back court?? Cristman was RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE PLAY!!
Idiots, they’re everywhere, and they have media jobs. First Packer, then Dykes, now Davis. NEXT!
Let’s ask J.P. Giglio to write an article on media bias in ACC basketball titled “The elephant in the room”.
By the way the college bb page on cnnsi.com only covers games involved top 25 teams, I would love to see a site that covers more indiscriminately. Like maybe RPI top 50.
where would the money….errr….interest be in that?
Jim Valvano’s speech sends me chills every time. That man was amazing.
why does Lavin keep saying we lack depth?
No depth?? Guess the announcer still thinks HWSNBN just left! Maybe not playing well together, but no depth??? Sure can’t compare it to last year!
It is really amazing that Lee Fowler tried to hire Steve Lavin
I know JeremyH if he says it one more time I might have to throw something at my tv.
Oh, yeah, add Lavin to the media idiot list.
Had just tuned the game in and didn’t know it was Lavin. Jeez, no wonder! Maybe someone should call him “Linda” rather than “Steve”!
how about a site that rate’s sportwriters, using a “digg”-like rating system. then we can just ignore the idiots until they get better, *cough* accurate.
free throws, dammit!
told ya’ll about Big 10 officials and traveling…
we need to stop the bleeding
we need sense and different officials… sense WAY first
no, different officials first
guys, the way we’re playing, there should be NO griping about the refs…
we have a nice front line, but maybe the rebounding problem is that our frontline is not physical or quick.
1 - Costner, um yea.
2 - McCauley, physical but not in any dominant sense, mid-range ACC player
3 - Horner, um yea again.
4 - Hickson, sure, but he’s still very green.
I’m only saying this because I’m beginning to think our rebounding woes have not to do with fundamentals of rebounding but a reflection of the talent.
if they are going to let guys shove off to set screens for Neitzel all day, we’re through
we need to grow a pair and get tough. stop bitching about officials… we need to have some guards step up and get the ball down low, and we need to hit some shots over their zone so they come out of it
So far, I agree, it’s not officiating. Very sloppy!
DT44– I’ve experienced years of Big 10 officiating… check out their non-conference record over the last 6… it is no coincidence… they win, or get blown out- end of story
nice block Grant!
we are getting owned b/c of our lack of toughness down low, we are playing terrible defense, and we never box out
is Michigan St. really this much better than us?
FELLS IS AN IDIOT
just saying–playing like this, no officials can save you
down 20… we only have 9 pts with 5 minutes to go in the half. Boy we are rattled.
Tracy Smith —> GET UP!
(1) We’re just plain sucking the Big Suck tonight.
(2) The officiating is weird. It’s like they want to let the game be physical but they call random fouls just to remind everyone they are still there.
against the visitors… welcome to the Big 10 (I loved it when I was at Wisconsin)
is this why Fergie transferred? something about physical style of play at Pitt.
I have NEVER been more upset at the team as a whole as I am tonight. It seems that we are all drunk or we just gave up playing any kind of competative offense. The way we are playing, we deserve to get blown-out which will probably happen.
GREAT news: it can’t get any worse tonight.
I cannot understand the fixation on officiating–our problem here is clearly ourselves. Right now we don’t deserve any calls.
I cannot understand the fixation on officiating–our problem here is clearly ourselves. Right now we don’t deserve any calls.
maybe:
first non-neutral road game as a team, and we are getting rattled like nothing else.
maybe:
they are worn down from the tournment and travel.
I think my hope to get it within 10 before half has been dashed.
————————————————————————-
sorry–heavy finger there!
ok so ‘————–’ sans single quotes does big and bold, check.
Let’s go ahead and put a fork in this one…
They gonna make more shots than we could attempt. Off. rebounding sucks.
Lowe is going to have to earn his salary in this one
I stand corrected.
I don’t care if we played 3 games in 4 days. This is not a very good basketball TEAM. We have some nice individual players, but no point guard and no shooting guard. Several athletic wings and some nice post players.
We will meet Grant’s 4 loss quota before 12/31.
I feel like i’m watching the NC State - Maryland football game. I feel dead inside.
Well at least I didn’t think we were gonna win this game so I’m not crying - but seriously 16 points that just sucks.
anyone want to take a shot at explaining this mess?
ditto Dogbreath. The coolaide has worn off.
‘Gavin wTF!!!!!’
21 pts down. That’s what happens you think defense is optional
all my fears about this team are currently being confirmed. what the heck?!
Honestly I thought we’d lose 80-65 before the game. It would be an improvement at this point if I end up correct.
I look at it this way, MSU can’t play any better and State can’t play any worse. So if State can just get it straightened out at the half maybe we can lose by a respectable margin.
finally…This game reminds me of (1) the St. Johns game from a couple of years ago and (2) the Cincy game from last year, with one glaring difference, SJU/Cincy played like crap too.
I never understood the lofty expectations that so many folks had for this team going back to the summer. Just didn’t see the perimeter essentials on our roster.
To be true, Izzo’s gameplan was spot on. Pack it in, eliminate the inside, force us to take 3s. Cause we obviously can’t hit em
I recommend:
MAGIC JOHNSON PRESENTS: The Fundamentals of Basketball; Comprehensive
*sigh*
AMEN BILAS, AMEN
offense is stagnant.
we have trouble against zone defense.
hickson can’t pass out of a double team.
players standing around.
Mich st. is getting all the rolls.
Ball movement is slow.
Not hustling back on defense.
Dogbreath: don’t get depressed and put down the dirty koolaid.
Thud.
What was that thread regarding Fells??? If you can’t score, you can’t win. I just don’t see any energy tonight.
I’m seriously contemplating not watching the second half. I’ll probably end up torturing myself with it anyways but this is absolutely pathetic. It’s not good to be completely embarrassed on national TV.
Seriously though, MSU is just this good. We’re definitely playing half-assed, but MSU really is fcuking good.
how about instead of forcing it in to hickson we start posting big ben a little more b/c if they collapse on him he will kill them, also why can’t we post up two guys in parallel more, if they play ben one on one he will either beat the man or kill you with the pass and if they double on hickson he will draw a foul we have had 4 men on the perimeter way too much tonight, big ben cannot simply cannot play from that far out
We’re terrible. It’s that simple. It’s gonna be a long season when we get destroyed by good teams and have trouble with mediocre ones.
Wulfpack: I think this has to play into it. You see a subpar NBA team beat a better NBA team, when the game is after a long road-trip for the better team. The only problem I have with this is the game was on Sunday, not like it was yesterday.
Tonight this team is showing the same weak points in previous games that they somehow overcame. Turnovers, no boxing out on the boards, poor decisions, slow on defense and can’t shoot. That won’t work against teams with talent especially at guard. Still some time to fix some of these items but the guard play needed to compete with big boys in the ACC isn’t on this roster.
Duke played in Hawaii on Mon, Tues Wed. playe at home on Sunday and Tuesday. How tired did they look last night
Well, just an awful half. I think one of things that has been lost in our season thus far is how rarely we get easy baskets on fast breaks. We aren’t really putting a lot of points on the board either.
Oh well, I was hoping we’d be playing harder. The team is definitely not following Sidney’s No. 1 rule - “Have fun!”
If you want to bring out excuses, you can say that we played 3 games in 4 days, had an emotional win Sunday and they’re back at it against a fresher, better-rested team. You can also bring up the fact that this is the first time the team has been in hostile territory (this ignores the fact that 4 of our starters were in plenty of hostile environments last year.)
That was the worst half of basketball I think I have seen us play since the Les Robinson days. Maybe something to the fatigue factor…who knows….but that was pathetic in every way. Adding insult to injury….MSU has been red hot. They got every roll, and every call their way. Lowe needs to give the team an ass chewing in the locker room. If this continues he should just clear the bench and let the other players give it a shot. There is no way it could be any worse with them in.
Had Fells not exploded against Nova we would have been toast. He really is the X factor. I just want to see some energy out there in the 2nd half. This team needs an attitude and we only seem to have it in select games. It should piss you off to give away a rebound for an easy score.
Looks like offense joined defense and missed the plane for this road trip. This is one horrible mess - an embarrassment they won’t soon live down. I hope they get one heck of a motivational speech at half that includes boxing out, not turning the ball over, penetrating the zone and passing the friggin ball when you get double teamed. And can we please make some free throws for crying out loud. I see a lot of track practices in this squad’s future.
Embarrasing effort on our part.
Why do we turn and run to the other goal as soon as we release a 3 pointer? It costs us a ton of rebounds.
It seems like we have one of these games every year, the whole not scoring twenty before halftime games.
Also, we have no shooters, we all knew this before the season started.
Last:
I beg, I beg, PLEASE stop blaming officials. It should be clear to anyone with bball IQ that officiating is the least of our problems. If the officiating is so bad in this game, go look at the free throw stats.
that is what im saying wulf, you look at duke slapping the floor and diving after loose balls, just playing their tails off, this team isn’t tough and looks lazy out there, if the shots aren’t falling they just aren’t sometimes, but tonight we are getting out-worked and look shell-shocked like we do not even know how to compete
I think this game is very similar to the GW game from two seasons ago, only we are GW. Remember, GW went on to have a very successful season after the loss.
if we have no shooters and we know it, we should stop retreating like packster pointed out and crash the living hell out of the boards
Are you guys still convinced that Hickson is “one and done”? Frankly, I haven’t seen it in this game or any other.
Its a shame to have to see Gavin Grant eat his words so early in the season.
Oh, one tiny spark of hope - BC decided to start playing. Maybe it’ll be contagious.
I was not blaming officials for this mess. Getting calls your way is just luck sometimes and we certainly didn’t have any of it so far tonight. Someone said it right. We should post up McCauley and have him dish to Hickson or Costner. It looks like we just have no plan on offense except to dump it down to Hickson and see if he can get it in or draw a foul.
Not like last season, there is no leader on the court. That’s why our offense sucks so bad. Let’s see what Sid can do during the half.
When you let a team as talented as MichSt get on a roll, it’s amazing what they can do. Confidence and lack of pressure can make a seemingly big hack look like Tim Duncan. On one hand, Costner’s softness around the basket drives me crazy, but I guess we wouldn’t have any points without him. It’s like Fells, McCauley, and Grant have never played in a big time atmosphere. Very much like the UMd football game with a national audience. To top off humiliation week, everyone must run through their neighborhoods nekkid after the game.
I’m with you cornell. Our ‘dominant’ frontcourt could really help us out by grabbing a few rebounds. Hell, a few DEFENSIVE boards would be nice.
Hickson is a raw talent. It would serve him well to stay another year. He really needs to learn that sometimes it is important to kick the ball out when a team collapses on you AND defense is more than playing fly swatter. Of course the NBA is about potential not spit and polish which is why the product struggling in many markets.
This “team” looks BAD. No defense. I will laugh out loud at anyone mentioning Costner going pro early. He has some points, but has no idea what defense is - GG isn’t much better. Our team purely cannot play defense. I don’t think it’s over, but we better start playing D - I’ll rather see Ferg and T. Smith if we’re going to lose by 30. Also, did anyone see when Degand had the open 3 with noone w/in 5 feet, and he didn’t shoot??? He finally shot one and made it… Shoot the ball! Same with Fells. Missed his first shot - won’t take another…..I don’t know…somebody better light a big ass fire!!!!!!
Need a guard fast - someone who can take charge and settle down the team when they get knocked upside the head.
I don’t think we have come out in the first half with intensity in a single game this year. I want this team to play with the same enthusiasm and scrappiness that UNO showed when they beat us.
I would somehow use turnover and rebounding stats in a BCS-like formula to determine laps in the track practice, win or lose.
I saw the Degand dish when he was wide open - unacceptable when we desperately needed offense.
Degand ended the half with a three.
We’ve been outscored 19 to 1 on second chance points. That’s all in the hustle.
costner needs to take it right at suton like he is doing, he is a huge quickness mismatch
pound inside, rack up fouls on MS
We just haven’t looked sharp at all this year. It’s like we don’t have any plan on offense, and we just don’t feel like playing defense. I just hope we score more points than we lose by.
What happened to costner? He looks so lazy. Can he go pro like this?
Hickson has to fight for that position first. He’s been getting the ball 12 ft away.
Costner-box out or sit.
MSU has scored all 5 times down the court in the second half. Half time didn’t help a bit.
Costner was lazy last year
It’s like a massive car wreck…I know it’s going to be gruesome but I look anyway.
Wow. Did I tune into the Maryland football game?
how good is Julius Mays?
Looks like MSU is the 18 wheeler going 90 mph and State is the bug.
What’s the last thing that goes through the bugs mind?
I’m ready to see Tracy Smith, hell ANYONE who will freaking hustle.
This is the most uninspired performance I can remember from a Wolfpack basketball team in some time. National television. Playing a very good ranked opponent with a strong tradition. And we don’t even show up. What a waste.
highonlowe: isn’t that the point of a deep bench?
if i was lowe id start tearing my kids apart, this is ridiculous, there were maybe like 3-4 solid sets and now we are lazy yet again, these guys are not that tired, they condition year round and are in ridiculous shape, this is pure lack of heart and laziness, they simply look like they had no confidence or swagger from the start, if you are going into hostile territory you have to step it up, this is absurd
Wulfpack: What does this “not show up” mean exactly?
Anyone remember the UCLA / Memphis State NCAA championship game where Walton hit 21 / 22 from the floor. The whole Michigan State team is playing like that tonight. How is it that we seem to always be on the losing of these fairy tale performances?
What’s lowe thinking? or has he already quit?
Sidney should have made them watch the speech. They have given up. Fells is barely walking up the floor on offense.
COME ON, EVERBODY!!! Sing it with me…
I LOVE BEING AN NC STATE FAN, WE ARE THE BEST, BLAH, BLah, blah!!!
Agree with you JH. Take these slack asses out.
We shot ourselves out of the game early on. After Costner got the first bucket, we just started taking quick threes and let MSU get on a run.
We don’t have as much talent as we hoped.
The real test of this team will be how long does it take Lowe to put together a quality team.
Duke played in Hawaii on Mon, Tues Wed. playe at home on Sunday and Tuesday. How tired did they look last night
Home games and not having to travel make it easier to rest and practice. Duke had a week home, after Maui. We had a day home after the OSC.
We really miss Atsur’s leadership, dependable jumper, and steady hand.
“not show up”
Not even attempting to box out.
Not allowing your man to beat you.
Not challenging your opponent’s shots.
Not running an offense.
Not giving up your body for the good of the team.
Not playing like a proud Wolfpack team.
Just once, I wish “Wait ’til next season!” would be true for Pack fans.
You can’t blame it on the players and lord knows we can’t blame it on the coach in Raleigh, where the hell is Lee.
Whoa, got it down to 24.
We couldn’t get position inside b/c they packed it in, we couldn’t resist the threes, and we couldn’t hit the threes. They kept scoring and we started sagging head and dragging our feet.
FINALLY SOME LIFE
Costner is making Suppan look like some sort of “white magic”
Lost to UNO at home. Humiliated by MSU on national TV. Well done Sid and your boys.
WOW.
This has turned out to be one of those patented Herb Sendek early season non-conference games ala Providence, Tulane, Fresno State, Ohio State (twice), etc…
That is the worst thing I could ever say about a team “effort.” Thought we were past those days, but, alas…
Guys looked flat and partied out from the Old Spice, and it just went terribly down hill from there…
I can’t believe I am looking forward to UNC’s game now…
is Nietzel really this good? he’s like a young Jason Williams.
MSU is just in the zone.
Did they just compare Izzo to V? When we’re the opponent? wtf…
iirc, nietzel is a pre-season all-american
guys i hate to do this but I am turning the tv off.
Case in point: Costner not lying that guy out on the open layup. That is “not showing up”. No pride. No emotion.
take
costner
out
thank god T. Smith is finally coming in, and horner wants to rebound
Whatdayamean turn it off? we just cut it to 29.
This is miserable. I am thoroughly dissappointed in every aspect of this group of players and even more with the coaches.
Maybe at least we can prevent them from doubling our score.
There’s that seven deep stuff again. We are deeper than that but it sure as hell doesn’t show.
Nice D. What a joke.
how would you guys rate Lowe as a strategist? as a motivator?
least hickson and horner got the memo
Let’s win the second half!
with Horner’s stroke an “glueness” he should get 30 minutes a game.
Yes, JH, Neitzel IS this good.
Costner just saw the subs on the sideline and immediatley jacked a three!
This is the most piss poor effort I have ever seen.
Wufpack and one00…concur
Take Costner out - of the starting lineup!!!!!!!!!
Look at it this way. At least now our expectations should drop to nothing, and maybe we can have the “us against the world” complex.
if you are a good coach it will show in coachable players, if costner is not going to respond then do something that will make him respond like benching him for a long time, if he wants to play he’ll show it when he gets off the bench, it shows right now that horner wants to play and has some desire, he is going after loose balls and rebounds
damnnation - I had to watch the first half at a pizza joint with at guy wearing a UNC sweat shirt not far from me.
We just look like we’ve don’t care on defense.
One ray of hope it sure seems like we are getting more calls. Maybe we can foul a bunch of them out.
they’ve got 20 min’s before I turn it to Pushing Up Daises. Maybe the PieMan can bring this team back from the dead.
god i luv horner, kid is playin with no fear now
bringing suton in against our bench let’s see if they can defend him
I’ll be happy if the final is a respectable loss.
they are #13.
Its a big test, and we aren’t up to it . . . at least tonight.
and again…. horner knows how to do a box out
holy shit, horner boxed someone out
———————————————
^^^watch closely Costner, Fells, Grant, Degand, Hickson. he watched the Magic Johnson Video!
I am ok with a loss as long as these kids fight for a win… cornellpackfan, I agree with you. Costner should be benched for a long time. This team should be better off without him.
NO TACO FOR YOU!!
well - at least not yet
What we see tonight is a young, tired team play in their first road game, in a very hostile environment, against a very good, veteran team - and they are having a great night and we are having an awful night.
I’m not making excuses, because this is a freaking embarrassment no doubt. But these types of things occasionally happen and there are a lot of factors that lead to it here. It doesn’t mean the rest of the season will be a disappointment. That is, unless you were one of those people who seriously thought this was a Final Four caliber team.
A got a t-shirt:
“We beat the crap out of NC State and all I got was this lousy taco”
I am honestly worried about our chances of making it to the NCAA’s this year. The loss to UNO and this blow out don’t help our NCAA resume at all.
suton is slow, and has been all game, finally someone (T. Smith) tried a post game on him, if costner played at all tonight he wouldve had suton benched for foul trouble…
That Marist win is looking pretty good right about now.
Agree with you tvp1, but its still no excuse to hang your head early and half ass it the rest of the way.
I can’t believe I’m actually glad I was stuck in Harrelson taking a math exam for the first half… never would’ve thought I’d be glad to miss ‘Pack basketball… but I only get to see half the embarrassment
this is by far the worst game i have ever seen. herbie bird couldnt even pull off such an atrocious performance. how can we so unprepared and unready to play? the anouncers are saying we’re tired. bullshit. we are playing the same way we have all year against the best team we have played all year. cant shoot, cant play defense, cant rebound, and cant keep from turning the ball over. if we dont have drastic changes, and soon, we will be the laughing stock of the league, especially after so much hype.
I hope every HS basketball player in the nation, all have lots of homework tonight. Don’t want nobody watching this crapola.
Don’t forget, “Best frontline in the nation”, so at least we are still making liars out of the talking heads.